Ready to let go. Requesting a guide.

[Gomi]

Sorry, left out responses to a couple of things from your last post:

Yes I think there are expectations, I think the expectations are that I will understand things clearly, see things clearly.

Smiling...Can so relate to this. Did this one for countless years! AND...WHAT is understanding these things clearly? Would getting your body to breathe, digest food, etc be important and key to survival for you to be clear on? Yet it occurs automatically on its own. Do you notice that even with decisions? Can you think of times when you were so sure of a potential action and then at the last minute something automatically moved it into another direction?

Perhaps this will lead to a deep peacefulness.

Have you found that EVERYTHING automatically arises in DE? Is deep peacefulness at the exclusion of anxiety, joy, anger, love, etc possible? Check your experiences. With this conditioning of wanting deep peacefulness, what arises? Frustration? Story of 'If I only look further i will get it right? Might be interesting for you to make a list and see how many expectations fall under the heading of " story".

g

[Gomi]

Hi hon,
Possibly some good, short reading material for you when you are away, if you have the time. One is about expectations and the other about liberation. They were just posted on FB. You might want to SEE what shows up for you after reading these.

Expectation-by John

There may be expectations of a “special” experience, or of discovering “eternal bliss”, or of an “end to all suffering”.
Forget about them all.
You may have read “spiritual” books which talk about “enlightenment”, and speak in flowery language about “bliss”, and “joy”, and “unconditional love”. Well forget about them.
All of those flowery labels and sentences do not describe what you think they describe.
They are all true, but they DO NOT mean what you think they mean. They are words and terms that are used to try point to stuff that can not be captured in words.
None of them “feel” like what you think they feel like, and none of them can be properly understood, until you realise what you are.
So just forget your expectations about them.
You’ve probably heard that you are “pure consciousness” or “pure awareness”. That is not true. “The words “consciousness” and “awareness” are nothing but words. They are ideas ABOUT what you are, they are not what you are.
So forget about them.
If you are expecting life to change in some way, drop that expectation too. You’ve never not been what you are, so why should anything change simply because you realise what you are?
Stuff seems to change when you see what you are, but not in any way that you could ever possibly imagine.
Just like you can miss finding your car keys, because you were expecting them to be somewhere else, you can miss seeing what you truly are, if you’re expecting something else.
Expectations are a bunch of beliefs. They exist only in thought.
They’re “blocking your view”. Just forget about them.
When you see what you truly are, ALL expectations will be seen to have been vague shadows of what was being pointed to.
There can be the expectation of learning something new, or knowing something new, but that is NOT the case.
This is about shedding beliefs, not gaining new ones.

Liberation-by Bill

"Liberation is not a thought, a feeling or a state.
Its really so ordinary that we have almost totally missed it.
I can't convince you of it, in fact the only way I can help is to point you
in the right direction to look so you can see it for yourself.
You have to do the seeing. We call it LOOKING.
it is through direct experience that it is seen.
Its like we want you to look with fresh eyes at the truth of common everyday experience.
Like a child sees... without any bias.
Its not hidden. Its just a shift in perspective.
Do not expect fireworks. they may not happen. Each person is different.
Our life situation does not magically turn to constant bliss.
All of the emotions we have had in the past are still here..
it just seems there is much less stickiness to them."

Enjoy your workshop,
Gomi

[Tao]

Hi Gomi :)

That's awesome, thank you! I'll take that onto the retreat.

Have had a busy day today and need an early night, so I'll post tomorrow now before I go away on wednesday. I really need to look at your responses :)

Much love
Benny

[Tao]

Beautiful! Happy feet dancing!!! When you come back from the retreat, there are exercises for awareness and DE, so you can experience the flavors.

Excellent! This is what I need.

Great to take this into inquiry/DE!!! On the retreat, check this out. Check again: Are you in the body, check every part. Check emotions? Are you there? Senses? Check each out individually. You can go back over past exercises. Same with the question "Is there an 'I' ? Write it all out. We will look at it when you return.

