You bet...!However I suspect you are not about to give up on me, and will have another question or two.
Doesn't seem that way.I don't think I am trying to mislead you
but then do I have doubts about where I am in regard to seeing the folly of "me".
With the passing of each day in which I live in this relaxed way, my doubt subsides. Each day I wake up in a relaxed state of mind rather than anxiety adds to my my confidence that "I" has disappeared. Remember I was the expert in anxiety, depression and panic attack. None of this stuff is much fun I can assure you. But I promise that if any of these things return you will be the first to hear about it. Before my interaction with you it would be rare for me to go a week without anxiety and some poor sleep patterns. So I am looking to see if these changes will continue into weeks and months.but then do I have doubts about where I am in regard to seeing the folly of "me".
Well, let's take a look at that then.
Go into some detail. Describe what has happened, what is seen now.
What is "me"?
I am sorry you think I am trying to mislead you. If I am misleading you, it is not on purpose, I promise! I am eager to hear if you still believe this.
However you are the guide and so I will continue to answer your questions as best I can. I remain very happy with the space I'm in right now and the result so far. If there are more questions to go, that's great, I'm ready and I will continue to do my best.
That is great! Really nice. Yet, we're not *there* yet. There is further to go.With the passing of each day in which I live in this relaxed way, my doubt subsides. Each day I wake up in a relaxed state of mind rather than anxiety adds to my my confidence that "I" has disappeared. Remember I was the expert in anxiety, depression and panic attack. None of this stuff is much fun I can assure you. But I promise that if any of these things return you will be the first to hear about it. Before my interaction with you it would be rare for me to go a week without anxiety and some poor sleep patterns. So I am looking to see if these changes will continue into weeks and months.
It's absolutely wonderful to read that something is shifting here- you seem to be experiencing the reality of interdependence and non-separation. Amazing.So what I have been seeing is life, as always, happening but I am watching it happen, rather than feeling that I am making it happen and have to effort and struggle for survival at an acceptable level. It also appears most of the fear of the future has disappeared and I now feel that what ever happens will be ok. Another feeling I am getting is that there is a level playing field. The feeling of; not enough what ever, money, competence, education, success etc has gone.
So to the question; what is me? I have to say I can only talk about this in a historical way. I have an awareness centered around the body referred to as Alan. However this body is forever changing and is part of a huge process that is in constant change. As a separate constant being, "me" does not exist. While I have been familiar with this as a theory for many years, I am now experiencing it for the first time.
I still direct this body, the old me, make plans and execute them, but as part of the whole rather than a separate individual. I believe I have seen the self as an idea rather than a real separate individual. When you suggest the observer may be subtly separate from whats being observed, it is too subtle for me to notice at present. Maybe you are right. I will keep looking at what is apparent.Yet the observer is still subtly separated from what's being observed, isn't it?
Well, it seems that way, but is it true?
My suggestion is that these three apparent elements are in fact ONE SEAMLESS WHOLE:
all there is, is experiencing: this experiencing.
The observer, the watcher is only ever a thought. An idea.
This can be seen to be true. To have always been true.
Check it out.
What's your experience- are YOU experiencing this?
Nice! Enjoy. I'll be offline for the weekend.My son is arriving tonight for a couple of days so I may be absent for a day or so but will be eager to keep the process going. With great appreciation. Alan
Now this is where this investigation is getting really interesting, so pay close attention.I still direct this body, the old me, make plans and execute them, but as part of the whole rather than a separate individual. I believe I have seen the self as an idea rather than a real separate individual.
YOU direct the body?I still direct this body, the old me, make plans and execute them
It can't be still around or hiding out because it was never there in the first place.it possible the separate self is hiding out? I can't see any evidence to support that at the moment, but I will keep looking. I imagine there would be a relapse to old patterns of feelings and behavior if the individual separate me was still around.
