Wirklichkeit

[Penelope]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
Our/my life on Earth is an Illusion, made by myself, my thoughts, which are not true. There is no real, true me, separeted from others.

What are you looking for at LU?
Support to better understand and realize what I really am and the world is.
My thoughts would not let me see this. I need some guidance. Loosing my fear.
Getting into the direction of Love and Light and Freedom.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Guidance on my way. Someone who is able to See where I am Right now and where I struggle. I Need to learn to be in Stillness, in Peace. I have a lot of questions. I Need to know how to overcome my fear.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
Just Reading a lot about it and currently practising with A course in miracles.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
11

[Anastacia42]

My name is Stacy and I can be your guide, if you would like.

I also did ACIM years ago. It may have helped me with concepts, but that's just thinking, not Direct Experience.

One thing that is helpful is to come to this forum
& post every day. Sometimes the site goes down. It will be back. Just come back later.

Yes, if once in a while you must post later, please post a note telling me when you will return.

If you haven't already read the disclaimer, please read it now and just confirm to me that you have read it. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2/

Also please read “Liberation Unleashed is not …” in the FAQ’s of LU. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041

Some housekeeping guidelines:

1. Post at least once a day, or every second day. If you need more time, or are unable to post for several days, just write a quick post on your thread to let me know please.

2. There is no one judging answers given, so please be 100% honest in your answers and inquiry.

3. This exploration is based on actual experience (AE) - smell, taste, sound, sensation, color and observed thoughts. Long-winded analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress. This is not a self-improvement process. There is no ‘self’ to improve.

4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies, rituals, practices, books/reading and so on for the remainder of this investigation. Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily meditation practice, it is fine to continue that but is not necessary for this exploration.

Technology is not perfect and sometimes there is a glitch which can wipe out your responses. It is advisable that you copy and paste questions asked into Word, answer them there and then copy and paste them to your thread. Always save a copy of what you have done, it will save time in the long run!

To begin with, so that we both become aware of what your expectations are about this exploration. In your own words (not from actual experience, but just honest answers), could you please answer the 4 following questions:

How will life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?
What is missing?

Throughout this exploration I would like you to answer all questions that I have written in blue text. Please answer all questions even if I miss using the blue text.

Please answer questions individually, remembering to use the quote function to highlight the question being answered.

Below is a link to the video with instructions on using the Quote Function. Please watch it. Use the PREVIEW button to make sure your text looks right before you hit "SUBMIT."

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=660

What would you like for me to call you? What time zone are you in, please?


Loving,

[Penelope]

What would you like for me to call you? What time zone are you in, please?

Please call me Ilse. The time zone is: Berlin/Germany GMT or UTC +1

[Penelope]

How will life change?

I have no idea

[Penelope]

How will you change?

I have no idea. Will I change? My thoughts maybe.

[Penelope]

What will be different?

I do not know.

[Penelope]

What is missing?

Are you asking what is missing right now? Or what will be missing?
I am missing peace.

[Anastacia42]

Hi Ilse,

Use Google translate if you need it.

It's true we don't know how anything will change.

Now what comes up when reading that there is no separate self, never has been, and never will be? That the whole thing was a made up story that we believed.


Loving

[Penelope]

Now what comes up when reading that there is no separate self, never has been, and never will be? That the whole thing was a made up story that we believed.

I am confused, dont know what to say, I can imagine, perhaps, what it means. But I am here in this world and I see all the others on this earth, everyone living their own life.
It sounds like life on another planet. What do you think?

And what is the „whole thing“ story we believed?

[Anastacia42]

It's okay to be confused.

And what is the „whole thing“ story we believed?

The story of a separate "self."

This is how to LOOK for no self in the exercises - we call them "pointers' - that we will be doing here:

Colored Socks

There is a big difference between knowing that there is nothing to give up and seeing that there is nothing to give up.

Here is an example to illustrate the difference:

If I ask you what color socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to come up with an answer:

• You can think about it, you can think back to this morning and try to remember putting your socks on, and you can probably tell me what color you think they are.

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what color they actually are!

Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

For the purpose of seeing this "no self" idea, it is very important that you are clear about this difference.

Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that

We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment-to-moment experience. We are only interested in your Direct Experience in the moment..

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.

Loving

[Penelope]

Colored Socks

There is a big difference between knowing that there is nothing to give up and seeing that there is nothing to give up.

Here is an example to illustrate the difference:

If I ask you what color socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to come up with an answer:

• You can think about it, you can think back to this morning and try to remember putting your socks on, and you can probably tell me what color you think they are.

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what color they actually are!

Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

For the purpose of seeing this "no self" idea, it is very important that you are clear about this difference.

Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that

We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment-to-moment experience. We are only interested in your Direct Experience in the moment..

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.