Reflections:

A feeling may arise, and it may only be a second or two long, but the very second it comes up, a thought comes up as well. The thought makes it personal, and makes a storyline out of it. For example, if a flash of sadness comes from nowhere, a thought will label it as sadness, or depression etc and then it becomes, "I am depressed", "why am I depressed? What has to be done about this depression? How should I change my life to overcome these feelings? What do I need?" and so on. The feeling was only a few seconds long, yet it gets merged in to the ongoing story of 'me'. There was no control over this thought arising.

In that way, feelings aren't personal, aren't 'me'. Thoughts feel personal. Today I looked at whether I have control over thoughts. I was saying "Am I controlling this thought, or this one" etc, in my mind. It felt like I was making those thoughts arise, but there's nothing to say they too weren't just arising.

I can feel my body, in that way it feels like my body, even though it is just made up with elements of the earth. What is it that brings this body to life? What gives it life? Is that which lives the body me? The body seems to act in accordance to thoughts.

It looks like a course of events just playing out. I think there still feels like there is a self that has some control, even if it is very little. Is there really no choice at all? It looks as though destiny is just playing out the way that it will. So where then does the practise of ethics come in? If there is no choice then there must be destiny.Just a story playing out, as it will, and even the practise of ethics is just happening by itself. There is no I that chooses to live more skillfully or ethically, just a process occurring. Is there no 'I' that brings in awareness to those thoughts, to make those thoughts more skillful? Is there no choice whatsoever, because there is no 'I' to make that choice, it is all just happening?

Actually, you have answered these questions thru DE. Another, possibly more accurate, question is:
Have you actually seen through the illusion of no-self...but push it away? If so, why? :-)

How could I know? If I had seen through the illusion, would I know that I had? Because I don't know. I think I have partially seen through it. I don't feel liberated from self.

It feels like a big paradox. I can't find the self, yet it still feels like there is one. I can look at my experience, but what is it that is looking?

[Gomi]

I won't be home for another 6 hours. Should i wait to respond til you get back? You might be in a different spot? If you can read it on the workshop, i will post later.

[Tao]

Hey Gomi, if you respond I can print it off tomorrow morning and read it when I'm there. That is if you wish to. :)

Benny

[Gomi]

Hi, hon,

Since you are going away for a while, here are some exercises to sink your teeth into. Do as much or little as you can. What isn't looked at during this extended time away, can be looked at upon return. No pressure to do these exercises. Just if the opportunity arises...since *you* asked for them. :-)

A feeling may arise, and it may only be a second or two long, but the very second it comes up, a thought comes up as well. The thought makes it personal, and makes a storyline out of it. For example, if a flash of sadness comes from nowhere, a thought will label it as sadness, or depression etc and then it becomes, "I am depressed", "why am I depressed? What has to be done about this depression? How should I change my life to overcome these feelings? What do I need?" and so on. The feeling was only a few seconds long, yet it gets merged in to the ongoing story of 'me'.

YES! Seems like you are ready for a more detailed looking! Wonderful!!!! Now penetrate beneath the surface and observe direct experience with more detail! Let's leave no stone unturned. What is asked for is observing in minute detail how the sensations arise, how the thoughts arise, how the sensations influence the thoughts, and so on. Picture yourself as an archaeologist looking in the fields for fossils .You're determined to find all the clues to how your inner mechanisms really work.That's the kind of intense looking to be brought into this investigation.The pick is in hand.A light is strapped onto your forehead.The light is turned on and focused. All systems go...

What is your Direct Experience of specific emotions? List them in detail.
Continue watching whether emotions come before or after the sensations and thoughts? What is the relationship among them? Focus and magnify until you see how it all works together. You'll begin to notice that sensations usually come first (butterflies in the stomach ), followed by thoughts that stick labels on the sensations ("That's sadness I'm feeling"), followed by a full-blown emotional response ("I'm depressed"...leading to...what can be done with this?) Do you notice that in your experience? Do you see how the thoughts work like a labeling machine?
Now look at this facet of the labeling machine:
When you notice a thought "I feel sadness," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I feel depressed," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I feel like a failure," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I can't figure this out," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I felt a lot better before," what is that "I"?
What does "I" refer to in those thoughts? Can you point to it? Does it have a shape, size, color, sound, fragrance, feel? Or are there just thoughts appearing in experience, one after the other?

