Silent echo

[Anastacia42]

The hand just moves

Yes. We don't know. It is a mystery.

Okay, let's try this one:

Actual/Direct Experience - Apple

Have a look at an apple (or any fruit you like.) If you have a ‘real’ apple, you can use it for this exercise. Google for a picture of an apple.



When looking at an apple, there's color; a thought saying ‘apple’; and maybe a thought saying, "I'm looking at an apple."

What is known for sure? Color is known and thoughts are known.

What about the content of thoughts, what they describe?

Actual experience does not refer to thoughts ABOUT something…because that is only just more thought.

Actual experience is sound, thought, color, smell, taste, sensation and the fact of thought arising, but not its content.

Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?

Can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience?

While these thoughts are known, what they talk ABOUT can't be found in actual experience.

This is what is meant by "looking in actual experience." What you know for sure, and, is always here.

Taste labeled ‘apple’ is known
Color labeled ‘apple’ is known
Sensation labeled ‘apple’ is known (when apple is touched)
Smell labeled ‘apple’ is known
Thought about/of an ‘apple’ is known

However, is an apple actually known?

Have fun and let me know what you find out.

Loving

[gildedGlitch]

Greetings Stacy,

What about the content of thoughts, what they describe?

Content of thoughts includes:
Round, red. Values of lights and darks, shadow areas, lighter areas, some areas a little glossy. The skin has little contrasting light spots - almost iridescent. Thoughts of memories of tasting an apple and recalling how it tastes.
These thoughts are all “known” - I notice them. They’re all narrating something.
The contents of those thoughts… hmm.. I see how they are just more labels.

Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?

There is a thing here that I know that I can eat. My body recognizes this as food, from prior experience. It is here because I see it, it is seen, and I can reach out and touch it, and I do. But yes, I see that there is only color and other physical attributes and thoughts about it.

Can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience?

Definitely not.

However, is an apple actually known?

No.

Have fun and let me know what you find out.

Funny what we consider fun these days.. and that WAS 'fun' o_O

[Anastacia42]

Yes. Good!

How does it FEEL to see this?

Loving ❤️

[gildedGlitch]

Hi Stacy,

How does it FEEL to see this?

I pondered over this question a lot. Should be pretty easy to notice how I "feel"... but... it didn't feel as straightforward in the moment when I first read it. It feels like my mind is still grasping at things - still putting forth the effort to see things like this - if that makes any sense. It feels like there's a bit of control at play.

Generally, though, I feel more detached. More neutral.

Sincerely.

[Anastacia42]

Okay, yes you're thinking, rather than feeling & looking.

That is correct, but you got there through thinking.

detached. More neutral.

Those are more thoughts. We want things that bodies can feel like hot and cold, tense and relaxed, heavy or light, that kind of thing.

url]https://youtu.be/wyNwhK2Ur1c?si=TZwuFEst-7Hsadpu[/url]

and

https://youtu.be/uAXtO5dMqEI

Treat these like a meditation.

We are looking for a shift in perception. A visceral thing, not a thought. Relax into it.

Treat these pointers like meditation.

LOOK with your eyes. Ignore thoughts.

https://youtu.be/wyNwhK2Ur1c?si=TZwuFEst-7Hsadpu

Palm Flipping Exercise

1. Hold a hand in front of you; palm turned down.

2. Now turn the palm up. And down...and up and so on.

Watch like a hawk.

Don't go to thoughts – examine your direct experience.

Do this as many times as you like, and each time inquire:

How is the movement controlled?

Does a thought control it?

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately.

Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

Loving,

[gildedGlitch]

Hi! I know it's been a while but I'm still here. I watched the videos - all made sense. Working through it.

[Anastacia42]

Okay. Please pick up with the last pointer. Quote & answer the questions individually.

Welcome back.

Loving,

[gildedGlitch]

How is the movement controlled?

Attention goes to the hand and after that the hand moves on its own.

Does a thought control it?

No, thought does not control it.

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

No.

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

There is absolutely no decision. If it's up, it goes down, and if down then up, and so on.

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately.

I couldn't find anything. There was no thought that made the decision. The thoughts came afterwards - as observations of whether the hand was up or down.

Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?

I don't know who or what it was... but habit and situation-ship chose which hand. Being right handed all throughout this life, I typically use my right hand, unless it's holding something.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

No.

[Anastacia42]

Good. How does it FEEL to see this?


Loving

[gildedGlitch]

Hi Stacy - I hope you had a great weekend.

Jumping to the question...

How does it FEEL to see this?

It feels like a contraction all up in the chest area. It feels kind of warm and "nervous." Pressure behind the eyes putting pressure on tear ducts. Tightening of the throat. A relaxed humming throughout the chest cavity.

[Anastacia42]

So. you're getting the lie feeling when you see there is no controller? Please look closely.

Loving

[Anastacia42]

Still there?

[gildedGlitch]

Hi Stacy,

Yes, still here. I gotta be honest, I wasn't quite sure what to think of your last post. My response - while it may/may not have been a 'lie feeling' - was what I had felt in that moment. I don't know if maybe I wasn't describing it very well, or if my mind was super-imposing something. And I've been trying to look, but not seeing much lately. All I know is that I currently don't see or know much of anything lately and it's been frustrating.

A lot's happened since - not anything regarding this specific process - just life really. More introspection, more subtle realizations, more emotions, etc. But also more and more controlling behavior and patterns from me - which has been really strange to notice. It came out of nowhere, with a vengeance.

Anyways, is there anything else I can do to see more?

I'm a bit of a slow mover with these things it seems. And I appreciate your patience.

-Irina

[Anastacia42]

Hi Irina

There are a few basic things to see that we've been covering. Then we settle into simply looking.

Please try this next: Watch Sensations closely. See what happens & when.

Drink Exercise

The aim of the following exercise is to discover whether the function of choice can really be found or confirmed in actual experience. The idea of making ‘choices‘ is a very clear example of a function that we wrongly identify as the basis of our identity.

Here's what’s needed - a chair, a table and two different drinks. Any two drinks you like are okay for this: coffee, tea, milk, water, juices, smoothies, beer, wine, etc.

Preparation - Place the two drinks side by side on the table in front of you, sit comfortably on the chair and mentally label them as drink A and drink B.

Experiment - Finding the function of choice

Sit for a few moments, take a few relaxed breaths and let the dust settle. When you feel ready:

1. Look at drink A and at drink B. Think about their respective qualities, the things you like about them, compare and weigh the pros and cons of each. See if a preference is manifesting for one or the other.

2. Count to 5.

3. Choose one of the drinks. Pick it up and take a sip.

Questions:

Remember that we’re looking for some kind of function, a something, an ‘I’ which is doing the ‘choosing’.

In step 1 when thinking about their respective qualities, did you ‘choose’ the qualities? Or did they kind of appear by themselves? If some preferences manifested, did you ‘choose’ these preferences? Or did they just pop up by themselves?

In step 2 when you counted to 5, if the preferences took the back seat while the numbers took the front seat, did you ‘choose’ this sequence of event? Did you ‘choose’ to shut down the preferences to give way to the counting?

Did you directly experience a mental function or faculty doing the ‘choosing’? Have you seen this function in action?

In step 3 where you made a choice, did you actually witness or directly experience a mental function or faculty doing the ‘choosing’? Did anything arise that announced, ‘I am the chooser’? If so, what does this function look like?

Sometimes we describe this sense of choosing as a ‘feeling’: It feels like ‘I’ did the 'choosing’. But the question is, can a feeling ‘choose’? Is it in the nature of a feeling to 'choose’?

Please stay in touch. even if you're not ready to move on.

Loving