Finally free

[Anastacia42]

Alright. I don't see anything here that is Direct Experience.

there is a strong belief here that “ I contain multitudes and some of these are beneath conscious awareness.

THAT has got to go.

You can call it "strong belief," or "deep whatever," or "unconscious blah blah." That does NOT make it Direct/Actual Experience in any way. It is still merely content of thought and has no meaning whatsoever. LOOK - you will find NOTHING THERE.

This is the one thing you said that sounds like it is DE Sensation, but check. You are fooling yourself!

embodied subject object sensation

LOOK! Where do you feel this? And exactly what does it feel like?

I am nearly certain you will find some Sensation in your gut or heart and that it will be heavy, tense and contracted. Am I wrong?

Seriously, you are putting yourself through some insane (and I mean that literally - "out of your mind" pun intended) contortions trying to prove the unprovable. There is *obviously* no "separate self" in DE.

All you have offered as proof is content of thought and the lie feeling. Can you see that? With an open mind, freed of these preconceptions, can you SEE there is absolutely NOTHING THERE?

Really! Meaning literally "in reality." (Slippery word, reality, but in DE?)

You wanted direct guiding. I've taken the gloves off. No bullshit.

Loving,

[Eyeofheart]

I’m happy you are taking the gloves off!

To say you dont see anything in DE is not entirely fair.
The first sentence is DE is it not?

A sensation or contraction in the body is a prequel to the thought:

I do recognize that uncomfortable sensations ( tight throat, burning heart etc.) stimulate thought and problem solving as an habitual reaction in my DE.

As for the Walt Whitman quote I was making a joke which refers to this point;
Christianne M, Pernille and others doing fetter work say that although the traumatized child (for example) can only be found in thought, it has to be treated as real until it is seen fully, accepted/loved…otherwise “it” gives birth to reactivity and resistance in the form of bodily reactions.
This was what I was referring to.

I am also aware that indulging any trauma story is a rabbithole -yet not acknowledging it is spiritual bypassing.
I have done quite a bit of both.
I am not meaning to anal-yze…. I am just reporting
What wiser folks than myself have said to me(including Vince).

By “ embodied subject object sensation” I am referring to DE. When I scan a room with soft focus and then fix my eyes on an object I notice a pressure/tightness in the heart… upon further inquiry it feels like a way to register
The object as ‘friend or foe.’
AND NO- there is no one deciding to do this other than habitual bodily reactions
( in the blah blah story could be a “trauma response.”


Does any of this make sense?

[Anastacia42]

Yes it makes sense. Still. You're not here to explain. You're here to LOOK.

What is SEEN?

Are you saying you have trauma that needs to be treated as "real" right now?



Thanks & loving ,

[Eyeofheart]

Seriously, you are putting yourself through some insane (and I mean that literally - "out of your mind" pun intended) contortions trying to prove the unprovable. There is *obviously* no "separate self" in DE

OK OK
The psychological self; traumatized or not, multiplicity of parts or not, is one of those contortions. It has been the project of a lifetime! Even though I quit “therapy” 13 years ago this belief system is everywhere and mentioned even in later fetter work.

You say STOP? I notice sensations of gripping in solar plexus and heart -(thought Labels these sensations as fear) when I consider STOPPING it all completely.

[Anastacia42]

Good morning

First, notice how you ignored my questions in blue.

Please answer all questions, using quotes & answering one at a time. Hard to guide if you're ignoring guidance.

You say STOP? I notice sensations of gripping in solar plexus and heart -(thought Labels these sensations as fear) when I consider STOPPING it all completely.

The video was just for your amusement. Those feelings are the body no. Or indicative of a lie.

There is no psychological self.

What belief, specifically, are you referring to? In one simple sentence,please.

I have a question: Do you want to know the truth?

Just "yes" or "no."

https://youtu.be/gaMpVeR6PUc

Please watch the above interview. It's about an hour. Let me know when you've watched the whole thing.

Much love,

[Eyeofheart]

First, notice how you ignored my questions in blue.

