Seeker

[Nitimak]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
That there is no person running the show. All is just happening. There is no entity whatsoever, however awareness alone exists. Which is impersonal, infinite and has no forms and shapes. We are That awareness only.

What are you looking for at LU?
To clearly "see" that there is no self and get liberated from the false "me". I need to clearly see that there is no "me" as a person and see my true nature as awareness which is impersonal and infinite.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Looking for direct pointers where I can dive deep into the belief system to dismantle it. Someone who can help me break down the process in such manner that I can slowly see what the reality is compared to fiction.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
Its been more than 5 years on seeking and almost 2 years with self inquiry. Watched several videos and read many books on the topic of direct path and non duality.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self? 11

[Julesdickson]

Hi Nitimak, I'm Jules, a guid here. I would be happy to explore with you.
I like how you notice all is 'just happening' we will get more into the 'ing' of all movements and causalities.

If you decide that you would like to move forward with me, start by telling me what I should call you–followed by an explanation of what you experience to be you IN direct experience.
cant wait to hear,
Jules

[Julesdickson]

Hi Nitimak, I'm Jules, a guid here. I would be happy to explore with you.
I like how you notice all is 'just happening' we will get more into the 'ing' of all movements and causalities.

If you decide that you would like to move forward with me, start by telling me what I should call you–followed by an explanation of what you experience to be you IN direct experience.
cant wait to hear,
Jules

[Nitimak]

Hello Jules,

So good to hear from you.

You can call me Nitima.

Regarding " an explanation of what you experience to be you IN direct experience"

Its a feeling of "I" somewhere behind the eyes. This feeling however moves to chest some times and sometimes both at back and front of chest and naval area.

Thank you

[Nitimak]

Hello Jules,

Hope all well! Didn't hear back from you.

Thanks

[Nitimak]

Hi Jules,

Are you there?

Thank you

[graceabounds]

Hello Nitima,

Thank you for your patience and persistence, it speaks volumes about your readiness for this process, which is already underway. :)

I am available to be your guide moving forward.

To begin:

Its a feeling of "I" somewhere behind the eyes. This feeling however moves to chest some times and sometimes both at back and front of chest and naval area.

Very good noticing.
So, is this feeling of ‘I’ in one place at a time?

Staying with it, allow it to be exactly as it is. Follow if it moves.

What does it actually consist of? Is it pressure, heat, tightness, movement, vibration, tension? Get closer, more intimate…
No need to “dissolve” it or make it special. Trying to see through it is also unnecessary. Just stay close.

While looking directly in this way:
Is there anything about this raw sensation that points to “I,” “me,” “mine,” “self,” except the label that thought gives it?
If you don’t call it “I,” or any label at all, is it just sensation? Or does it have inherent self-ness, personhood, identity?

What arises when the sensations are looked at in this way?

In gratitude,
Becca

[Nitimak]

Many thanks Becca! Truly appreciate you responding and being my guide.

I will observe and get bavk to you ASAP on your queries.

Much gratitude,
Nitima

[graceabounds]

Wonderful.
Looking forward!

[Nitimak]

Hi Becca,

I will observe more, however here are preliminary replies-

"is this feeling of ‘I’ in one place at a time"

Yes, at one place and mostly behind the eyes.

"What does it actually consist of? Is it pressure, heat, tightness, movement, vibration, tension? Get closer, more intimate…"

Its pressure and tightness

" Is there anything about this raw sensation that points to “I,” “me,” “mine,” “self,” except the label that thought gives it?"

Hmm, no there isn't but it still feels like 'I'.

" if you don’t call it “I,” or any label at all, is it just sensation? Or does it have inherent self-ness, personhood, identity?"

It is just sensation but somehow it feels like 'I'


"What arises when the sensations are looked at in this way?"

I will observe more and will get back on this.

Much gratitude

[graceabounds]

Great, Nitima,

What is this “feels like”? Where is that in the body? Or is it a thought?

