Liberation lost and found

[SarahLuna]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
That there is not a separate, fixed 'person' somewhere within 'my' body-mind. I have tried to find one, and find only a body that changes, that 'I' have limited control over, along with emotions, sensations and thoughts that arise and leave, but that often feel so real and so much linked to 'me' at the time they are experienced.

What are you looking for at LU?
A way to explore important questions and do self-inquiry with others, as I notice I get stuck when I am alone doing this work. To be pointed in the right direction, so as to avoid getting lost. Ultimately I am looking for a direct experience of liberation, for a 'seeing' that can't be unseen, and a knowing that I can't somehow deny.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
To be asked stimulating questions that I may not have thought of myself and to be met somehow in my responses to them. For the inquiry process to be held in the co-creation, and to be inspired to continue when I am in a place of doubt.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
I spent some time exploring shamanic meditation , before coming across non-duality, which I think is actually at the heart of true, grounded and Earth-based shamanism. I began seeing an all too human side of my shamanic meditation teachers after working with them for some time, noticing their biases and prejudices, favouritism towards some students, their spiritual egos and their clinging to the identity of 'teacher' and 'spiritual person', despite rhetoric about letting go and trusting only their 'enlightened guides'. This new noticing felt uncomfortable, and yet at first, I felt resistant to moving on, as a child-like part of me saw them as mother-figures and wanted to keep the security and support of their community. This child-like part of me wanted to stay small and to always see them as better than me so I could rest in their presence without having to do any hard work.

As some repressed anger towards the teachers and my mother was released, I gained the courage to step away from the teachers, and, for the past year and three months, I have been exploring non-duality, mostly online, as well as working on my own emotions, shadow and repressions. I now see myself as on a 'solitary path', as Adyashanti puts it, but I know that whilst I will never again be part of only one group and will never again totally adopt one set of beliefs and ideas, I benefit greatly from interaction with others interested in non-duality. For this reason, I have attended a face to face retreat facilitated by Rupert Spira (in February), and have booked more in-person retreats this year, with Angelo Dillulio, Jacqui O'Keefe and Louise Kay. I also value attending live online events.

Somehow, the non-duality bug seems to have bitten me, and I find myself bizarrely obsessed, without understanding why. Attending online Satsangs and listening to YouTube videos now takes up a lot of my time. I have attempted self-inquiry alone, but I find I get stuck, and thoughts about just giving up arise. I meditate as part of online events I attend but don't have a regular practice of meditating on the breath or focusing on peace: I prefer to walk in nature or even do conscious free dancing. I find that thoughts just arise when I meditate and it doesn't feel the right path for me.

For the last year or so, a range of intense emotions have been arising frequently, including sadness, anxiety, grief, anger, despair, and hints of fear, shame and rage. I work with them using Louise Kay's approach of meeting them as sensations and energies in the body, with awareness, when I can, though I notice that thoughts attached to the emotions can lead me astray at times. Sometimes I believe my thoughts, till I talk to someone who makes me realise that I could question them. I have regular sessions in which I am facilitated in the Kiloby Inquiries, which links the body and mind, which I value a great deal. I now feel its time for me to focus more on inquiry.

I have been aware of Liberation Unleashed for some time and have been meaning to join but have, for some reason, always put this off. Alina mentioned your work today in a KI session and I decided to fill in an application as soon as possible. I am very willing to question any and all beliefs about myself, but I also sense some fear around this. I hope I can move beyond this fear.

I understand, theoretically, that I am not a separate self, but I am very keen to access a direct knowing of this.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self? 10

[Anastacia42]

Hi,

My name is Stacy and I can be your guide, if you would like.

One thing I want to make very clear up front is that with me, you must post every day. If you know yourself and your schedule are such that you cannot do this, tell me, "no," and someone else can guide you, please.

Yes, if once in a while you must post later, please post a note telling me when you will return.

If you know yourself to be a skeptical person, prone to doubt, I may not be the best guide for you. I never had any doubt. I can connect you with one of our other guides who did & who can guide you better than I.

If you haven't already read the disclaimer, please read it now and just confirm to me that you have read it. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2/

Also please read “Liberation Unleashed is not …” in the FAQ’s of LU. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041

Some housekeeping guidelines:

1. Post at least once a day, or every second day. If you need more time, or are unable to post for several days, just write a quick post on your thread to let me know please.

2. There is no one judging answers given, so please be 100% honest in your answers and inquiry.

3. This exploration is based on actual experience (AE) - smell, taste, sound, sensation, color and observed thoughts. Long-winded analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress. This is not a self-improvement process. There is no ‘self’ to improve.

