Hi from Izzy

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Sun Jan 08, 2023 12:06 am

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.
I understand what you are saying Staci. It’s like the difference between understanding that people die and actually experiencing a death of someone. They are totally and completely different.
Today I have been trying to simply stay with sensations, to see what is there directly. What I experience is a sort of numbness and a pain in the heart area. I have been inviting fear in but nothing much happens. I will keep working with the video and anxiety pointer and see where it goes.

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Anastacia42
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Sun Jan 08, 2023 12:39 am

Okay.

Here's your next pointer:

Direct Experience - Labeling Daily Activities

Here's an exercise that I would like you to try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities simply color/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought.

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Just break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists exactly like the one above.

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.

Refer to the green list of Actual/Direct Experience in the prior post if that helps. Those are the only items any experience can be.

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Sun Jan 08, 2023 9:16 pm

So for example, when having breakfast, become aware of:

Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Post several of your own observations in a list *exactly* like the one above, please. Same word forms. Same order. EXACTLY.
so here are my observations from today:
Cleaning my teeth I am aware of:
Seeing hand reaching for the toothbrush, simply=shape, colour, movement
Smelling the toothpaste, simply=smell
Feeling the brush, simply = sensation
Tasting the toothpaste, simply = taste
Hearing the water running, simply=sound
Thought about cleanging my teeth, simply = thought

Having a cold drink I was aware of:
Seeing the glass, simply = shape, colour
Smelling the drink, simply = smell
Feeling the glass in my hand, simply = cool sensation
Tasting the drink, simply = taste
Hearing the fizz of the drink, simply = sound
Thought about the drink (this is how I made it, what I think of it.....), simply = thoughts

Walking in the park I was aware of:
Seeing the path and grass ahead, simply colours, shapes
Smelling the wet mud, simply = smell
Feeling the wind on my skin, simply = sensation
Tasting the sweet in my mouth, simply = taste
Hearing children shout, simply = noise
Thoughts about the walk, , (the time, weather....), simply = thoughts


Writing this answer I am aware of:
Seeing the words appear on screen, simply = light, movement, colour
Smelling.... , simply = sensation in nose, no smell
Feeling fingers on keyboard, simply = sensations
Tasting..... simply = tingling sensation
Hearing the keyboard, simply = sound
Thought about writing, simply = thought

Is this what you meant? No added thoughts about what is happening. I was aware of lots of sensations, sounds, things in vision at the same time but the lists would be very long if everything was in!

I became aware of a certain sort of thought which I would label "running commentary" e.g. "now I'm sitting listening" or "now I'm getting up to walk downstairs" which feels as if it gets in the way of simply experiencing what is there.

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Anastacia42
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Sun Jan 08, 2023 9:43 pm

Good. Those are exactly right. Right answers aren't the point here, though.

How does it FEEL to SEE this way?
which feels as if it gets in the way of simply experiencing what is there.
Yes, it does.

Here's another to take it a step farther:

Mind Labeling Experience

Here is an exercise which examines the way in which the mind labels experience - it takes about 20 minutes and you will need a pen a paper.

This exercise is broken into 10 minute lots. For each 10 minute period pay attention to any bodily sensation i.e. is there any tightening, or any relaxing?

For the first ten minutes write down what you are experiencing right now using the word “I”.

For example:

I am sitting on a chair,
I am hearing a clock ticking,
I am looking at a computer screen,
I am feeling hungry.

Get right to the point, no past or future fantasy, just a plain description of your experience right here and now.

Then for the next ten minutes continue writing down what you are experiencing but this time without using the word “I”. Just describe the experience as it is happening using verbs.

For example:

Sitting on a chair,
typing,
breathing,
blinking,
hearing the clock.

(Again, watch what is happening in the body.)

At the end of the twenty minutes compare the two ways in which the experience was labelled and answer the following four questions:

1. Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?

2. What is here without labels?

3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?

4. Did you notice any differences in the body?

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Mon Jan 09, 2023 1:10 pm

From yesterday
How does it FEEL to SEE this way?
I feel unsure how to answer this - earlier you said
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
I think to be honest when I did yesterday's exercise writing down the observations in the list I felt uncomfortable, constrained, a bit dull. It was actually hard to 'feel' anything.