Let's turn the magnification up higher here. You've chipped away some rocks and 'bingo' a fossil thought/feeling/sensation shows up. Look at it:
Sensation first (contraction of my stomach, butterflies)
Followed by a feeling (depression)
Which of those observations is closer to direct experience, and which is more of a thought story?
In other words, how did the experience of a sensation in the stomach turn into a feeling of depression?

I think there still feels like there is a self that has some control, even if it is very little. Is there really no choice at all? It looks as though destiny is just playing out the way that it will. So where then does the practise of ethics come in? If there is no choice then there must be destiny.Just a story playing out, as it will, and even the practise of ethics is just happening by itself. There is no I that chooses to live more skillfully or ethically, just a process occurring. Is there no 'I' that brings in awareness to those thoughts, to make those thoughts more skillful? Is there no choice whatsoever, because there is no 'I' to make that choice, it is all just happening?

You're starting to notice what's going on in more detail! Possible discouragement that things aren't the way you thought maybe coming up. Possibly what should replace it may surface. That's the kind of penetrating investigation that will expose the inner workings of the "separate self" illusion. Nice that these stories are surfacing and being met with inquiry.
Let's look at ethics and thoughts and control:
Sit quietly and watch the thoughts as they arise and pass about ethics. For this exercise, report only on the direct experience of noticing each thought, not on the thought content (the words or pictures). (We'll look at thought content in a moment.) Can you discern a point of origin for a thought? A place where thoughts come from? Can you discern a point of destination for a thought? A place where thoughts go to? Or do they just arise and pass?

Now begin to notice the thought content, the words. Are these a kind of running commentary on experience, something like a editorial in a newspaper? There may be an inner sound that resembles your speaking voice. What appears in DE? Do most of these commentary thoughts refer to you? Do they tend to contain the words "I," "me," "my"? Look closely. Notice. Do they contain these words?
Just notice the content as the thoughts arise and pass. List a few of the "I" thoughts that you notice.

Now try this: Look at the computer. Is it more accurate to think "That's my computer"? Or is it more accurate to think "That's a computer"? Why? How does the idea "my computer" arise? Could a self somehow be attached to a computer? How would that work? In other words, what does the thought "That's my computer" actually mean? Please investigate and respond to each question. Looking forward to hearing about these DE.

Loving you,
g

[Tao]

Fantastic, thank you Gomi :)

I will be back on here either Sunday evening or Monday. Plenty to look at in the mean time :)

Benny

[Tao]

Hi

I am back from retreat.

Hi, hon,

s arise, how the sensations influence the thoughts, and so on. Picture yourself as an archaeologist looking in the fields for fossils .You're determined to find all the clues to how your inner mechanisms really work.That's the kind of intense looking to be brought into this investigation.The pick is in hand.A light is strapped onto your forehead.The light is turned on and focused. All systems go...

What is your Direct Experience of specific emotions? List them in detail.
Continue watching whether emotions come before or after the sensations and thoughts? What is the relationship among them? Focus and magnify until you see how it all works together. You'll begin to notice that sensations usually come first (butterflies in the stomach ), followed by thoughts that stick labels on the sensations ("That's sadness I'm feeling"), followed by a full-blown emotional response ("I'm depressed"...leading to...what can be done with this?) Do you notice that in your experience? Do you see how the thoughts work like a labeling machine?
Now look at this facet of the labeling machine:
When you notice a thought "I feel sadness," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I feel depressed," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I feel like a failure," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I can't figure this out," what is that "I"?
When you notice a thought "I felt a lot better before," what is that "I"?
What does "I" refer to in those thoughts? Can you point to it? Does it have a shape, size, color, sound, fragrance, feel? Or are there just thoughts appearing in experience, one after the other?

Let's turn the magnification up higher here. You've chipped away some rocks and 'bingo' a fossil thought/feeling/sensation shows up. Look at it:
Sensation first (contraction of my stomach, butterflies)
Followed by a feeling (depression)
Which of those observations is closer to direct experience, and which is more of a thought story?
In other words, how did the experience of a sensation in the stomach turn into a feeling of depression?

I think this will be an ongoing exersize for me. It all happens in a flash and is difficult to observe. So far, I see that thoughts usually create the emotional response of, depression, for example. Things are just fine, a thought flashes in, perhaps a habitual and largely unconscious thought, and then there is a problem of some sort. The emotion is the body's response to the thought. The body's response too, is habitual, or at least completely automatic.

