I tried on my own. I am exhausted

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigitte
Just a quick note to let you know the following:

This posts with you have been very stressful. Not because of you but because of the pointing.
Sometimes feeling like a snake revolving in and by itself, in the wanting that the real is, ...how to put it, different.
This mind wanting, requesting, almost commanding that the real adapts to its expectations, or the ones that the story (imagined or perceived, or misperceived) of Lourdes, or any expectations "this one" cannot even start thinking of NOW.

Yes I'll keep looking. This needs be done steadily and consistently.

Understand about Santa Claus, although here it was The Three Wise Men (the ones that brought presents to the newborn Jesus)

Will come back tomorrow.
Thank you

Best wishes and Love
Lourdes

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigitte
No access to a computer on the 14th
I just arrived and it is the very start of day 15th nov

I'll keep looking
Thank you for being there

Lourdes

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigitte

From your part some couple of days ago

When you are done with that, let me know if you are ready for the final questions?

This one is ready for those questions

Thank you

Love
Lourdes

[aubergine99]

Hi, Lourdes, nice to see you back here again.

Here are the final questions:

1)Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2)Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3)How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4)What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5)Do you decide, intend, choose, control events in Life? Do you make anything happen? Give examples from your experience.

6)Anything to add?

Take as much time as you need before answering.

Love Brigitte

[Lourdes]

Hello BRIGITTE

1)Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

1) No separate entity. Now or yesterday or ever.

2)Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

2) The illusion of separate self has to do with identification of "consciousness" with an illusory "unit of being" that only exists as a story in the mind.

3)How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

3) To see this feels another step in the way of experiencing life. The difference is that life flows more harmonically. Everyday brings its experience-ing – aware-ing and there is no need to label it in any way, or fixate it in any manner. Clarity, transparence, flow.

4)What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

4) The last bit does not exist. It is made up of LOOKING. Labels and feelings piling over and over with no identifiable point of separation between them.

5)Do you decide, intend, choose, control events in Life? Do you make anything happen? Give examples from your experience.

5) There is no I: No one to make anything happen. Mind is not listing anything to be written here and now.

6)Anything to add?

6) Not that it is of much importance now to add really.
Only:
Congratulations to all whom make this site possible.
Big thank you to ALL!!
And also: words on a screen are very cold. There is no need nor benefit in getting entagled with the mind of the "aspirant" but the use of some words or signs addressing the heart through whatever means the site (or the technology, or…) can give, could make the relationship and the process more "human", sort of like… caring.


Thank YOU Brigitte. You helped and you are HERE. And NOW.

Love
Lourdes

[aubergine99]

Thank you for that, Lourdes, and well done!

What a nice surprise - there is much more lightness in your post this time. I understand that this interactive process online seems a little cold but it has its benefits too and works well with most people. I'm sorry if my tone conveyed a lack of warmth (it wasn't intentional at all, but I will bear it in mind).

I will ask the other guides if they have any questions to ask. This is usual procedure here and I will get back to you as soon as possible - it could take a day or so.

Hugs to you,
Brigitte

[aubergine99]

Hello again,

Some guides have asked for answers to the initial questions with more detail please:

Question 2 - Could you describe how the illusion of separate ‘I’ is created more fully please with reference to life as a baby, young girl etc.
Question 3 – Do you think you are on a certain level? Is there more to come/achieve? Are you waiting for clearer experiences?
Question 4 – You have not said what made you look?
Question 5 – Please give some example of this from your life.

Can you tell me how things have changed for you now? Your feelings at the start of this investigation about having been “cheated” in your life – how do you feel about this now?

You said earlier that you wanted the clarity you experienced in DE to be the same in ‘normal life’. Has this happened? Can you describe how? What is your experience of ‘normal life’ without a self now?

In a recent post, you said there was lots of suffering and feelings of being cornered? ‘No self’ is not a state. Life flows and suffering may continue to arise. How do you feel about this? In what way do you think things will be different, if at all?

Did a shift occur between your last post on Nov 13th and Nov 15th? If so, please describe this.

Please give your best attention to details to all questions. Thanks.

Waiting for your reply.
Brigitte x

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigite and guides,

All the questions are requesting that the mind here puts together words that inform of responses. Therefore thoughts will arise, "I" will try my best that they refer to truth.

Question 2 - Could you describe how the illusion of separate ‘I’ is created more fully please with reference to life as a baby, young girl etc.