It is at this point that the English language becomes a bit clumsy. The you is implying a separate individual, however the you that I am talking about is the whole, it is not separate. The universe is evolving, stuff is happening all the time. As I am the universe, stuff is happening through the process of me, the whole me, not the individual me. It seems very clumsy what I have just written, but it is probably as good as it gets with English.YOU direct the body?
Take a step back and observe the process.
Describe to me, in detail, an instance of YOU directing the body, YOU making plans, YOU executing them.
HOW exactly does a YOU come into play in the process of bodily movement, making and executing plans.
Be thorough, be scientific in your approach. Leave nothing out. Look, look, look.
Is a YOU necessary for any of this to happen?
I disagree big time. If something can be put into words at all, it can be put into words clearly.It is at this point that the English language becomes a bit clumsy. The you is implying a separate individual, however the you that I am talking about is the whole, it is not separate. The universe is evolving, stuff is happening all the time. As I am the universe, stuff is happening through the process of me, the whole me, not the individual me. It seems very clumsy what I have just written, but it is probably as good as it gets with English.
I know this could be taken as a metaphor, but for the sake of clarity I want you to describe, experientially, what this sentence means exactly? What is it saying?As I am the universe
Too vague, Alan.stuff is happening through the process of me, the whole me, not the individual me.
Does that question even make sense?Has the universe, god, whatever, created people to have people stuff happening. You will have to help me with this one. I'm stuck.
Nice, nice!!! It's really good to read that.Just a quick update. It is over a week now since you lead me to see my own unreality on the 24th Aug. So I have been monitoring my mental health since then. No sleep disturbances, no anxiety and no depression. Occasionally a scary thought will pop into my mind but almost as quick it dissolves. So life is going very nicely, more of an adventure I would say and I do love adventure. I used to have to sail off into the wilderness to get my adventure. Now I can get it at home as well, just doing my work and living my life. So how good is that?
This is a never-ending process, Alan. There is no arriving anywhere, no one to arrive anywhere. How could there be?If I'm still deluded, that is fine. This delusion is much preferable to the pre 24th Aug one. If there is more seeing to happen, I am very keen.
Likewise!I feel blessed
You're welcome!!!and thankyou again.
Since I have seen that there is no separation between me and the the rest of the goings on of it all, and there is only one process, I do not exist!!!!! Even though you may call me Alan, are you are complicit in a delusion? However there is some sort of stuff happening which involves part of the process, Damon communicating with another of the process, Alan. These names represent things that are not real, even though we have birth certificates and passports and the "system" can argue a case for us to exist. However the system is is unaware of the unreality of itself and all the components that make it up. So life on earth is looking more like a play or a movie with most of the players unaware of the fact that they don't actually exist. Thank god for that I say!As I am the universe
I know this could be taken as a metaphor, but for the sake of clarity I want you to describe, experientially, what this sentence means exactly? What is it saying?
Most of society has decided that I came into existence when I was physically separated from my mother on my birthday. It has also decided that that I am contained within a bag of skin and have some unique features which can identify me as separate from other human beings. This is "the individual me". However I can see the unreality of this arbitrary chopping up of things in the universal process. Since all separation is arbitrary "the process of me" is the universe. "The whole me" is also the universe. Maybe I should just stick to one title here.stuff is happening through the process of me, the whole me, not the individual me.
Too vague, Alan.
What is "the process of me"?
What is "the whole me"?
What is "the individual me"?
Has the universe, god, whatever, created people to have people stuff happening. You will have to help me with this one. I'm stuck.
Does that question even make sense?
Well there can't be. So I'm left in awe again. I'm sure I got to see yet more in answering these last questions. Wow wow wow I am free of a lot of illusion! I have felt another weight off me this session.This is a never-ending process, Alan. There is no arriving anywhere, no one to arrive anywhere. How could there be?
Please feel free to be as painful as you wish. I cannot thankyou enough. AlanI know I'm a huge pain in the butt, but that is my job here.
