Ready for guidance

[Iznick]

1. LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' -what do you understand by this?

That there is no entity inside me that thinks thoughts, directs attention, and has experiences. Rather, it’s all just happening, without there being a separate “me” that it happens to, and/or that controls it.

2. What are you looking for at LU?

The encouragement and discipline that a guide might provide, and hopefully pointers that go accurately to the places where I’m stuck.

3. What do you expect from a guided conversation?

Just the right pointers, really. I think the fact of having a guide will keep me focussed, though encouragement and firmness (where needed) would also be welcome.

4. What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?

I’ve had a daily meditation practice for 10 years, though right now I’m doing qi gong instead of meditation in order to try and resolve headaches caused by meditation.

I’ve practised in a few Buddhist communities, including Zen, Theravada, and Tibetan, and am currently a member of a Zen sangha.

I tried Liberation Unleashed a few years ago but at that time I wasn’t really committed to awakening. Now, I am committed, and have been aiming at it, often using self-inquiry, for nearly 2 years. In that time, I have had glimpses at times of what seem to be non-dual states, and a few months ago I had an experience that seemed potentially more significant: using a Liberation Unleased pointer, I saw that awareness is everywhere, not in my head, and since then that perception has been available much of the time to at least some degree. I still feel like there’s a “me”, though, who thinks the thoughts and feels the feelings.

5. On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?

10. I am committed and ready, though also a bit worried about possible post-awakening fallout. In particular, I have a family, and so I wouldn’t want my spiritual journey to have a bad effect on my kids. That hasn’t held me back, though, so it seems I’m willing to take a calculated risk.

[Anastacia42]

Good morning,

My name is Stacy and I can guide if yo like.

using a Liberation Unleased pointer, I saw that awareness is everywhere, not in my head, and since then that perception has been available much of the time to at least some degree.

Below is my usual introduction. You may not need to start at the very beginning if you are already seeing there is no self.

Please watch these:

https://youtu.be/vJQcD588g2w

and

https://youtu.be/PUDzrCLlrj4

This is just a beginning.


One thing that is helpful is to come to this forum & post every day. Sometimes the site goes down. It will be back. Just come back later.

Yes, if once in a while you must post later, please post a note telling me when you will return.

If you haven't already read the disclaimer, please read it now and just confirm to me that you have read it. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2/

Also please read “Liberation Unleashed is not …” in the FAQ’s of LU. Here is the link.

http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041

Some housekeeping guidelines:

1. Post at least once a day, or every second day. If you need more time, or are unable to post for several days, just write a quick post on your thread to let me know please.

2. There is no one judging answers given, so please be 100% honest in your answers and inquiry.

3. This exploration is based on actual experience (AE) - smell, taste, sound, sensation, color and observed thoughts. Long-winded analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress. This is not a self-improvement process. There is no ‘self’ to improve.

4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies, rituals, practices, books/reading and so on for the remainder of this investigation. Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily meditation practice, it is fine to continue that but is not necessary for this exploration.

Technology is not perfect and sometimes there is a glitch which can wipe out your responses. It is advisable that you copy and paste questions asked into Word, answer them there and then copy and paste them to your thread. Always save a copy of what you have done, it will save time in the long run!

To begin with, so that we both become aware of what your expectations are about this exploration. In your own words (not from actual experience, but just honest answers), could you please answer the 4 following questions:

How will life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?
What is missing?

Throughout this exploration I would like you to answer all questions that I have written in blue text. Please answer all questions even if I miss using the blue text.

Please answer questions individually, remembering to use the quote function to highlight the question being answered.

Below is a link to the video with instructions on using the Quote Function. Please watch it. Use the PREVIEW button to make sure your text looks right before you hit "SUBMIT."

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=660

What would you like for me to call you? What time zone are you in, please?


Loving,

[Anastacia42]

Do you still want to be guided here?

Much love

[Iznick]

Hi Stacy

I'm so sorry for not replying sooner - I tried to subscribe to the thread so that I would get an email when someone replied to me, but for some reason that didn't work.

Are you still available to offer guidance (no worries of course if not)?

I should also mention that I've been having some trouble with headaches over the last couple of weeks and I'm not sure if they'll limit my ability to work with the pointers in the coming weeks - let me know if that's a problem or if I can go ahead and just do whatever is possible.

Apologies once again

Michael

[Anastacia42]

Hi Michael,

That is okay. Yes, I'm still available. You should have already been subscribed. Oddly, when it says, "Unsubscribe," that means you are subscribed. Do make sure that is set. Or visit the page every day.

It is up to you whether you work with headaches or not. Let me know any time you want to pause.

