Help needed

[annarodriguez]

More introspection today.
Nothing jawdropping.
I did sense that it doesn't matter where I'm at, things move inside me instead of me moving. I don't know quite how to explain it, but it's like people or surroundings change in my space but the space stays the same.
Like I was in a waitingroom today and it was full of people but -okay let's call it awareness- awareness was not touched in anyway. It's a kind of schizofrenic feeling and sometimes even recognized better when in crowded places, because you won't expect it there. But it's not always recognized though.

There was some fear today but not much. The fear is just there, it's a reaction to thought I guess.
I think fear is a natural instinct, but we -the ones who are confused and think there is an I- try to protect an I.
When something is threatening the I, fear just arises. Linked to thought.
Baby's or toddlers do not have that same fear I guess, that nervousness. They have not yet owned an I.
And I guess one can develope very strong fears and anxiety the more one gets conditioned and the more selfaware one becomes. I think in the west we are very good at creating anxiety and fear. Because we always seem under attack one way or the other. We are very conscious of our own little I's and image.

I guess that the above has absolutely nothing to do with recognizing what's here/now. Of what one truly is. I understand that they are not really relevant.
Just writing it down because those ideas/feelings come up.

[Nick]

no its good to write it out like this.

just let the fear come.

Take a look at how the fear is just a feeling, an experience. Then the thoughts make up a story about "I am afraid of this and that..." Is there any REAL content to the fear? Is there any REAL content to the story of you, or just a story?

Nick

[annarodriguez]

I don't know what to write today...

I was busy again at work, with some very stressful situations in wich nervousness arose, so it had nothing to do with coming close to see through a me.
When I look into it, it feels like immediatly there is a distance between the fear and me. When before I used to be totally consumed by it. The same thing happens when I try to find a center wich feelings are happening to.
It's like there is more of a witness now I guess. That creates distance between fear and the I that used to claim it completely.

It's funny because when I look at it it's just obvious that there is no real content to the story. It's sensed, but at the same time it's not fully seen through.

Maybe there are still some hidden expectations inside about how it's supposed to be when really seen through.
I try to be aware of expectations but they creep in anyway.

I'm still relaxed, except for some difficult situations at work, but i'll just keep on looking, exploring.
Thanks for listening/reading :)

Anna

[Nick]

Ok good but there's no need to "keep on looking, exploring"... This is just another BS story. It's expectations, the belief that you're on a journey or path, making progress, belief that something is going to happen...

just.... LOOK!

RIGHT NOW. is there a self or not?

[annarodriguez]

No self, just feelings an thoughts referring to a self. But no actual self.

[Nick]

Was there ever a self? Does a self come a

[Nick]

Does a self come and go? Is it possible to "lose" a self?

[annarodriguez]

Aha, you kinda gave the answer that first time, didn't you :)
No it was never there, I see that the self is an illusion. Thoughts come and go as well as feelings, which gives one the IDEA of a self.

By the way,
thoughts are not really needed are they. I mean I can ride a bike, don't need thought. Can write my name, don't need thought, can lift up a cup and drink tea. Thoughts tell stories accompanying those actions. And most of the time thoughts are not even about those actions, they are about a me or another person. Fantasizing.
I guess thoughts are suitable some of the time, but those complete sentences in my head are not really necessary are they? Never looked at it like that before.
It's so simple and although I heard that before and understood it, it never really hit.

And another thing. I start to notice I-thoughts more and quicker and they are seen through. And they seem to be easier recognized than You thoughts. Or another person thoughts, although I understand of course that there is no difference.
Like: I always love to be cuddled.
Where is the I that ALWAYS loves it. How would I know. It's not happening now, it's a story.
But they are not always noticed. Can't do anything about that. They are still believed most of the time.

And Nick, I understand that I'm not progressing. I understand there already is no self.
So whatever developments I seem to go through and whatever story I tell myself about seeing through thoughts quicker are just that: stories. It just hasn't hit yet. And also that is a story. But it seems to be how it is now.
Keep pushing and poking, I love it.

Anna

[annarodriguez]

And thoughts are not not suitable. They're there.

[Nick]

Yes. Thoughts are not really needed for this inquiry. Nor should they be seen as "getting in the way" or something to get rid of. Just thoughts. Not your thoughts, just noise.

So, all these thoughts. Sometimes thoughts are noisy, or sometimes they quiet down. Is there a thinker?

Nick

[annarodriguez]

No thinker

[Nick]

so what's doing the looking? is there anything? any doer or experiencer in reality at all?

[annarodriguez]

There's just looking or experiencing or doing. By no-one. No entity. Can't locate the thinking, doing, experiencing either.
And there is contraction going on. And now there is believing that I'm a seperate person going on, by no-one.
It really doesn't matter if it is seen or not, only for the experiencing in this body right?

[Nick]

There's just looking or experiencing or doing. By no-one. No entity. Can't locate the thinking, doing, experiencing either.
And there is contraction going on. And now there is believing that I'm a seperate person going on, by no-one.
It really doesn't matter if it is seen or not, only for the experiencing in this body right?

what do you think?

how does it feel?

[annarodriguez]

There are normal thought patterns most of the time. They are hardly noticed.
Most of the time feelings are like before, feel contracted.

But breaks of clarity come more often, I can't even say clarity, don't know how to explain it. Like when I'm talking to a person the room changes, it's like I'm floating but that's too spiritual a word, it;s like the me is deminishing maybe. In that there is relaxation anyway and a letting things happen.
It's very hard to explain, because I don't even know if it's true, or if I'm making stuff up.

Oh yeah and there is nausea now and again. Especially when the me feeling is deminishing.
And it seems contradictive, but there is more anxiousness than before, but at the same time more relaxation, like a less caring almost.
And chestpains, I don't know if that's related to anything or should I go see a dokter :)