4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies, rituals, practices, books/reading and so on for the remainder of this investigation. Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily meditation practice, it is fine to continue that but is not necessary for this exploration.

Technology is not perfect and sometimes there is a glitch which can wipe out your responses. It is advisable that you copy and paste questions asked into Word, answer them there and then copy and paste them to your thread. Always save a copy of what you have done, it will save time in the long run!

To begin with, so that we both become aware of what your expectations are about this exploration. In your own words (not from actual experience, but just honest answers), could you please answer the 4 following questions:

How will life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?
What is missing?

Throughout this exploration I would like you to answer all questions that I have written in blue text. Please answer all questions even if I miss using the blue text.

Please answer questions individually, remembering to use the quote function to highlight the question being answered.

Below is a link to the video with instructions on using the Quote Function. Please watch it. Use the PREVIEW button to make sure your text looks right before you hit "SUBMIT."

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=660

What would you like for me to call you? What time zone are you in, please?


Loving,

[SarahLuna]

Hi Stacy.
Thanks so much for responding! I’m happy to post each day unless I am travelling, in which case I will let you know. I have to use my phone so may be limited in terms of using the quote function. I have read the disclaimer. And the details of what liberation unleashed is not. I don’t have a daily meditation practice.

You can call me Sarah. I am in UK (BST)

How will life change?
I will know, directly, what I am and what is real.

How will you change?
I don’t know in advance. In the 1 1/2 years I have so far been interested in non-duality, I have noticed that I have let go somewhat. I have become less prone to attempt to control life and less emotionally reactive to difficulties.

What will be different?
As I will have a different experience of the world, I will have a different understanding of life. This could have an impact on a number of areas of my life.

What is missing?
My own clear seeing. Everything else seems complete and whole as far as I am aware.

[Anastacia42]

Hi Sarah,

I usually do these on my phone and the Quote function is easy.

Please use it. Block, click on Quote, that's about it.

Your expectations are fairly reasonable.

What comes up when is read that there is no self, never has been and never will be? That it is all a made-up story?

Much love,

[SarahLuna]

What comes up when is read that there is no self, never has been and never will be? That it is all a made-up story?

Well, the first thing that comes up is that I wonder who made it all up! So I am still presuming some sort of self exists….
Then thoughts come up about stuff I have learnt: that the self is endlessly born into being via thoughts, so I wonder where all these thoughts come from. Then a thought arises about the left brain.

I tried to use the quote function here. Hope it worked!

[Anastacia42]

Yes, You quoted perfectly.

This is how to LOOK for no self in the exercises - we call them "pointers' - that we will be doing here:

Colored Socks

There is a big difference between knowing that there is nothing to give up and seeing that there is nothing to give up.

Here is an example to illustrate the difference:

If I ask you what color socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to come up with an answer:

• You can think about it, you can think back to this morning and try to remember putting your socks on, and you can probably tell me what color you think they are.

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what color they actually are!

Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

For the purpose of seeing this "no self" idea, it is very important that you are clear about this difference.

Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that

We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment-to-moment experience. We are only interested in your Direct Experience in the moment..

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.


Loving,

[SarahLuna]

This makes absolute sense to me. I can’t know exactly what chocolate tastes like by reading several books on it, but I can know by tasting chocolate for myself. This is what I really want. I understand the theory of no self but I don’t feel I have the first-hand experience.

[Anastacia42]

Okay, now try this:

Direct Experience - Labeling Daily Activities

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply color/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists exactly like the one above.

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Refer to the green list of Actual/Direct Experience in the prior post if that helps. Those are the only items any experience can be.

Loving,

[SarahLuna]

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Sitting writing this message:

Looking at the screen, simply = image/colour
Typing out this message, simply = sound (tapping)
Fingers on phone, pressing letters, simply = sensation
Wondering what else I will use as an example, simply = thought.

I will post more later!

[Anastacia42]

Those are correct, except the note about tapping. "Tapping" is a label, not Direct Experience.

I'm tempted to give you the next pointer, but you seemed to want a little more practice with this one.

Much love,

[SarahLuna]

Ah yes, I see that about tapping the keys on the phone now, I’m actually simply feeling sensation in my finger as it moves.
I’m happy to try using this pointer for the rest of the day.

Looking out the window:

Seeing a bird on the feeders, simply = image/colour
Hearing my husband talk to our cat, simply= sound
Noticing how my feet feel on the floor, simply = sensation
Wondering if I should go for a walk, simply = thought


Using my oil burner:
Lighting the candle, simply = image colour
Smelling the candle, simply = smell
Deciding if I should add more essential oil, simply = thought
Smelling the essential oil heating, simply = smell
Noticing tension in my shoulder, simply = sensation.

