Andrew, lets get going

[Richard B.]

Come on in and lets get started. What are your expectations?

[Andrew]

To experience no self.

[Richard B.]

sure. lets start by looking at what is not you. What would you point at if asked to show "andrew"?

[Andrew]

First thanks for doing this with me, and it might take awhile.

Back to the matter at hand idk what I would point to I get that I am not my body or mind, that this is just professing ownership it would be kinda like pointing at a pencil.

[Richard B.]

Sure, it could take a while, or absolutely no time at all. Let go of that expectation, ok?

If you 're not your body or mind, and you get it, what is the "no self experience" you're looking for?

andrew, when you say "I am not my body or mind", who is the I you're referring to?

[Andrew]

The no self experience I am looking for would be to not have a sense of self feel that it is not there. Not just get it mentally when I can't find a self.
Who is the I referring to I guess the sense of self and/or maybe the feeling of the ego.

[Richard B.]

That "sense" of self is exactly what we are talking about. There is a sense of self, but that is all it is. That sense remains but you see through it as, ultimately, an illusion and mind created...not you.

So when asked to point to what "I" is, you're pointing to a mind created illusion?

Do you see that it is a sense and mind created? That if you were to search for a intrinsic piece of andrew that you could hold up and say, "Hah! Here i am!", it couldn't be found?

[Andrew]

Do you see that it is a sense and mind created?
Yea kinda, but it is still contolling the show so to speak.

[Richard B.]

Please don't send replies like "yea, kinda". Ok? If this is to work, there has to be honesty and real answers. andrew this requires you to get to the bottom of these questions that will come to you. Not half way. All the way through the gate, andrew, not looking at it.

Please review your last reply and expand it and explain how is the "I" controlling the show? By what process is this working?

[Andrew]

What I mean is like when the alarm goes off in the morning I wake up there is no "I" involved, and even when it comes to turning off the clock. The thought turn the alarm off pops in don't wake everyone one else up no "I" present. Than its let the dog out, go pee myself, get dress or whatever. The I self is very present I don't feel like getting out of bed and going pee, or I want to shower before letting the dog out and these choices at least seem to becoming from the I self.

[Richard B.]

Where do the thoughts come from and what controls them? Are you your thoughts?

[Andrew]

Am I my thoughts? No they are just thoughts. What controls the thoughts nothing really they just arise. If I am suppose to be focusing on one thing and get distracted or start thinking about something else. The thought comes in pay attention not really from anywhere, but then my attention goes back to whatever it was I was suppose to be focusing on. Thoughts can be focused to a degree like these questions I am answering right now. This is what I am thinking about. My mind wonders, but it keeps coming back to this subject. When I notice that it has wondered. Though it does not seem right to say that I noticed, idk how to explain that.

[Richard B.]

Do you agree: You are not your body. Not your brain. Not your mind. Not your thoughts.

Besides the mind created sense of you, what/ where is you?

[Andrew]

Yes I agree that I am not my mind, body, brain, or thoughts.
There is no me that I can see beside the mind created sense of me. When that sense of me is examined there is no me even in there. It is just a feeling, but the feeling seems to persist.

[Richard B.]

andrew sorry about the delayed answer.

the feeling does persist. it is not andrew though...just a feeling or sense. not andrew. it is mind created as all thoughts and ideas etc. are.

just a sense. not real.