But today's exercise with the 10 minute chunks felt very very different. I'll try to answer the questions:
1. Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?
The second 10 minutes, without the "I" felt much easier, a flow, as if I was just with what was happening, no manipulation, no complication, more pure, just easy
2. What is here without labels?
just the experience, just enjoyment, just what is happening, all the same but without complication. what is here is more flow and ease, such a strange change from one to the other it's hard to believe. Seeing the same things happen but such ease in the second way - how can that be?
3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?
In the first 10 minutes the labels did affect the experience. It felt tangled, a bit complicated, when I look at the lists I can see more there were more thoughts about the past and future, trying to compare my experience or change my experience or judge my experience. even though I was able to let go of the thoughts, they were mostly unpleasant and anxious. Experience felt more 'jerky' in the first 10 minutes, as if I was trying to change it all the time.
4. Did you notice any differences in the body?
this bit was the real shock! in the first 10 minutes I noticed the following: clenching my jaw, having a lump in my throat, biting my tongue. In the second 10 minutes I notice the following: relaxing my stomach (without thinking about it before), smiling a HUGE smile, relaxing my jaw. There was also less written in the second 10 minutes, as if time slowed or was more even. Just all in all it felt enjoyable, easy.

I really can't believe the difference here between these two. The same really simple things were happening but something made a huge change. I am stunned.

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Anastacia42
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Mon Jan 09, 2023 3:29 pm

Okay, you're having trouble because you are only thinking. Remember Colored Socks? LOOK
I think to be honest when I did yesterday's exercise writing down the observations in the list I felt uncomfortable, constrained, a bit dull. It was actually hard to 'feel' anything.
Those ARE kind of feelings. There is some interpretation & we do not want that. But it is close. Tight doesn't have cash much interpretation for example.
The second 10 minutes, without the "I" felt much easier, a flow, as if I was just with what was happening, no manipulation, no complication, more pure, just easy
Good! That's how truth feels.

Seeing the same things happen but such ease in the second way - how can that be?
Because you dropped the lie of "I."

All very good, except that labels never change things. I'll give you pointers on that, but first...

Here is how to distinguish truth from lies.


We often lie every day & don't realize it.

For example, the grocery clerk asks, "How are you?" You reply, "I'm fine." While, yes. there is a sense in which we are always fine, even in the middle of suffering, at that moment, you were grieving the death of your dog, you had a slight sore throat & you had a headache, but you didn't feel like sharing all of that with the grocery clerk, so you lied, "I'm fine."

Also, it matters none at all how "distant" the remembered lie is. Besides the fact that time itself is fictional, a kind if lie, as we recall the lie it becomes present in this moment, as if it were happening now. This brings the body Sensation that accompanies lying.

Lies can be intentional or unintentional, conscious or unconscious, even so automatic that we ourselves are fooled.

The story of a separate "self" is a lie.

This is the lie you came here to see through. Therefore, it is helpful to notice the body Sensation of lying as one of the tools for finding the truth of no self.

You want to be in touch with body Sensations & able to clearly express them in words. This will help.

Lies are usually felt in the heart or solar plexus as a contraction that we may label as tight, heavy or tense.

In contrast, truth is usually expansive. We may call it loose, light or relaxed.

First, can you remember a time when you lied to someone you loved?

Here we count anything, lies we think of as "big" or "small" that "matter" or don't "matter."

How are you? I'm fine. No, your knee hurts, but you don't feel like discussing it with the grocery clerk.

It's a lie. A seemingly "bigger" one will work better for this exercise.

Find the lie. I don't need the whole story, just a few key words to refer to it.

Then scan your body for any Sensation (DE or Direct Experience), particularly in the gut or maybe the heart. Check very closely.

What is found?

If you think the memory you used wasn't clear enough, find another one or lie to yourself right now, make something up.

1 + 1 = 14 is a lie.

I love eating worms is (probably) a lie.

Or call up a video of a lying politician & notice what Sensations arise as you listen.

I will give you a clue: it is not that peaceful Sensation you felt before when you omitted "I." (refers to an exercise I gave before this one)

Please report back with what body Sensations (not interpretations) you feel. Bodies can feel hot or cold, heavy or light, contraction or expansion, etc.

"Peaceful" is an interpretation of a body Sensation, not the Sensation itself, for example.

Do you see that?

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Tue Jan 10, 2023 5:07 pm

Do you see that?
Yes I can see that the sensations are different from the interpretation, which doesn't tell you what was actually FELT in the body, only what was thought about it.

What is found?

so when I did this, initially when I brought to mind a BIG lie I had told in the past, there were just so many fast-moving thoughts going on it was hard to notice any physical sensations other than that. Lots of thoughts and picture moving fast. So then I thought of smaller lies or omissions and noticed that there were very particular subtle feelings associated with them which were: a sense of pressure in the upper chest, like a hand pushing gently against it. At the same time a tingling in the hands and slight dizziness. This happened over and over again. I practised by saying the untruths out loud and those same sensations were always there. To check it out, I said the truthful versions instead - those sensations were absent.

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Anastacia42
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Wed Jan 11, 2023 1:15 am

Okay, now let's check back into whether labels attest l affect things or not.


Label-Reality Correlation

There is a belief that labels have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’. But there isn’t. Just like it is a generally accepted belief that labels like ‘good’ and ‘bad’ are inherent characteristics of ‘things’. But actually, they are not.