Is this wanted about this Person or in general?
As "this person": Well as this one explained similarly in a previous post, the fact that everybody called me Lourdes made this "person" here accept it was Lourdes. It is a bit nebulous now, but it feels like I wanted to please my mother (body security ... and food… and care) and started to believe this was what it was expected, that a "me Lourdes" was called and that this Lourdes answers. Always felt that everybody new what was going on except "me" (sorry now it is difficult to speak about a me) so I tried to adapt. Little by little this body-mind-emot established itself as Lourdes. Very useful because it meant it could refer to a something while relating to others. Very suffering inside because it felt bizarre "not fit". In "time" or after nows and nows without end all this sort of struggle to "be = Lourdes" and not to "be = Lourdes" was forgotten and life has happened as Lourdes. The mind piling up experiences of been seen as Lourdes… disregards aware-ing of other informations that could arise about the being. (?) who knows… Now it is all in the realm of thoughts.
In general... could it be the same?. In order to "survive" in the surroundings and to protect the body everybody constructs a self in the mind… yes… as a story… oh well this is just imagination... do not really know... about others.
This is how it is perceived now, about then.

Question 3 – Do you think you are on a certain level? Is there more to come/achieve? Are you waiting for clearer experiences?

Ha, ha… the step … eh? No level, only not a filter "lourdes" getting constantly in the middle of things after experiencing happens. Without the filter experience-ing is felt as itself, and as it becomes habit (because Lourdes arises in moments or so it seems, mind and thoughts get in so fast!) less thoughts and less thoughts to interfere with experiencing or to attach experiencing to a "doer".

Question 4 – You have not said what made you look?

The persistence of Brigitte and the (my) desire for clarity —that was explained in the first post— made me look, could be… but there is no real knowing here…

Question 5 – Please give some example of this from your life.

Can you tell me how things have changed for you now? Your feelings at the start of this investigation about having been “cheated” in your life – how do you feel about this now?

Changed: Harmony, not blaming myself every moment, not feeling shame for existing. The Cheated has transformed into: that is how it is, or that is how it goes...

You said earlier that you wanted the clarity you experienced in DE to be the same in ‘normal life’. Has this happened? Can you describe how? What is your experience of ‘normal life’ without a self now?

Now it feels like things are adjusting somehow. There still is sort of "private" and a "relational" . Stress in the relational has diminished, although not totally gone… The question from Brigitte in a previous post, pointing to "what is normal life"?, made-caused a shift. Before it seemed there was a line between DE exercises proposed and being elsewhere, no line, no separation now.

In a recent post, you said there was lots of suffering and feelings of being cornered? ‘No self’ is not a state. Life flows and suffering may continue to arise. How do you feel about this? In what way do you think things will be different, if at all?

Not sure if there is enough understanding about this, for can't place how it was felt at the being cornered moment. A fresh perception of life has sort of arisen… words are not helping at all… everything continues to arise… as did before… only there is not so much automatic reaction trying to "defend" Lourdes or her story… or her believes and wants. There is really no I here. Can't really find a separate self. 60 years of habit there are, and it is sort of... entrenched conditioning making itself noticed. Experience-ing being the same and also new. Not much to report… Really. Things are not different but are totally different.

Did a shift occur between your last post on Nov 13th and Nov 15th? If so, please describe this.

It suddenly made itself clear that looking was not something that happens at "laboratory mode" as was felt before Nov 13. The insistence of Brigitte that I look was obeyed beyond the sitting moments in front of these posts and "spaces". Looking is happening more and more often throught the day. "I" offers itself for "protagonizing" actions, but realization of no "I" and that things just happen sets in, is seen; and then doing something, and then "I" comes in and again it is dismissed… Feelings arise and feelings go away. Looking at feelings happens at moments... Looking at thought also… Never see any doer or thinker in Direct Experience... only experiencing happens without an owner of any kind.

Well... these are the answers arising.

Thank you

Love
Lourdes

[aubergine99]

Hi,

Great work, Lourdes. It is obvious a loosening of identification is happening.

Can you tell me how things have changed for you now? Your feelings at the start of this investigation about having been “cheated” in your life – how do you feel about this now?

Changed: Harmony, not blaming myself every moment, not feeling shame for existing. The Cheated has transformed into: that is how it is, or that is how it goes...