Once the emotion is felt, then other thoughts appear and create further implications. It is like a back and forth. Where thoughts come from is yet to be seen, although it does appear that certain feelings can bring about certain thoughts, and certain thoughts can bring about certain feelings.

Sometimes it feels as if I know a certain thought is about to arise, a split second before it does. This is difficult to look at. Perhaps it is a gut response, or a feeling.

Every thought places a 'me' at the centre of all experience. There seems to be an ongoing sense of 'me'.

I had a tough time on returning from retreat. There was a lot of observing and some of it was uncomfortable. Thoughts can be very hateful. On returning it came as quite a shock to realize that I strongly dislike myself. There is a hatefulness of the self. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say, the self hates the self, but it felt as if I hate who 'I' am and the emotion was strong. I think this has been unconscious most of my life and I only just realized. I thought I was ok with myself. I've been trying desperately to get rid of the self, as if it is a malfunctioning piece of machinery that needs to be discarded. As though I will be a better self, without the self. Truth is, there is a strong desire for liberation from the self.

Today's observing: A volition to kick a stone was beneath a thought that was taking place. The foot kicked the stone of it's own accord. The volition was pretty much unconscious, a different thought was taking a primary seat in the mind. So the foot kicked the stone all of it's own accord. It just happened.

Beatboxing occured, or a little rhythm made with the mouth, a creating of a beat. I only realized I was doing it half a minute later. There was no conscious decision to do it. There was a creation. When I noticed it happening, I had a glimpse. It felt like I could really appreciate what was going on. Just for a second or two. Things were experienced as if they were completely new. A much deeper of appreciation of listening to it than there normally would have been. Like I was listening to it from within. Or like I was witnessing it happening with no 'me' doing it.

There were moments later of pure seeing. Just tiny glimpses arising, and so beautiful tears nearly came. Such immense comfort and joy in the seeing, if only for the odd flash. Any longer may have overwhelmed me with love.

Hope you are well :)

Peace and love
Benny

[Gomi]

Welcome home!!! REALLY NICE TO CONNECT AGAIN! :-)

It all happens in a flash and is difficult to observe. So far, I see that thoughts usually create the emotional response of, depression, for example. Things are just fine, a thought flashes in, perhaps a habitual and largely unconscious thought, and then there is a problem of some sort. The emotion is the body's response to the thought. The body's response too, is habitual, or at least completely automatic.

Once the emotion is felt, then other thoughts appear and create further implications. It is like a back and forth. Where thoughts come from is yet to be seen, although it does appear that certain feelings can bring about certain thoughts, and certain thoughts can bring about certain feelings.
Sometimes it feels as if I know a certain thought is about to arise, a split second before it does. This is difficult to look at. Perhaps it is a gut response, or a feeling.

This is very nice observing! Habitual conditioning appearing! Yes, Benny. You are right on track. You are SEEING thoughts being automatic. They are happening on their own. The thoughts are real. The illusion is dismantled in that it is seen through, not that it ceases to appear. Really sweet! The way it was observed that there was a 'knowing' that a thought is ABOUT to arise reminds me of the video i suggested watching. This is an actual scientific finding. Do you remember that it took the scientist 6 seconds before he was aware that a thought/action would occur? Wonderful observation, hon.

Every thought places a 'me' at the centre of all experience. There seems to be an ongoing sense of 'me'.

Is this true? Could it be like you said that a thought occurs and then in rapid speed a story gets attached to it? Can you find a very short gap between the thought and the story? Watch it. Be very observant with this. This is a pointer as to where to look. LOOK not at the story but the gap. After DE, please write about it.

On returning it came as quite a shock to realize that I strongly dislike myself. There is a hatefulness of the self. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say, the self hates the self, but it felt as if I hate who 'I' am and the emotion was strong. I think this has been unconscious most of my life and I only just realized. I thought I was ok with myself. I've been trying desperately to get rid of the self, as if it is a malfunctioning piece of machinery that needs to be discarded. As though I will be a better self, without the self. Truth is, there is a strong desire for liberation from the self.