Staying with the raw sensation behind the eyes, is there any evidence in the pure pressure or tightness that there is an “I” at all?
Is there, in this raw immediacy, any boundary, any ownership, any “me-ness” to what is being felt, except for a thought about it?

Is it possible to find an “I” inside this sensation?

——

What I would like you to do is imagine a small apple centered in the head, behind the eyes
Before the apple disappears….
…imagine a canary centred in the head, tweeting away.
Before, the canary flies off (weird huh?)….
…imagine a 'me' centred in the head.
Stay with it…
…imagine it is completely transparent. See straight through it…
…imagine there not seeming to be a 'me' in the head anymore.
Give it a go, see what happens…

[Nitimak]

Hi Becca,

This "feels like" is not in one place and seems it moves. Its hard to point to it as it comes as a feeling. I cant say if its a thought...will notice more closely and get back.

When staying with raw sensation, there is no evidence that there is an" I"at all. I did it several times during the day and couldn't find any I in these sensations.

Regarding boundary, if I close my eyes, there is no boundary but when I open the eyes I see distinct objects and feel the skin is the boundary with other objects.

I did the experiment you mentioned below few times- first couple of times I could imagine apple, canary and transparent me and their disappearance, but later it was getting g difficult to imagine anything.

Also, first couple of times when I imagined at the end the disappearance of "me" which was appearing first as image of my body - then totally transparent- it was all dark spaciousness.

Last few times, I couldn't imagine any of it and just got empty spaciousness.

Much gratitude

[graceabounds]

Great.

it comes as a feeling

A feeling as in a sensation? or an emotion?


When the “me” disappears and only empty spaciousness remains, is anything lost?

Is anything missing in the absence of “me” imagery?
Is life not happening? Are sensations not being felt? Is seeing, hearing, sensing not continuing?

Regarding boundary, if I close my eyes, there is no boundary but when I open the eyes I see distinct objects and feel the skin is the boundary with other objects

1. Close the eyes and hold up one hand. Pay attention only to the felt sensations ‘of the hand’.
2. Open the eyes, and now observe the hand by looking only.
3. While looking at the hand, pay attention to the felt sensations.

Repeat 1 to 3 as many times as needed and investigate…
Normally we believe that the sensation is coming from the sight, the ‘object’ seen (hand). But if you look, is there any link between the sensation and the sight? In other words, is the sensation ‘coming from’ the sight (labelled as hand) or only thoughts and mental constructs link them?
Can you see that both the ‘visual sight’ and the sensation appear simultaneously but ‘separately’, meaning that none of them is coming from the other or contained by the other?
So they just appear equally, ‘beside’ each other without any hierarchy or link between them?


Open the eyes. Don’t label anything. Just let sights, sounds, sensations, thoughts arise.
Is there anyone “inside,” owning or controlling it? Or is life simply appearing, by itself?

[Nitimak]

Good morning!

Feeling is more of a sensation not emotion.

"When the “me” disappears and only empty spaciousness remains, is anything lost?"

No- nothing is lost...it feels full and peaceful.

Is anything missing in the absence of “me” imagery?
Is life not happening? Are sensations not being felt? Is seeing, hearing, sensing not continuing?"
All are happening without the "me" imagery. "Me" does seem like unnecessary overlay over the experience, however it still pulls back into identification with the person.

The shift isn't there yet.

I did the experiment 3 times and yes no connection between sensation and sight. Will do several times during the day today again to get conviction.

Much gratitude

[graceabounds]

Very good.

Next let’s have a look at direct experience. At what is with the thought labels gently pulled aside.

Sit quietly and relax, take your time just looking at what is in front of you for a while. Observe how the mind is dividing and labelling every thing into objects and is embellishing them with stories about what they are.
Give it some time…
Then, stop watching the objects as labelled objects. Just look at the seeing itself. Observe the pure process of seeing. This is direct experience.

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply colour/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:
Seeing a cup, simply= image/colour
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all actual/direct experience) and report back how you go.