Deja Vu

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,
Weekends are a lot of running around and about. I want to take time to do the exercises. Will get back toy.ou today or tomorrow
Thank you,
~ela

[Anastacia42]

That's fine.

Maybe keep up your momentum by LOOKING when you can.

Much love

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

How is the movement controlled?

When looking at what appears, as seeing only without thoughts, it is obvious that the hand flips all on its own and that nothing helps it or makes it do so.
The intention to move the hand can appear, and thoughts that say “I am moving my hand”, yet the hand still moves on its own (how magical, haha)

Does a thought control it?

No, the thought cannot control it, the thought appears/happens just like the movement.

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

It does not seem to be any controller, other than thoughts that might claim there is.

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

The “decision” or “intention” is spontaneous. It happens “on its own” if I could say that.

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately

Not sure I understand this question. The decision is the thought. The hand moves on its own.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

No, the movement happen on its own.

Thank you,
~Ela

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

How is the movement controlled?

When looking at what appears, as seeing only without thoughts, it is obvious that the hand flips all on its own and that nothing helps it or makes it do so.
The intention to move the hand can appear, and thoughts that say “I am moving my hand”, yet the hand still moves on its own (how magical, haha)

Does a thought control it?

No, the thought cannot control it, the thought appears/happens just like the movement.

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

It does not seem to be any controller, other than thoughts that might claim there is.

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

The “decision” or “intention” is spontaneous. It happens “on its own” if I could say that.

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately

Not sure I understand this question. The decision is the thought. The hand moves on its own.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

No, the movement happen on its own.

Thank you,
~Ela

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

How is the movement controlled?

When looking at what appears, as seeing only without thoughts, it is obvious that the hand flips all on its own and that nothing helps it or makes it do so.
The intention to move the hand can appear, and thoughts that say “I am moving my hand”, yet the hand still moves on its own (how magical, haha)

Does a thought control it?

No, the thought cannot control it, the thought appears/happens just like the movement.

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

It does not seem to be any controller, other than thoughts that might claim there is.

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

The “decision” or “intention” is spontaneous. It happens “on its own” if I could say that.

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately

Not sure I understand this question. The decision is the thought. The hand moves on its own.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

No, the movement happen on its own.

Thank you,
~Ela

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

How is the movement controlled?

When looking at what appears, as seeing only without thoughts, it is obvious that the hand flips all on its own and that nothing helps it or makes it do so.
The intention to move the hand can appear, and thoughts that say “I am moving my hand”, yet the hand still moves on its own (how magical, haha)

Does a thought control it?

No, the thought cannot control it, the thought appears/happens just like the movement.

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

It does not seem to be any controller, other than thoughts that might claim there is.

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

The “decision” or “intention” is spontaneous. It happens “on its own” if I could say that.

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately

Not sure I understand this question. The decision is the thought. The hand moves on its own.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

No, the movement happen on its own.

Thank you,
~Ela

[Anastacia42]

Hi Ela,

Good work.

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately
Not sure I understand this question. The decision is the thought. The hand moves on its own.

Possibly because it makes no sense? We ask a lot of questions like this when the answer is "that doesn't happen." Thoughts do not make decisions, but people think that they do. Yes, the hand moves on its own.

How does it FEEL to see this?

Are you replying from what is SEEN? Or only from thinking?

Loving,
Stacy

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

How does it FEEL to see this?

It doesn't feel like a strong way in particular. At times it feels funny/surprising, sometimes there is a clarity/observation without thought commentary, sometimes it may feel a bit uncomfortable, as in lightheadedness or fainting like feeling.
as if the whole space is empty and something looking for a grasp.

Are you replying from what is SEEN? Or only from thinking?

I replied from the seeing but there are also thoughts while seeking for the best/accurate words to describe the experience.

~Ela

[Anastacia42]

That's great, Ela!

At times it feels funny/surprising, sometimes there is a clarity/observation without thought commentary, sometimes it may feel a bit uncomfortable, as in lightheadedness or fainting like feeling.
as if the whole space is empty and something looking for a grasp.

Yes! That all sounds like SEEING, particularly the lightheadedness & empty & space. It's safe to let go & feel that. It can feel quite blissful & joyful. That's just an extreme truth feeling - very expansive.


Actual/Direct Experience - Apple

Have a look at an apple (or any fruit you like.) If you have a ‘real’ apple, you can use it for this exercise. Google for a picture of an apple.



When looking at an apple, there's color; a thought saying ‘apple’; and maybe a thought saying, "I'm looking at an apple."

What is known for sure? Color is known and thoughts are known.

What about the content of thoughts, what they describe?

Actual experience does not refer to thoughts ABOUT something…because that is only just more thought.

Actual experience is sound, thought, color, smell, taste, sensation and the fact of thought arising, but not its content.

Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?

Can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience?

While these thoughts are known, what they talk ABOUT can't be found in actual experience.

This is what is meant by "looking in actual experience." What you know for sure, and, is always here.

Taste labeled ‘apple’ is known
Color labeled ‘apple’ is known
Sensation labeled ‘apple’ is known (when apple is touched)
Smell labeled ‘apple’ is known
Thought about/of an ‘apple’ is known

However, is an apple actually known?