Please answer the 4 questions in blue in my first reply and we'll go from there. Be sure to use the Quote function. Instructions are at the end of my first reply.

Much love,

[Iznick]

Hi

Thanks very much. I’m excited to start working together.

My name is Michael, and I’m in the UK.

How will life change?

I’m not sure that my daily activities will change that much – though I guess they could, if I stopped being driven by the need to protect and aggrandise “me”. Or they could carry on as they are now, but I would experience them differently.

How will you change?

My inner experience will change – I will see more clearly, deeply, and consistently that there is no self. This will, I hope, reduce my suffering - currently, in the moments when there seems to be less of a “me”, suffering is certainly reduced. I’m not sure whether my behaviour will change, but it’s possible I will become more cheerful, good-natured, and relaxed.

What will be different?

The sense of a “me” in the middle of experience will cease to convince, possibly disappear whenever I look for it, or maybe even disappear entirely. What will be left, I guess, is the open field of experience and silent, watchful awareness that I sometimes perceive. Though I’m sure there are much deeper levels one could go to and I don’t know what those would be like.

What is missing?

The silent, watchful awareness isn’t missing anything, whereas I feel I haven’t got enough money, status, enjoyable activities, time spent with good friends, and spiritual insight.

[Anastacia42]

Hi Michael,

Good. Your expectations are fairly reasonable. Nothing will change, but everything will "change," or be perceived differently. We are looking for this shift in perception. Reading completed threads in our Archive, downloading Gateless Gatecrashers from this site and/or Liberation Unleashed from Amazon will all give you examples of what happens when people See.

Now what comes up when reading that there is no separate self, never has been, and never will be? That the whole thing was a made up story that we believed.


Loving,

[Iznick]

Yes, I've read Gateless Gatecrashers, which has shaped some of my expectations.

Now what comes up when reading that there is no separate self, never has been, and never will be? That the whole thing was a made up story that we believed.

Not much comes up - I am familiar with this idea and believe it to be true.

I've had moments where it gives me a feeling of vertigo - as though it's a bit scary to really take it seriously. But mostly, it just feels like something I believe, and when I look for the separate self, it's not there, although there's the inescapable feeling, still, that it's *me* that's looking and not finding.

The sense of self used to feel like it was up in my head, but nowadays it seems to be more strongly associated with the sensations of my throat and chest. It seems like thoughts feel like they are "mine" because they are accompanied by sensations in my throat and chest, as though I were speaking aloud.

[Anastacia42]

First how to look. then a LOOKING pointer.

This is how to LOOK for no self in the exercises - we call them "pointers' - that we will be doing here:

Colored Socks

There is a big difference between knowing that there is nothing to give up and seeing that there is nothing to give up.

Here is an example to illustrate the difference:

If I ask you what color socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to come up with an answer:

• You can think about it, you can think back to this morning and try to remember putting your socks on, and you can probably tell me what color you think they are.

• Alternatively, you can take a quick look at your socks and tell me what color they actually are!

Hopefully you would agree that you can only be 100% certain by looking.

For the purpose of seeing this "no self" idea, it is very important that you are clear about this difference.

Knowing is about knowledge which is all in the mind and we are not interested in that

We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on in your present moment-to-moment experience. We are only interested in your Direct Experience in the moment..

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.



Okay, then try this:

Explore ‘Sense of Self'

Let’s say that you have lost your keys and you swear that you left them in your coat. You go to look and check all the pockets - the keys are not there. You swear they must be as that was the last place you remember them. You have a vivid memory of putting them there after you left the house. But when you check they are not there. At this point you can keep believing that the keys are in your pocket, or you can admit you were mistaken.

This is just like that. You may see clearly that the self is an illusion but still feel a sense of self - just like the keys. But feeling something to be true and seeing that it is or is not is different. This is why we may find ourselves coming back to your expectations at the start and at the end.

Now, I’d like to ask you to explore this SENSE of self very-very thoroughly. Not by thinking about it, but by FEELING it. Keep the focus of attention on the sense of self and inquire:

Does the sense of self have a location?

Does the sense of self have a shape or a size?

Does the sense of self say or communicate anything?

If the answer is yes, how does the sense do this exactly?

Does the sense of self have any characteristics or attributes?

What is the sense of self ‘made of’? An image? Sound? Taste? Smell? Sensation? Thought?

What is found?

Loving,

[Iznick]

I am clear about what it means to look, and what is direct experience.

Does the sense of self have a location?

It seems to be located at the center of the field of experience, mostly inside the chest and throat area, and also in the head behind the eyes.

Does the sense of self have a shape or a size?

It does in that it has the same shape as the sensations inside the chest and throat, and a lump of density inside the head.