When you look at the word label ‘GREEN' , what is the actual experience?

Is the color red ‘experienced’, or is the color green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests?

Does the label ‘GREEN’ have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’? Or does the label suggest something else other than what is here now (red colour)?

Is 'green' associated in any way with the experience of the colour red; or is green just a label that overlays the actual experience of red?

If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’ , is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?

Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no affect whatsoever on ‘reality’?

Let me know what is SEEN.


Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Wed Jan 11, 2023 1:19 pm

When you look at the word label ‘GREEN' , what is the actual experience?
When I look at the word label 'GREEN' I see a red word
Is the color red ‘experienced’, or is the color green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests?
the colour red is experienced. nothing green. although in my mind a picture of a leaf appeared briefly! but this was in the mind, not with the eyes.
Does the label ‘GREEN’ have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’? Or does the label suggest something else other than what is here now (red colour)?
It has no correspondence with 'reality'. There is no such thing as 'GREEN', only objects that are a particular colour. 'Green-ness' but no green!
Is 'green' associated in any way with the experience of the colour red; or is green just a label that overlays the actual experience of red?
the actual experience of looking at the word was of red. Green didn't correspond to anything that was experienced via sight.
If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’ , is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?
no, the experience is still of red
Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no affect whatsoever on ‘reality’?
the label has no effect on the reality of red

Let me know what is SEEN.

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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Wed Jan 11, 2023 2:47 pm

Great!, Izzy, yes.

Now this:

Friend/Stranger

Bring up a thought about a character labeled "friend."

Then bring up a thought about a character labeled "stranger."

Compare these thoughts.

Is there a difference in these thoughts?

Is there a true difference or is it just different content?

Now, bring up a thought about a character labeled "friend."

After that, look at a thought about the character labelled "me.”

Is there a difference?

Is there anything special about thoughts with the content "me-character?"

Let me know what is found.


Labeling the day, the Sensations, etc. does nothing to reduce their beauty or joy, but can hide them from our awareness.

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Wed Jan 11, 2023 3:18 pm

Ok Stacy, now I'm bring to mind these thoughts of friend.... then stranger..... I hope I have understood correctly. A picture in the mind, some internal words, a physical sensation are what I experience.
Is there a difference in these thoughts?
there's a difference in the picture in my mind. a slight difference in the bodily sensations. some internal words.
Is there a true difference or is it just different content?
well... the thoughts are just thoughts... they came and they went. the content was different but the thought was just a thought.

Now, bring up a thought about a character labeled "friend."
okay, as before, a picture, a sensation, some words.
After that, look at a thought about the character labelled "me.”
some words about myself..... something I need to do.....
Is there a difference?
they're just things happening in my mind. in my mind.
Is there anything special about thoughts with the content "me-character?"
the thoughts about the "me-character" feel more familiar, is this what "me" is - just familiar thoughts????

Let me know what is found.

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Wed Jan 11, 2023 3:49 pm

Everything happens by itself!!!

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Anastacia42
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Thu Jan 12, 2023 2:05 pm

Yes, everything happens by itself.

Yes, "me" is just familiar thoughts.

How does it FEEL to see this?

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti

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Izzy2022
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Izzy2022 » Thu Jan 12, 2023 2:17 pm

How does it FEEL to see this?
Staci, I've been sitting quietly a lot of this morning just testing out this new seeing. The nearest I can say to how it feels is that a burden has been laid down. The labels that I've used for everything, including myself, seem like clumsy over-generalisations that create a distance from just seeing things as they are. Early today when I awoke, I could hear rain outside. But then the me hearing faded away and there was only the sound, the hearing, everything came into focus. What I'd thought of as me - Izzy - just felt like an Izzy-ness in the world. Even my name seems so 'clunky', what does it even tell someone about what is happening? What is happening just changes from moment to moment. All those big assumptions! "I like this, I don't like that"! What a distraction from just feeling what is happening! Those familiar thoughts and feeling - they're just what they are. I don't have to go along with them. And - even more miraculous - the fear is not there. It's as if there's something sparkling about life. I tested this more by looking in the mirror and saying "that's me" to myself - but what I see is just part of the world, like the leafiness of "leafs", this is the Izzy-ness of "me". It's so simple when you see it! Like water sliding off a leaf.

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Anastacia42
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Re: Hi from Izzy

Postby Anastacia42 » Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:26 pm

Welcome home, Izzy. This indicates you have probably crossed the Gateless Gate.

We have some traditional "final" questions, although really, this is just the beginning of unraveling all the untrue thinking we've learned over a lifetime.

Would you like to attempt these questions? No rush.

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Thought is a garbage can. If you look into the garbage can, all you will get is garbage."

~ Adyashanti


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