Time for the truth

[Susark]

This coming and going is like a flow : is the knowing of the flow separate from the flow? LOOK AT this till the true answer is SEEN.

No the flow is just happening, just like seeing is happening and being is happening..

[warissem]

Hi Susark

You are doing a good work here.
I invite you to go for a walk in a park or in nature and look at the flow of life.

Let me know if there is still seeking.

Best for you

[Susark]

Let me know if there is still seeking.

I have been thinking about this over the last week or so. I can see how life just flows. Re seeking, I think that I expected "Awakening" to be more dramatic. Up to now what I have found that it is so simple and obvious. I have been aware for years that thoughts just happen and how that if we believe negative ones it can lead to an unhappy life but seeing that a self doesn't exist is a new understanding. Perhaps I thought that seeing all this would be more, as I said, dramatic.

Re still seeking, I don't have the urge to keep trying to find out more about awakening but now need to live into this understanding and watch how I am reacting to life and events and accepting how life flows.

Re thoughts, I understand how thoughts just happen but I also believe you can intentionally create new positive/creative thoughts. Am I right about this?

[warissem]

Good evening

I have been thinking about this over the last week or so. I can see how life just flows.

Great. How do you feel to see this?
What has changed from the beginning of this dialog?

Re seeking, I think that I expected "Awakening" to be more dramatic. Up to now what I have found that it is so simple and obvious. I have been aware for years that thoughts just happen and how that if we believe negative ones it can lead to an unhappy life but seeing that a self doesn't exist is a new understanding. Perhaps I thought that seeing all this would be more, as I said, dramatic.

Yes, it is as simple as no more belief in Santa Claus.

Re still seeking, I don't have the urge to keep trying to find out more about awakening but now need to live into this understanding and watch how I am reacting to life and events and accepting how life flows.

There is no you in the equation, no you to keep trying to find or to watch how reacting to life, no you at all.
What comes up when you read this : there is NO YOU in any shape or form, there never was, it will never be.

Re thoughts, I understand how thoughts just happen but I also believe you can intentionally create new positive/creative thoughts. Am I right about this?

SEE that the intention itself is a thought. Example : thinking about a topic. See that a "topic" is already an arisen thought.

Best for you

[Susark]

AHA!! I think I got this. Will write more when I have given it more thought.

[warissem]

Good morning

Don't give it more thoughts, give it more looking and presence.

Have a nice day

[Susark]

Thank you.

[warissem]

Good morning

It would be helpful to share what is going on.

Nour

[Susark]

Good morning. :) Sorry I am taking some time to reply. We have been busy with house moving stuff like getting quotes for shipping our household goods to Canada and working with the real estate sales stuff. Also we are going away to visit family for the holidays so lots happening.

One thing I notice when replying to you is how easy it is to slip into using "I" or "me" language. It's so built in that there is a "me" and our language is all built around that.

Re "Life just flows" How do you feel to see this?
?

It actually is something that I have always sort of thought or had a feeling about. Understanding it certainly makes life easier.

What has changed since the beginning of this dialogue

A slow understanding and acceptance to surrender to things as they unfold.

There is no you in the equation, no you to keep trying to find or to watch how reacting to life, no you at all.
What comes up when you read this : there is NO YOU in any shape or form, there never was, it will never be.

I understand this. There is a noticing of happening but no ME as an entity.

SEE that the intention itself is a thought. Example : thinking about a topic. See that a "topic" is already an arisen thought.

This was an aha moment for me. I am noticing more and more that actions just happen. Thoughts just happen.

[warissem]

Good evening

One thing I notice when replying to you is how easy it is to slip into using "I" or "me" language. It's so built in that there is a "me" and our language is all built around that.

Yes, it is normal to use “I”, “me”, … but you know that there is no you, no entity behind these words.

This was an aha moment for me. I am noticing more and more that actions just happen. Thoughts just happen.

Yes, is there separation between the experience and the knowing of it?

I wish you nice holidays.

[Susark]

Yes, is there separation between the experience and the knowing of it?

There doesn't seem to be. However when I am sitting in nature thoughts and labeling slow down a bit. The same thing when I am in the flow painting, thoughts seem to stop or slow right down. This makes me wonder if there is separation but I don't know.

I hope you are enjoying the holiday break. My garden is blooming and all is beautiful. 🙂

[warissem]

Good morning

There doesn't seem to be. However when I am sitting in nature thoughts and labeling slow down a bit. The same thing when I am in the flow painting, thoughts seem to stop or slow right down.

yes, thinking won't disappear. Thinking is happening and there is knowing (awareness) of it : the sun is shining on the clouds. The clouds cannot be seen without the light of the sun.

This makes me wonder if there is separation but I don't know.

In the everyday experience, is there a separation between experience and the knowing (awareness ) of it?
You have to be 100 % certain in your answer. a big YES or a big NO.
If it is a NO, please describe the boundary between the two. It is that simple. Jus direct experience.

Feel free to expose any lasting doubt about this stuff and we will continue to explore.

I hope you are enjoying the holiday break. My garden is blooming and all is beautiful.

I am on retirement, always on holiday. "My" is the separating agent here. Just be aware knowingly.

Best wishes

[Susark]

In the everyday experience, is there a separation between experience and the knowing (awareness ) of it?

If it is a NO, please describe the boundary between the two. It is that simple. Jus direct experience.

Finding this question hard to answer. Seems that the only separation is that the direct experience happens in the body, so that would be the boundary.

[warissem]

Good morning

Finding this question hard to answer.

You said NO : it means there is no boundary between the experience and the knowing of it. The suggestion about the description of a boundary is given to let me know if there is still a doubt.

Seems that the only separation is that the direct experience happens in the body, so that would be the boundary.

Here is the doubt and as you can SEE it, this sentence is not direct experience, it is all thoughts.
Does really direct experience happen in the body ? LOOK at these :

Does seeing happen in the body?

Does hearing happen in the body?

Have you seen that a body is a bunch of sensations?

Are sensations aware of what is seen or heard?

Is the body aware of thoughts?

Where you doing the LOOKING during your absence on this forum?

Best wishes

[Susark]

You said NO : it means there is no boundary between the experience and the knowing of it. The suggestion about the description of a boundary is given to let me know if there is still a doubt.

Seems that the only separation is that the direct experience happens in the body, so that would be the boundary.
Here is the doubt and as you can SEE it, this sentence is not direct experience, it is all thoughts.

Does really direct experience happen in the body ? LOOK at these :

Does seeing happen in the body?

Does hearing happen in the body?

Have you seen that a body is a bunch of sensations?

Are sensations aware of what is seen or heard?

Is the body aware of thoughts?

Where you doing the LOOKING during your absence on this forum?

In the everyday experience, is there a separation between experience and the knowing (awareness ) of it?

I am finding this question confusing. I know seeing just happens, and the same with hearing etc and that there is no me. Experience happens and then labeling happens. There is no me but noticing happens. I don't understand what you are asking about a separation.

I am finding it hard to find time to look/reflect. It's a crazy busy period. We have family staying, we are traveling with them, getting rid of things ready to move and preparing the house for showings and it's too busy.

One thing "I" have noticed though is that I am less concerned about how things turn out or go/flow going forward. I can see that thoughts happen, things happen and there is no me in charge of any of it.