What a great find!!! The exercise really lived itself in your experience. Hidden aspects of the story of Benny are coming up to the surface. Denial is a great protective mechanism until not needed. Have you noticed that possibly it covered up things that 'you' thought you weren't strong enuf to handle? Could it be that now there is enuf awareness to just look at this?
OK so here are some pointers to look directly at THRU Direct Experience:
WHAT CAN GET RID OF ANYTHING? (If you are in DE, can there be judgement? In DE, what judges what? You said in this post that action just occurs on it's own) WHAT REALLY OCCURS? CAN ANYTHING THAT OCCURS MALFUNCTION WITHOUT AN ATTACHMENT OF STORY? CAN THERE BE A BETTER SELF? IF SO, HOW? WRITE DOWN WHAT THE SELF IS, OTHER THAN THOUGHTS, FEELINGS, ETC? WHAT GOES ON OTHER THAN DE WHEN THERE ISN'T STORY? IS THERE A SELF IN DIRECT EXPERIENCE???

A volition to kick a stone was beneath a thought that was taking place. The foot kicked the stone of it's own accord. The volition was pretty much unconscious, a different thought was taking a primary seat in the mind. So the foot kicked the stone all of it's own accord. It just happened.

Sooooo beautiful! Yes! Yes! Yes!!!!

Beatboxing occured, or a little rhythm made with the mouth, a creating of a beat. I only realized I was doing it half a minute later. There was no conscious decision to do it. There was a creation. When I noticed it happening, I had a glimpse. It felt like I could really appreciate what was going on. Just for a second or two. Things were experienced as if they were completely new. A much deeper of appreciation of listening to it than there normally would have been. Like I was listening to it from within. Or like I was witnessing it happening with no 'me' doing it.

Oh.....this is sooooo fine, so fine! What's the song "*Benny*, your so fine, your so fine your losing your mind!" Oh, *Benny*" :-)

There were moments later of pure seeing. Just tiny glimpses arising, and so beautiful tears nearly came. Such immense comfort and joy in the seeing, if only for the odd flash. Any longer may have overwhelmed me with love.

This one, over here, is experiencing melt down, soft smile, loving...loooooving.
Gomi

[Tao]

Hi Gomi, great to be back in communication!

This is very nice observing! Habitual conditioning appearing! Yes, Benny. You are right on track. You are SEEING thoughts being automatic. They are happening on their own. The thoughts are real. The illusion is dismantled in that it is seen through, not that it ceases to appear. Really sweet!

The more that thoughts are observed, rather than believed, the deeper my experience of 'now' seems to go. Great comfort and bliss can arise when not identified with thoughts for a long enough gap. Constantly being drawn into the story, believing the story, thinking the story causes discomfort. An illusion of seperateness and a need to 'do' something appears. A restlessness or discontentment is created by the story. In the space of awareness, peace arises.

The way it was observed that there was a 'knowing' that a thought is ABOUT to arise reminds me of the video i suggested watching. This is an actual scientific finding. Do you remember that it took the scientist 6 seconds before he was aware that a thought/action would occur? Wonderful observation, hon.

Oh yes!! Of course. That's very interesting, to be aware of a thought before it has even arisen! The more awareness there is, the more the process slows down and can be more thoroughly observed. Subtler levels can be observed. When awareness is strong, a vibration is felt before a thought appears. Thoughts have their own gravitational pull about them.

Every thought places a 'me' at the centre of all experience. There seems to be an ongoing sense of 'me'.

Is this true? Could it be like you said that a thought occurs and then in rapid speed a story gets attached to it? Can you find a very short gap between the thought and the story? Watch it. Be very observant with this. This is a pointer as to where to look. LOOK not at the story but the gap. After DE, please write about it.

Hmm, I need to keep looking at this. I feel like the process is slowly being picked apart. It really does happen so rapidly. The story thought appears so habitual that it is just a flash. It is almost just a sense of 'me' within the world, or an assuming of 'me' with every thought.

What a great find!!! The exercise really lived itself in your experience. Hidden aspects of the story of Benny are coming up to the surface. Denial is a great protective mechanism until not needed. Have you noticed that possibly it covered up things that 'you' thought you weren't strong enuf to handle? Could it be that now there is enuf awareness to just look at this?

