I Want to stop searching

[Minty]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this? That what I take to be 'me' is only a thought. Or a thought about a thought.

What are you looking for at LU? To stop searching. I would like to discover for myself if there really is no self, as I do not want to live with such a fundamental illusion any more. I want to see things as they are, rather than as my mind tells me they are.

What do you expect from a guided conversation? I expect to be assisted in looking in an unflinching way at the erroneous belief that the self referred to by thought, does not exist. I expect to be helped in looking clearly, and being gently and skillfully kept on track until I see for myself the truth of the matter.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry? Lots of self help books over the years. An interest in reading non duality books. A practising Buddhist back in the day, but no longer.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?

10

[Anastacia42]

My name is Stacy and I can be your guide, if you would like.

Thank you for your patience.

One thing that is helpful is to come to this forum
& post every day. Sometimes the site goes down. It will be back. Just come back later.

Yes, if once in a while you must post later, please post a note telling me when you will return.

If you haven't already read the disclaimer, please read it now and just confirm to me that you have read it. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2/

Also please read “Liberation Unleashed is not …” in the FAQ’s of LU. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041

Some housekeeping guidelines:

1. Post at least once a day, or every second day. If you need more time, or are unable to post for several days, just write a quick post on your thread to let me know please.

2. There is no one judging answers given, so please be 100% honest in your answers and inquiry.

3. This exploration is based on actual experience (AE) - smell, taste, sound, sensation, color and observed thoughts. Long-winded analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress. This is not a self-improvement process. There is no ‘self’ to improve.

4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies, rituals, practices, books/reading and so on for the remainder of this investigation. Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily meditation practice, it is fine to continue that but is not necessary for this exploration.

Technology is not perfect and sometimes there is a glitch which can wipe out your responses. It is advisable that you copy and paste questions asked into Word, answer them there and then copy and paste them to your thread. Always save a copy of what you have done, it will save time in the long run!

To begin with, so that we both become aware of what your expectations are about this exploration. In your own words (not from actual experience, but just honest answers), could you please answer the 4 following questions:

How will life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?
What is missing?

Throughout this exploration I would like you to answer all questions that I have written in blue text. Please answer all questions even if I miss using the blue text.

Please answer questions individually, remembering to use the quote function to highlight the question being answered.

Below is a link to the video with instructions on using the Quote Function. Please watch it. Use the PREVIEW button to make sure your text looks right before you hit "SUBMIT."

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=660

What would you like for me to call you? What time zone are you in, please?


Loving,

[CottonHall]

Hi Stacy

You can call me Alex and I live in the UK so GMT.

I have read the disclaimer and the FAQs and that all looks fine.

I will post every day and if upon occasion I cannot do so, I will let you know in advance.

How will life change?

I think the change in my life that I will notice, will be a sudden space around thought, so that rather than being completely governed by thought, I will be more able to watch thoughts and therefore be less affected by the constant stream which currently absorbs me so completely.

How will you change?

I imagine that I might be less reactive, because I won't 'believe' my thoughts automatically, rather I will 'see' them. Like knowing I am in a cinema watching a film, rather than only experiencing the film with no awareness of the cinema.

What will be different?

My relationship to thought will be different.

What is missing?

The ability to step away from the hypnotic nature of thought.

Thanks for agreeing to guide me Stacy.

Best wishes

Alex

[Anastacia42]

Good, Alex. Your expectations are mostly reasonable.

Now what comes up when reading there's no separate "self?" Never has been. Never will be. It's all just a made up story?

Loving

[CottonHall]

Hi Stacy

I did not get any notification of your reply, so I assumed you hadn't written yet.
However I thought I had better manually log in just to check and sure enough....
I have now checked the 'notify me when a reply is posted' box.

Now what comes up when reading there's no separate "self?" Never has been. Never will be. It's all just a made up story?

What comes up is another series of thoughts along the lines of...' yes I have heard this many times before but it doesn't really mean much to me.' It also stimulates other thoughts like, 'why can't I see the truth of this, and 'am I going to die never seeing the truth of this supposedly simple but profound insight?, and... 'am I too stupid to look'? There is also an accompanying feeling of heaviness when I read about no separate self, that is the physical accompaniment to the thought 'I don't get it'.

Warmest regards

Alex

[Anastacia42]

Thank you.

Tbat question checks for fears. Only fears & expectations can prevent you from seeing. Well, giving up can, too.

This is how to LOOK for no self in the exercises - we call them "pointers' - that we will be doing here:

Colored Socks

There is a big difference between knowing that there is nothing to give up and seeing that there is nothing to give up.

Here is an example to illustrate the difference:

If I ask you what color socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to come up with an answer:

• You can think about it, you can think back to this morning and try to remember putting your socks on, and you can probably tell me what color you think they are.

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what color they actually are!

Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

For the purpose of seeing this "no self" idea, it is very important that you are clear about this difference.

Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that

We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment-to-moment experience. We are only interested in your Direct Experience in the moment..

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.



Loving,

[Minty]

Hi Stacy

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

That sounds 90 % clear, but I am not fully clear on your last sentence about

thoughts arising but not their content

. Do you mean that If I look at the lamp on the table in front of me, in Direct Experience, there is seeing (an object) and there is the thought, and the thought says 'silver lamp'. But you are saying 'silver lamp' is content of thoughts arising and therefore not DE? So thoughts can be actually experienced, but 'silver lamp' cannot be actually experienced. Hmm, maybe I am a bit more confused than I am letting on Stacy. So what does a thought arising look like without its content? Surely the only way we can perceive a thought is by noticing its content?

All the best, Alex

[Anastacia42]

You have it exactly right.

We simply don't believe the content. It's made up. Not Direct Experience.

Got it?

Here's a pointer to help.


Direct Experience - Labeling Daily Activities

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply color/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists exactly like the one above.

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Refer to the green list of Actual/Direct Experience in the prior post if that helps. Those are the only items any experience can be.

Loving,