[SarahLuna]

Going for a walk:

Watching a heron flying by, simply = image/colour.
Hearing my footsteps, simply = sound.
Apparently noticing I feel sad, simply = thought.
Finding tightness in chest associated with ‘sadness’, simply = sensation.
Smelling seaweed, simply = smell.
Hearing a sheep bleeting, simply = sound.
Looking at the road ahead, simply = image/colour.
Wondering why I am sad, simply = thought.
Hearing a crow, simply = sound
Feeling wind on my bare hands, simply = sensation.

[Anastacia42]

Good. This helps you focus only on Direct Experience.

Now try this:

u]Mind Labeling Experience[/u]

Here is an exercise which examines the way in which the mind labels experience - it takes about 20 minutes and you will need a pen a paper.

This exercise is broken into 10 minute lots. For each 10 minute period pay attention to any bodily sensation i.e. is there any tightening, or any relaxing?

For the first ten minutes write down what you are experiencing right now using the word “I”.

For example:

I am sitting on a chair,
I am hearing a clock ticking,
I am looking at a computer screen,
I am feeling hungry.

Get right to the point, no past or future fantasy, just a plain description of your experience right here and now.

Then for the next ten minutes continue writing down what you are experiencing but this time without using the word “I”. Just describe the experience as it is happening using verbs.

For example:

Sitting on a chair,
typing,
breathing,
blinking,
hearing the clock.

(Again, watch what is happening in the body.)

At the end of the twenty minutes compare the two ways in which the experience was labelled and answer the following four questions:

1. Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?

2. What is here without labels?

3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?

4. Did you notice any differences in the body?

Loving,

[SarahLuna]

1. Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?

The second is truer as the experience isn’t consciously chosen, it just arises.

2. What is here without labels?

The thought labels everything. The experience is happening. And there is a space that the happening occurs in.

3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?

I experience a rose on my table more intimately when I don’t label it and instead explore it with my fingers, smell it, let myself see it differently. But I notice I can revert back to habit.

4. Did you notice any differences in the body?

I felt more peaceful without using ‘I’. However, my neck stiffened and my head started hurting.

[Anastacia42]

Good morning,

I am not sure why your neck hurt. Was there some other thought there, also? One that was not true.

Let's look at these:

Here is how to distinguish truth from lies.

We often lie every day & don't realize it.

For example, the grocery clerk asks, "How are you?" You reply, "I'm fine." While, yes. there is a sense in which we are always fine, even in the middle of suffering, at that moment, you were grieving the death of your dog, you had a slight sore throat & you had a headache, but you didn't feel like sharing all of that with the grocery clerk, so you lied, "I'm fine."

Also, it matters none at all how "distant" the remembered lie is. Besides the fact that time itself is fictional, a kind if lie, as we recall the lie it becomes present in this moment, as if it were happening now. This brings the body Sensation that accompanies lying.

Lies can be intentional or unintentional, conscious or unconscious, even so automatic that we ourselves are fooled.

The story of a separate "self" is a lie.

This is the lie you came here to see through. Therefore, it is helpful to notice the body Sensation of lying as one of the tools for finding the truth of no self.

You want to be in touch with body Sensations & able to clearly express them in words. This will help.

Lies are usually felt in the heart or solar plexus as a contraction that we may label as tight, heavy or tense.

In contrast, truth is usually expansive. We may call it loose, light or relaxed.

First, can you remember a time when you lied to someone you loved?

Here we count anything, lies we think of as "big" or "small" that "matter" or don't "matter."

How are you? I'm fine. No, your knee hurts, but you don't feel like discussing it with the grocery clerk.

It's a lie. A seemingly "bigger" one will work better for this exercise.

Find the lie. I don't need the whole story, just a few key words to refer to it.

Then scan your body for any Sensation (DE or Direct Experience), particularly in the gut or maybe the heart. Check very closely.

What is found?

If you think the memory you used wasn't clear enough, find another one or lie to yourself right now, make something up.

1 + 1 = 14 is a lie.

I love eating worms is (probably) a lie.

Or call up a video of a lying politician & notice what Sensations arise as you listen.

I will give you a clue: it is not that peaceful Sensation you felt before when you omitted "I." (refers to an exercise I gave before this one)

Please report back with what body Sensations (not interpretations) you feel. Bodies can feel hot or cold, heavy or light, contraction or expansion, etc.

"Peaceful" is an interpretation of a body Sensation, not the Sensation itself, for example.

Do you see that?

Loving,