So glad that feelings of blame and shame have gone. Do you see that there is no self anywhere to be blamed or feel shame? Whenever feelings arise, notice how thought attaches labels of shame and blame. These are just concepts and bear no truth to reality. They don’t belong to ‘anyone’. The more this is seen, the less identification with thoughts occur and they just arise less and less, as they have nothing to stick to. Just KEEP LOOKING and SEEING that. It is that simple!

I will ask the other guides if they have any more questions.

Speak soon,
Brigitte x

[aubergine99]

Hello Lourdes,

Here are some questions for you.

5) Do you decide, intend, choose, control events in Life? Do you make anything happen?

You partly answered this question but can you please give 2 specific examples from your experience now in day-to-day living?

How do you describe ‘normal life’ now? Again, can you describe how your perception and experiences have changed from how they were at the beginning of this process? Can you give some examples?


Brigitte x

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigitte

5) Do you decide, intend, choose, control events in Life? Do you make anything happen?

A "me" has not been found.
Deciding, even when the thought of being Lourdes was felt as true, this one never really felt that "she" was deciding anything but that she was led by –at that time- some existing unconscious. In some post this was already said that I was looking for an "I" that made sense to what I was doing and feeling in life. This has been specially noticed with smoking, never knew still do not know how it happens. There is no "I" that stops it, while being clear it is no good (smoking) and that there is no "I".
Intend is something that appears, and choosing appears also but this one can't tell where do they come from. These are thoughts as far as it is seen now but they are not felt as having any "final" decisiveness on what happens really.
Control is unknown for this one. Never really thought or felt there was any in this life form. In fact "I" was looking to be able to have control!! Maybe I felt there was control... but cannot recall...
There is no "I" to make things happen. An "I" has not been found anywhere… how could an "I" make things happen?

You partly answered this question but can you please give 2 specific examples from your experience now in day-to-day living?

It goes like this, "I" find it more true to write while it goes:
Eyes open in the morning –by themselves-, an "I" sense arises, but it is not seen anywhere. Get up on automatic mode, go to the kitchen on automatic mode, prepare coffee, drink it, prepare for the day… thoughts appear, thoughts disappear, nothing matters much and "I" let things show up, respond to them without really noticing an exact point where response is coming from.

Thought arises that "I" should answer some mails, there is "people" waiting for a response from my side… feeling says there are too many mails to be able to give the "right" answer… cannot find any right answer anyway. Leave it aside, whatever happens it will happen. Suddenly "I" see myself answering some mails and not others. Wonder why they were "chosen"?. Go to watch the rain, it is nice that it rains… it is not so common… thought arises that if it does not rain in autumn in our area we are in trouble for lack of water in the future… nice that it rains…

Fear arises and a thought: "you are not being responsible… there are still mails to be addressed and you are doing nothing about them". Feel some anxiety… Look at the thought… the phone rings, I answer, respond whatever "feels ok" to respond. Take notes in the agenda. Back at the mails… thought arises… there should be someone responsible here!… feeling arises contraction… wondering how will this go from now? An admonition that all will go wrong unless "Lourdes" takes care of everything. Another thought ... cannot care, Lourdes is not here anyway.

There does not appear an intend, a wish or a power that wants this to be done… thought arises… but "YOU" should be doing something about this. Another thought: maybe.

Feel like having another coffee.

And this goes on, as said in previous post there is a sort of "harmony" in the appearances and disappearances.
At some moments tension in the stomach arises. A bell saying something is not right, something is not true… wonder what it is… wishing there was a way to really find out. Observation mode… waiting… go to read some more of the posts in the files of LU.

A question arises: how is it that people report a lightness and a sort of wellbeing that is not felt here? An answer arises: not everybody has the same experiences. It feels true.

Fear arises together with thought (which come first?): but if you do not take your job more seriously you will not be able to pay the bills!. Answer arises: maybe, it cannot be known here and now. There is something about money... about getting money... and spending money … Anxiety. Look at it! what is it trying to show? Something is not clear but… cannot see what it is.

Thought arises: habit of being anxious, eh?. Thought arises: Clutter to be observed? Maybe…
Reread a post: Keep looking!

Something feels that if there was less heaviness there would be more relaxed moment by moment… thought arises… maybe not… a wish of more joyful moment by moment … clutter?

A skype message comes in… it is my companion reminding me of things that are in my hands, to not forget to attend them… a thought arises… not really feel like doing them really matters… sadness for not feeling interested… response to him is written: ok.