Much clearer, thank you!!!Since I have seen that there is no separation between me and the the rest of the goings on of it all, and there is only one process, I do not exist!!!!! Even though you may call me Alan, are you are complicit in a delusion? However there is some sort of stuff happening which involves part of the process, Damon communicating with another of the process, Alan. These names represent things that are not real, even though we have birth certificates and passports and the "system" can argue a case for us to exist. However the system is is unaware of the unreality of itself and all the components that make it up. So life on earth is looking more like a play or a movie with most of the players unaware of the fact that they don't actually exist. Thank god for that I say!
Allright. This has become somewhat of a tradition here. The idea is that you answer, as always, from direct experience alone and allow the words to flow freely. Give us a rant.Yes please!
There is no me, there never was. Similarly there is no self. All division of the one process of the universe into parts is arbitrary.1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever? how about self, is there anything that is separate from everything else?
In the early years of a humans life it is unaware of the concept of it's self as a separate being. At some stage in a child's development it develops the concept of it's self as a separate being. The English language and system of civilization support and reinforce this illusory concept of the separate accountable self. This illusion gives rise to feelings, thoughts action and results that are often undesirable and can cause a lot of pain in peoples lives. By seeing through the illusion of self, people are able to liberate them selves from much of the pain, effort struggle and confusion caused by living this illusion. In reality there is no where to go, nothing to get or become. Life can be played as a game instead of some serious undertaking.2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.
In my case the realization, I did not exist, triggered a feeling of euphoria for one day. Subsequent days I was feeling relief that much of the fear, anxiety, sadness and depression that had been present in my life had departed. The struggle to achieve has fallen away but at the same time achievement has continued in a more effortless way. Concern about the past and future have also diminished. Living this way feels more like an adventure. There is less need for restraint and at the same time a trust that everything will be fine. The revelation was accompanied with quite a bit of laughing. I have found my periods of exhaustion and problems sleeping have been much reduced as have my coping behaviors such as drinking too much overeating watching television excessively.3) How does it feel to see this? Describe in detail.
The observation that all division into parts, is arbitrary, is an easy enough concept to grasp. As this must also encompass our separate self. But it does require that disciplined focused looking to actually feel it rather than simply understand it intellectually. This focused looking really is the special ingredient which changed my perception. The separate self can now be seen as Santa Claus or the tooth fairy, a made up character with no reality. Once the falsity of the self is seen, it can not be unseen, just as the the child who sees the falsity behind Santa can not believe in it again. This awareness, without awareness of a self, is a state that some people are able to remember from early childhood. It was Jesus who said “I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven".4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it?
The attempt to define myself gave rise to the first revelation. Since I could not define myself accurately, the attempt to try, lead me to see that I really did not exist. This was followed with an immediate feeling of relief and euphoria.5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look? was there a specific moment when seeing happened or was it gradual? what exactly happened?
This is the point I had it all falling into place;It is at this point that the English language becomes a bit clumsy. The you is implying a separate individual, however the you that I am talking about is the whole, it is not separate. The universe is evolving, stuff is happening all the time. As I am the universe, stuff is happening through the process of me, the whole me, not the individual me. It seems very clumsy what I have just written, but it is probably as good as it gets with English.
I disagree big time. If something can be put into words at all, it can be put into words clearly.
I know I'm a huge pain in the butt, but that is my job here. I want you to look again, closely, and FOCUS.
Thanks for your great gift. AlanThis is a never-ending process, Alan. There is no arriving anywhere, no one to arrive anywhere. How could there be?
Well there can't be. So I'm left in awe again. I'm sure I got to see yet more in answering these last questions. Wow wow wow I am free of a lot of illusion! I have felt another weight off me this session.
Could you elaborate a bit?Alan: "This awareness, without awareness of a self, is a state that some people are able to remember from early childhood." Not sure what he means by - "awareness, without awareness of a self."
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