Dear Stacy,
Thank you for this, it was quite a lot to digest.
At first I liked the idea and the comparison.
I agree that I can only be certain about something, if I look at it.
I understand what you are telling me, but as you said as well, I am not quite sure, if I can see correctly, i.e. being and staying in the present moment and not drifting into thinking an judging like: I dont like coloured socks. – which is in the present moment as well, because its a feeling.
So it belongs to the present moment.?! - Or is it drifting into thoughts?

How does this help to understand this "no self" idea.? Because it is just a knowledge for me until now?
But how will I ever see and know about it like coloured socks?

with love,
Ilse

[Anastacia42]

Hi Ilse,

I'm about to give you a series of pointers, one at a time, that will help you see this for yourself. At some point, we cannot predict when, you may feel a shift in perception. It may happen all at once or gradually. It may hit like a ton of bricks or it may be subtle.

"Enlightenment is an accident. Meditation makes you accident prone."

Sunryu Suzuki

These pointers are meditations. You might also read "Gateless Gatecrashers" and/or "Liberation Unleashed." Find GG in Resources, Books here on this site.


Direct Experience - Labeling Daily Activities

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply color/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists exactly like the one above.

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Refer to the green list of Actual/Direct Experience in the prior post if that helps. Those are the only items any experience can be.

Loving,

[Penelope]

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Dear Stacy,

Thank you for the detailed clarification. I need this defenitely.
And thank you for pointing out to the list of books - I downloaded the Gateless Gatecrashers and started to read.
But first I followed your advice of labeling my daily activities. When I read your mail, I was just looking out of my window and started with watching the snow falling.

Seeing the snowflakes drifting
smelling just nothing
feeling the warmth from the heating in my room
tasting nothing
Hearing nothing except the noise in my ears (tinnitus)
Thoughts about snow drifting

Luckily I saw my computer when I went to have food and I remembered.
So I did it, when I had my noodles for supper.

Seeing The plate, Whitish, small, round simply= image/color
Smelling the dish, cheese and garlic simply= smell
Feeling the warmth of the plate and the food , simply = sensation
Tasting the noodles, different sensations on my tongue, simply = taste
Hearing the fork scratching the plate , simply = sound
Thoughts about food and me doing this exercise, simply = thought

and Stacy, it was the first time, that I did not read or watch TV during dinner.
And I knew for seconds, that I managed to do it right, because just for a second now and then,
I felt joy. But mostly it was like a boring piece of homework.
It is a challenge for me which I tend to forget, as I am not at all used to it.

I think it has to be a special time like meditation. I forget to integrate it into my daily ativities, thinking, there is no time for this.

But again I did it with peeling a mandarin
When I am really really in this moment of seeing, smelling, feeling, tasting, hearing, how the skin separates from the flesh, the very soft noise, the scent rises, the juice runs over my fingers, the flavour of the fruit - when I really manage to stay in this moment, miraculously a great joy is there, I am laughing, but it does’nt last long because it is disturbed by a thought.

So I am thinking, I should do it more often, but it is like finding the time for meditation, which is hard for me as well. But I want it. Why is there so much resistance inside. It makes me sad. As if there is another self keeping me from doing it. But still there is some other part, reminding me in between other activities to watch it following your advice. But it needs more strength. Please do not give up to give your pointers. Even if it is the same one for a long time. I need it.

Then I started to read the first story in the Gateless Gatecrashers. And ended up very frustrated and even hopeless
I felt so stupid reading this communication compared to the two who had it. And had the desperate feeling that I would never understand what it is all about.
Well, I have recovered and am determined to continue. In the meantime, I even felt bad and guilty about the course in miracles because I'm now looking into a different direction, but that too has passed. I just want to know the truth.
And I am more than willing to follow your pointers and to see my resistance as well.

Dear Stacy, I am very grateful to you.
with love,
Ilse

[Anastacia42]

Thank you, Ilse.

I just want to know the truth.

And you will.

I appreciate all of your sharing but notice that those are thoughts and we are ignoring thoughts. Go back and read colored socks again.

I'm afraid I have to ask you to redo the exercise and follow the instructions more precisely.

The point is that everything on the left is thinking and we are ignoring it and everything on the right is Direct Experience Doing it the way you did you miss that.

Please try again.

Loving,

[Penelope]

I'm afraid I have to ask you to redo the exercise and follow the instructions more precisely.

The point is that everything on the left is thinking and we are ignoring it and everything on the right is Direct Experience Doing it the way you did you miss that.

I am afraid, I do not understand your pointers to that

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what color they actually are!
Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

So I try again, but perhaps there is another hint you can give me, please.

In my experience, when I did this exercise with peeling my mandarin, it was just the actual sensory experience with no thinking. What is it that I do not understand?
I checked your text with google tanslate, thinking that I misinterpreted something, but even then I did not grasp it.
I really feel stupid.

Thanks for your patience.

Ilse