Here with the sadness. Question arises: why sad? Is this "me-not me" expecting anything that does not happen? Contraction. Looking at contraction in the stomach area… hearing the fan of the computer… looking around at the room… contraction is relaxing… back to writing …

The main change is that there is no big fog, nor blame, nor shame for not doing what "should" be done. As if there was an understanding of "life is not what I thought it was" and that there is a "higher power" that knows better. And that by being here and looking and looking, will dissipate the heaviness.

That is how it goes Brigitte. If any more information or clarification is needed from you all, it is welcome.

Thank you
Lourdes

[aubergine99]

Hi Lourdes - Thanks for that and well done.

One of the guides commented as follows:

Every time that the story of Lourdes appears have you been able to look and see that it's a story? Can you now see what's real, beyond the identification with the "character”?

Can you elaborate on this please?

Love Brigitte

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigitte

Every time that the story of Lourdes appears have you been able to look and see that it's a story? Can you now see what's real, beyond the identification with the "character”?

Well, direct answering as earlier today.
Just after reading the sentence... Every time that the story of Lourdes appears have you been able to look and see that it's a story? a bunch of tears arising... still arising... and falling over my cheeks, still feeling very sad... more tears and more tears. It can be seen it is just a story, yes, and seeing it comes with tears...
Strong identification (with the sadness?) together with seeing Lourdes is just a label.

Beyond the identification with the "character" profound sadness arises. Looking at the sadness body contracts. Head falls a bit. Thought arises: -other posts I recall suggesting- should this sadness be embraced ?, if so: how? by whom? there is no a "one" body or mind or whatever here to embrace...

In some past post, it comes to this memory that "I" wrote: There is no "I"... so what? Remember Brigitte? it looks like cheeky, doesn't it? so what? means anger? whose anger? who is there to attach either to anger or to sadness.

They appear... they will go... they will reappear... they are sticky though... sometimes whish "I" could get rid of them... and again who is there to get rid of those?

It looks like a circle.

Acceptance? Admitting? Yes this is accepted "there is no Lourdes". It is admitted. It is a story "printed" in the neurons... in the mind... There is still "others" refering to this life form as Lourdes. In the past it was felt as a "subject"... now it isn't... it has been verified that there is experiencing... that thoughts are not real... not only thoughts are not real but there is no telling that "remembering" has any precision to it. Moreover it is bringing the past into the present moment... no benefit in so doing...

Lourdes is a label made up by language to identify this particular bunch of matter and energy, yes. There are other bunches with other names. Very practical.

Then what is all this sadness about? What is this underlying anger? Your words LOOK! come to the present. Ok, I look. Nothing is seen. Only a vibration, low energy vibration is present, tiredness... Tears... What is a vibration anyway...? Keep looking! more tears... a thought arises: This will also pass.

A few tissues later... Yes, this will also pass... and a fear: How many times yet? It feels so tiring. So narrow. Breathing is slow... like it is hard to inhale... lots of body language here!! ha, ha, ha...

Bye for now. More questions are welcome.

Love
Lourdes

[aubergine99]

Dear Lourdes,

Congratulations, you have crossed the Gateless Gate! So pleased for you and thank you for sticking with me and the process to the end.

This is just the beginning with a new perspective on living. More revelations to discover in looking, a deepening of a new understanding and a shedding of old useless beliefs.

Admin will shortly change your name to blue and you will get access to other LU groups.

There are also 'after care' groups you can join if you are on Facebook, where you can take part in conversations with fellow members. If this interests you, please send me your Facebook name in a private message and you will then get an invite automatically sent to you.

It’s been a real pleasure to guide you and I wish you all the best.

Much love,
Brigitte xxx

[Lourdes]

Hello Brigitte

Thank you and thank you again. You and the rest of guides. This is a great job you are doing... or should I say consciouness is doing?

Never mind.

Something happened yesterday in the last bit: ha, ha, ha... some lightness was felt. This lightness is still felt now.

I now can say that this has been a sort of trip... with a string of lightening bulbs that made this one feel there was more lightening to come.

Just one more little thing... at the beginning there was this thought that English not being my mother language, it could be a barrier of itself... well it has not been so. Sigh... (this could be useful for other seekers...)

You have had the patience and the courage to be here all of the time, THANK YOU.

Sending love to you, and I beg you please to send it to the other guides.

Lourdes