YES! This is exactly how it feels, that there has to be sufficient awareness to look at what is arising for it to be uncovered. Your ongoing guidance is very much deepening the 'looking' and encouraging a much more thorough awareness. Things are becoming clearer.

OK so here are some pointers to look directly at THRU Direct Experience:
WHAT CAN GET RID OF ANYTHING? (If you are in DE, can there be judgement? In DE, what judges what? You said in this post that action just occurs on it's own) WHAT REALLY OCCURS? CAN ANYTHING THAT OCCURS MALFUNCTION WITHOUT AN ATTACHMENT OF STORY? CAN THERE BE A BETTER SELF? IF SO, HOW? WRITE DOWN WHAT THE SELF IS, OTHER THAN THOUGHTS, FEELINGS, ETC? WHAT GOES ON OTHER THAN DE WHEN THERE ISN'T STORY? IS THERE A SELF IN DIRECT EXPERIENCE???

I think direct experience needs to happen more to be able to answer these questions. The looking is largely about dwelling in a space of awareness as to not be drawn into the thoughts that arise but to be able to observe them which is happening more and more.

Benny

[Gomi]

Hi, back at ya!

The more that thoughts are observed, rather than believed, the deeper my experience of 'now' seems to go. Great comfort and bliss can arise when not identified with thoughts for a long enough gap.

Yes. DE is the living presence. Nowness occuring. Tempting to say wonderful about bliss and comfort...AND yet...comfort and bliss are states that come and go. What IS ever-present behind these states that are arising and dissolving? What is permanent that doesn't come and go? Looking is now really being fine tuned.

A restlessness or discontentment is created by the story. In the space of awareness, peace arises.

Nice looking. The restlessness, discontentment,, etc associated with story can still stay. There is no need to push anything away.Have you seen the movie "Beautiful Mind" There is a fantastic part at the end of the movie,when all the characters in Nash's stories (all who still stay the same age, never aging) are still present. Nash says they still show up but he walks past them. Seeing them but recognizing it's just an illusion.If you can, check out this scene. It is such good pointing!

In the space of awareness, peace arises.

YES! and the content arises as well, but is SEEn as a passing show.

The more awareness there is, the more the process slows down and can be more thoroughly observed. Subtler levels can be observed. When awareness is strong, a vibration is felt before a thought appears. Thoughts have their own gravitational pull about them.

Awareness is. Other than mind's temporary running it's show, what can be added to or subtracted from living awareness? Nice experiencing in the subtler forms!

Hmm, II think direct experience needs to happen more to be able to answer these questions. need to keep looking at this. I feel like the process is slowly being picked apart. It really does happen so rapidly. The story thought appears so habitual that it is just a flash. It is almost just a sense of 'me' within the world, or an assuming of 'me' with every thought.

On one hand the mind feel like it needs more practice. YET, on the other hand nothing gets practiced. Interesting, eh? What can practice what? Isn't it the moment living itself? From DE, do you experience this? "Me with every thought". Can that just be conditioning based upon years of conditioning and labeling?

How bout allowing the openness of the moment to speak itself. Try this exercise: Possibly go outside in nature and walk or sit in a room with your eyes open, observe. Can you still have the story of Benny arise yet see past the illusion of a false self? Knowing 'Benny" isn't real as the body still functions and thoughts still appear. Be 'with this'. Please write about what shows up. (Like in the movie "Beautiful Mind") Nothing needs to be pushed away. Allow all arisings to just come and go. What remains?

there has to be sufficient awareness to look at what is arising for it to be uncovered.

Yes...one may think so..and yet with DE there is no separation. Is there awareness and DE?

Your ongoing guidance is very much deepening the 'looking' and encouraging a much more thorough awareness. Things are becoming clearer.

Thank you, that's very kind... but no credit can be attached onto this person. This one reads what is written and the response happens on it's own. (And with total expression in the fullness of the moment, the conditioned part of 'me' smiles...knowing full well there is no self. Laughter is arising and now being expressed!!!...)

I think direct experience needs to happen more to be able to answer these questions.

What is speaking this?!!!

...observe them which is happening more and more

Sweet!