Does the sense of self say or communicate anything?

It seems to talk constantly.

If the answer is yes, how does the sense do this exactly?

It seems to talk through verbal thoughts, though there is also a constantly shifting web of pre-verbal thought behind the articulated thoughts

Does the sense of self have any characteristics or attributes?

It seems to be: the thinker, the experiencer, the decider, the wanter and not-wanter, the holder of opinions and, most of all, the sufferer.

What is the sense of self ‘made of’? An image? Sound? Taste? Smell? Sensation? Thought?

It’s made of a few things: sensations in the head (especially the eyes, when they are closed), throat, and chest (the same sensations I feel more strongly when I speak); a sense of density in the centre of the field of experience; mental imagery that makes up a kind of “map” of the body and especially the head; verbal thoughts about the self, including enduring beliefs about the self; and the mysterious experience of identification with thoughts.

What is found?

The above, to varying degrees at different times.

[Anastacia42]

Good morning,

a lump of density

Many people confuse this tight, heavy contracted feeling with a "sense of self. " It is not. Don't make that mistake.

Watch this, please.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n6RnrkOD7 ... uBphAoK764

Here is how to distinguish truth from lies.


We often lie every day & don't realize it.

For example, the grocery clerk asks, "How are you?" You reply, "I'm fine." While, yes. there is a sense in which we are always fine, even in the middle of suffering, at that moment, you were grieving the death of your dog, you had a slight sore throat & you had a headache, but you didn't feel like sharing all of that with the grocery clerk, so you lied, "I'm fine."

Also, it matters none at all how "distant" the remembered lie is. Besides the fact that time itself is fictional, a kind if lie, as we recall the lie it becomes present in this moment, as if it were happening now. This brings the body Sensation that accompanies lying.

Lies can be intentional or unintentional, conscious or unconscious, even so automatic that we ourselves are fooled.

The story of a separate "self" is a lie.

This is the lie you came here to see through. Therefore, it is helpful to notice the body Sensation of lying as one of the tools for finding the truth of no self.

You want to be in touch with body Sensations & able to clearly express them in words. This will help.

Lies are usually felt in the heart or solar plexus as a contraction that we may label as tight, heavy or tense.

In contrast, truth is usually expansive. We may call it loose, light or relaxed.

First, can you remember a time when you lied to someone you loved?

Here we count anything, lies we think of as "big" or "small" that "matter" or don't "matter."

How are you? I'm fine. No, your knee hurts, but you don't feel like discussing it with the grocery clerk.

It's a lie. A seemingly "bigger" one will work better for this exercise.

Find the lie. I don't need the whole story, just a few key words to refer to it.

Then scan your body for any Sensation (DE or Direct Experience), particularly in the gut or maybe the heart. Check very closely.

What is found?

If you think the memory you used wasn't clear enough, find another one or lie to yourself right now, make something up.

1 + 1 = 14 is a lie.

I love eating worms is (probably) a lie.

Or call up a video of a lying politician & notice what Sensations arise as you listen.

I will give you a clue: it is not that peaceful Sensation you felt before when you omitted "I." (I don't think we've done that one, yet. I skipped ahead. ) Peaceful is a thought, a label.

Please report back with what body Sensations (not interpretations) you feel. Bodies can feel hot or cold, heavy or light, contraction or expansion, etc.

"Peaceful" is an interpretation of a body Sensation, not the Sensation itself, for example.

Do you see that?

Loving,

[Iznick]

Hi

I can't think of any very consequential lies I've told, but I've been making an effort to tell a few inconsequential ones.

It's hard to pin down the feeling of lying but I seem to possibly notice a sense of contraction or pulling down across my torso, where the diaphragm is. It feels kind of fizzy.

But, like I said, it's hard to pin down, so maybe I need to keep investigating.

[Anastacia42]

I seem to possibly notice a sense of contraction or pulling down across my torso, where the diaphragm is. It feels kind of fizzy

Yes. That's it.

It doesn't matter if the lies are "consequential" or not. That's just another thought.

Keep paying attention to sense of contraction when it arises. Can you imagine what a different world it might be if everyone could identify and avoid lies? Look also for the opposite - the expansion of a truth feeling.


Meanwhile, let's do this:

Direct Experience - Labeling Daily Activities

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply color/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists exactly like the one above.

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Refer to the green list of Actual/Direct Experience in the prior post if that helps. Those are the only items any experience can be.

Loving,

[Iznick]

Sorry for not having written yesterday - I'm doing the practice but I've had a headache and so need to minimise screen time. I will probably be able to reply properly tomorrow, which I hope is okay.

All best

[Anastacia42]

Yes, of course. Get to feeling better. No rush.

Loving,