Are you saying you have trauma that needs to be treated as "real" right now?

I believed I was addressing this question with my response.
I was saying that I am not arguing that the trauma needs to be treated as “ real” right now.
I was describing that I felt the comments I was making about traumatized little one were not only not real but appeared to be one of the in-sane thought contortions you were referring to. That, I felt was an answer to your question.

What belief, specifically, are you referring to? In one simple sentence,please.

The psychologic self: The thoughts about a “me” which
Explain and analyze “ why” behaviors and emotions arise

Do wyou want to know the truth?

Yes!!!!

I will report back after I watched the video.

[Eyeofheart]

Let me know when you've watched the whole thing.

I have watched the whole thing.

[Anastacia42]

Okay, have you ever practiced The Work of Byron Katie?

[Eyeofheart]

What belief, specifically, are you referring to? In one simple sentence,please.

I realize I may have misunderstood this question
I thought you wanted me to define what I believed the “ psychological self” to be in one sentence

Yes, I see there is no psychological self. In one sentence
I am referring to the historical “cause” of present day bodily sensations.
This is the trauma story- The sensations are DE, the story is thought not DE.

[Eyeofheart]

Okay, have you ever practiced The Work of Byron Katie?

I did the school for the work twice
I practiced the work everyday for 6 months
I love BK - her audiobook A mind at home with itself” is the only audible book I listen to and “ A Cry in the Desert” is currently on my bedside table.
That being said, I found the Work to be an endless rabbit hole and evokes the psychological story to be seen through over and over.
I have the app on my phone and still use it when I notice a strong reaction which is rare these days.

[Eyeofheart]

One past realization during a ten day silent retreat when I meditated on the koan “ this sentence is false”
Is that NO THOUGHT IS TRUE
This was an intellectual seeing that did not penetrate deeply into my experience with very “ sticky” thoughts ( accompanied with strong sensations in the body).

[Anastacia42]

Hi,

What belief, specifically, are you referring to? In one simple sentence, please.
I realize I may have misunderstood this question
I thought you wanted me to define what I believed the “ psychological self” to be in one sentence

Yes, I see there is no psychological self. In one sentence
I am referring to the historical “cause” of present day bodily sensations.
This is the trauma story- The sensations are DE, the story is thought not DE.

That was 3 sentences. I still don't see an answer in all of those words. I am asking you about this:

The psychological self; traumatized or not, multiplicity of parts or not, is one of those contortions. It has been the project of a lifetime! Even though I quit “therapy” 13 years ago this belief system is everywhere and mentioned even in later fetter work.

What is the belief? Just one simple sentence. Something like, "I believe that . . . "

Keep everything simple. Complexity is where we see the stories of a "self" and an "ego" hiding out. They aren't there.

Loving,

[Eyeofheart]

Dear Stacy;

What is the belief? Just one simple sentence. Something like, "I believe that . . . "

I believe that a "psychological self " is a story, thus illusory.

How's that?;-)

Love
Leela

[Eyeofheart]

One past realization during a ten day silent retreat when I meditated on the koan “ this sentence is false”
Is that NO THOUGHT IS TRUE

Something hit me yesterday. After talking with Vince I realized I was not aware I was merging thought and the content of thought. He said there are 6 senses and one is thought.
Thinking is happening but the content of thought is an illusion.
I was a bit surprised when he said it. This seems like a simple obvious thing but it was a big "pop"! Duh.

I did not appreciate that the realization above refers only to the 'content' of thought (even though some thoughts are useful....)
Seeing is in DE, no 'thing' is being seen.....(even though the body responds to 'fire' and 'fast moving objects' by instinct the
labels are not required for that response)
Hearing is actual, no 'thing' is being heard.....

WOW! So clear.

[Anastacia42]

Yes, very simple, very clear. Very few words required.


This is one of the 1st things I posted.
Thursday, May 18 at 1:43 am

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Remember?

How does it FEEL to see that all thoughts are lies?

Loving,