Namaste,
Gomi

[Tao]

Hi Gomi :)

Yes. DE is the living presence. Nowness occuring. Tempting to say wonderful about bliss and comfort...AND yet...comfort and bliss are states that come and go. What IS ever-present behind these states that are arising and dissolving? What is permanent that doesn't come and go? Looking is now really being fine tuned.

That I can't find. I would be tempted to say awareness, but even that seems to be lost in sleep. I can't see that which is permanent.

Nice looking. The restlessness, discontentment,, etc associated with story can still stay. There is no need to push anything away.Have you seen the movie "Beautiful Mind" There is a fantastic part at the end of the movie,when all the characters in Nash's stories (all who still stay the same age, never aging) are still present. Nash says they still show up but he walks past them. Seeing them but recognizing it's just an illusion.If you can, check out this scene. It is such good pointing!

Just watched it on youtube. It's amazing! :) I must see that movie.

YES! and the content arises as well, but is SEEn as a passing show.

Yes it is seen as a passing show, yet I find it has a certain 'pull' to it and it takes a lot of concentrated effort most of the time to SEE it rather than slip into it - to observe it rather than automatically 'think' it.

On one hand the mind feel like it needs more practice. YET, on the other hand nothing gets practiced. Interesting, eh? What can practice what? Isn't it the moment living itself? From DE, do you experience this? "Me with every thought". Can that just be conditioning based upon years of conditioning and labeling?

Yeah this is the confusing bit. Is it that I'm identified with the 'wake up' process? Am I waking myself up or is it just happening. Thoughts come into the mind telling 'me' what to do next, i.e observe thoughts. Is that me waking myself up or is it just happening? Then what is it 'I' need to do? Although, without effort, things won't be SEEN. Yet, too these thoughts need to be observed.

How bout allowing the openness of the moment to speak itself. Try this exercise: Possibly go outside in nature and walk or sit in a room with your eyes open, observe. Can you still have the story of Benny arise yet see past the illusion of a false self? Knowing 'Benny" isn't real as the body still functions and thoughts still appear. Be 'with this'. Please write about what shows up. (Like in the movie "Beautiful Mind") Nothing needs to be pushed away. Allow all arisings to just come and go. What remains?

This does get practised. There is some watching of the story of Benny. Identification with thoughts seems to be the major distraction. A continued practise. There isn't a yet a 'knowing' that Benny isn't real, there is some seeing of this, but largely it is just another thought or belief. A powerful habitual tendency seems to keep Benny in place.

Thank you, that's very kind... but no credit can be attached onto this person. This one reads what is written and the response happens on it's own. (And with total expression in the fullness of the moment, the conditioned part of 'me' smiles...knowing full well there is no self. Laughter is arising and now being expressed!!!...)

:D :D :D

I think direct experience needs to happen more to be able to answer these questions.

What is speaking this?!!!

Well I suppose it is just another thought! :D

Benny

[Gomi]

Hi hon,

Today we are going to use laser beam SEEing.

gomi's post:

Nice looking. The restlessness, discontentment,, etc associated with story can still stay. There is no need to push anything away.Have you seen the movie "Beautiful Mind" There is a fantastic part at the end of the movie,when all the characters in Nash's stories (all who still stay the same age, never aging) are still present. Nash says they still show up but he walks past them. Seeing them but recognizing it's just an illusion.If you can, check out this scene. It is such good pointing!

benny's post:

Just watched it on youtube. It's amazing! :)

Further down in the post:

gomi's post:

Thank you, that's very kind... but no credit can be attached onto this person. This one reads what is written and the response happens on it's own. (And with total expression in the fullness of the moment, the conditioned part of 'me' smiles...knowing full well there is no self. Laughter is arising and now being expressed!!!...)

benny's followup post

:D :D :D

By George, could it be 'you' got it! Did 'you' see the humor when it applied to 'this one' but hold' yourself' to different standards???? Can you see that conditioning can still appear AS one sees thru the illusion of self?! What are your expectations? That conditioning will automatically dissolve? Usually, it lingers around for quite a while! (Conditioning has been around for many years!)

Could it be that you HAVE seen thru the illusion of self AS conditioning still appears? What is your reaction to this after going within? What appears thru SEEing?

Love,
Gomi

[Gomi]

Oops...
Forgot this:

I can't see that which is permanent.

'You' actually can't see it...'It' IS. No separation.