Have fun and let me know what you find out.

Loving,

Stacy

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

I didn't even get to the end of your message and I realized there is no apple! And it happened with an exercise before, don't remember which, however, there was the seeing/ realization that there are no things at all. In fact I already knew.this, perhaps not to a deeper realization, so to say.
Also, there is an intense thought activity happening so it tends to cover up the direct experience. It feels extremely uncomfortable at times, especially when I need to sleep or when I woke up in the middle of the night.

As far as the lightheadedness or fainting spells, they also can be uncomfortable, as I feel as if I am suspended nowhere somewhere in the air or feel ike I may go through the floor (or at least I imagine)
No, I do not have a mental diseas, lol

~ela

[Anastacia42]

Good to hear. Yes, I know you don't have any mental disease!

;)

[Anastacia42]

I can give more pointers while you settle in, but it sounds like you've got this.

Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?


This exercise might be somewhat grounding for you:

The clearer you get, the less words you may need. You got it & you're doing great.

Let's look at how necessary (or not) all of those words & thoughts are.

Stream Exercise

Imagine for a moment a scene, one of a little mountain stream which is tumbling down a hillside gully, not far from its source. It has been raining and so the level is quite high.

Consider in your mind's eye, if you can, how it flows to the right over a little rock (where, had the level been lower, it would probably have gone around the rock), then the flow goes to the left over a tree bow, and then slows a little in a broader place, before splashing over a small cascade into a pool, and so on down the mountain side.

Does it choose any of its directions? Is it even really a separate entity different from the water deposited in it, the rocks, the depressions in the ground etc? Is it even the same entity moment by moment, or more the product of weather conditions and water, like an ever-changing pattern?

1. Can you find anywhere where "Ela" autonomously intervenes into life, choosing something that is not the product of all the elements; that is not a part of the overall flow?

2. Now please consider a regular decision made eg; what to wear in the morning, or what to eat for lunch, and describe to me what happens. There are environmental factors, there are colour preferences (but where did those come from - any autonomous intervention there perhaps?), practical issues (such as what is available), available time for preparation, purpose (eg; need to fill up for the day, or to look hip and cool for that person!) etc.

Where in there is an autonomous entity intervening in the flow of life? Can you find someone somewhere?

3. Can anything be found for which 'Ela' is responsible – if so responsible to what and for what?

Relax & have fun!

Loving,

~ Stacy

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

Just like there is no "apple", there are many a thoughts about a me/I and its story of a lifetime, but no real entity as an I. I am afraid Ela/I is only a projection, an idea. a thought, a big story, ha!

Can you find anywhere where "Ela" autonomously intervenes into life, choosing something that is not the product of all the elements; that is not a part of the overall flow?

As Ela is an idea/concept, it becomes obvious that any decision simply “appears” as part of the “flow” of life, if we can even call it a flow anymore. Because I am not sure if there is any connection between two moments, or that is just another thought. And this so called life flow makes up “Ela”
In which case she is absolved of all mistakes and blames and suffering, isn’t that awesome lol
What a relief. All s#!t evaporates, lol. Of course, she is also stripped of all skills and merits ahhaha!

Can you find someone somewhere?

All someones are projections, just as the “apple”, or Ela. The human world is the “apple” haha

:)

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

Just like there is no "apple", there are many a thoughts about a me/I and its story of a lifetime, but no real entity as an I. I am afraid Ela/I is only a projection, an idea. a thought, a big story, ha!

Can you find anywhere where "Ela" autonomously intervenes into life, choosing something that is not the product of all the elements; that is not a part of the overall flow?

As Ela is an idea/concept, it becomes obvious that any decision simply “appears” as part of the “flow” of life, if we can even call it a flow anymore. Because I am not sure if there is any connection between two moments, or that is just another thought. And this so called life flow makes up “Ela”
In which case she is absolved of all mistakes and blames and suffering, isn’t that awesome lol
What a relief. All s#!t evaporates, lol. Of course, she is also stripped of all skills and merits ahhaha!

Can you find someone somewhere?

All someones are projections, just as the “apple”, or Ela. The human world is the “apple” haha

:)

[ElaBlue]

Hi Stacy,

Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

Just like there is no "apple", there are many a thoughts about a me/I and its story of a lifetime, but no real entity as an I. I am afraid Ela/I is only a projection, an idea. a thought, a big story, ha!

Can you find anywhere where "Ela" autonomously intervenes into life, choosing something that is not the product of all the elements; that is not a part of the overall flow?

As Ela is an idea/concept, it becomes obvious that any decision simply “appears” as part of the “flow” of life, if we can even call it a flow anymore. Because I am not sure if there is any connection between two moments, or that is just another thought. And this so called life flow makes up “Ela”
In which case she is absolved of all mistakes and blames and suffering, isn’t that awesome lol
What a relief. All s#!t evaporates, lol. Of course, she is also stripped of all skills and merits ahhaha!

Can you find someone somewhere?

All someones are projections, just as the “apple”, or Ela. The human world is the “apple” haha

:)