Guiding beyond gate

[s-p-a-c-e]

Hi Anne,

I intellectually know there is nothing to be lost. But feelings and other thoughts suggest otherwise.

Good. The conditioning of 'Anne' is there in the thoughts and the emotions. It's conditioning.
This is the fixation you need to break.
A sneaky part of you doesn't want to break it, wants to hold on to 'Anne'.
Recognise that sneaky part and give it a sneaky hug.

There is a body, senses and thought and feelings which are not controlled by Anne. Anne is a fiction and was given to me as name after birth. Even without a name stuff would happen anyway. There is life and experiencing anyway.

Yep, you go on living with all your talents and mischief. ;)

Lifting right arm and claiming Anne did it, is thoughts explaining what happened.
Arm lifted and thoughts claimed. But Anne didnt do it bc she is fiction. Adding ‘Anne did it’ suggests, she has control over it but she doesnt.

Yes, it's utter nonsense.

Anne is a label or container for body and what fear wants to protect and memories and beliefs and habits and likes and dislikes and learned ways of perceiving.

Breathing just happens without thinking. I can’t see or feel owner of breathing.

When observe, we observe what we observe?
Can you observe observing?
Try as hard as you can.

John

[Anne71]

When observe, we observe what we observe?

I would define ‘observing’ as watching thoughts and emotions.
So i would say we observe what is sensed and is interpreted by perceptions.

Can you observe observing?

I read, that true meditation is turning conciousness (i would say observing) back on conciousness.

Try as hard as you can.

(Well i’ll ignore the semantics of ‘try’.)
I tried several times. Even in the last days. Maybe i need more pratice.

I guess observing is the same like thoughts, thoughts cant think and do stuff. They are just there.
So observing just happens but it is not ‘me’ or an agent, that can do stuff.

Being that the case there might be something behind or containing thought and observing and senses.

So, if you could turn around observing, you should see the source.

??

[s-p-a-c-e]

So i would say we observe what is sensed and is interpreted by perceptions.

Yeah, we can observe a cup, a landscape, a feeling, clouds, yawning, farting.

Can you observe observing?

I read, that true meditation is turning conciousness (i would say observing) back on conciousness.

We keep it simple, observing can't be observed, only what is observed.
We might observe something and call that 'observing', but that wouldn't be observing, just some idea of 'observing'.

To use advaita language, observing is happening.
This living human being is you.
You are observing.
You made-up 'Anne' and so, are not 'Anne'.

You are like a living flame with no need of a social identity.
Sure, you can play 'Anne' whenever need be, no problem.
You might even enjoy playing 'Anne', and seeing the persona of 'Anne' change.
And you are not 'Anne'.

You are you.

Much love,
John

[Anne71]

I already wrote this...

Words are complicated.
I am not even sure if conciousness and observing and awareness have the same definitions for you as for me.

Conciousness is me. (or maybe there is even something above conciousness, i dont know. When i am unconcious i am still alive.).
Conciousness observes or is aware by focussing

At the entrance there are sensations and thinking and emotions.
These are filtered and interpreted by perceptions.
When focus is there, we are aware/observe.

I am aware that i am aware of my thoughts when i remember them and write them down for you.

I have not experienced being aware while being aware of s.th. (yet).
It is never at the same time but one after the other.
Like: there are toughts, following thoughts, there are even thoughts commenting on thoughts i had, but i have never had a thought and were thinking about that thought at the same time. There is only one layer or slot for thought.
The same i experienced with observing. I observe s.th. and after that i can observe that i observed. Or am i wrong here?

The only time i remember during meditation, i was having the beginning of a thought, but did not finish it and instead thought commented ‘i already know where that thought is going. Dont need it now.’. In my perception this was one thought after another.

Its hard for me to speak about this, because i am confused about vocabulary. And all the different stuff authors are writing. And me mixing buddhism and nonduality and other stuff i dont even know what its called. :)) it's a mess :))

I am me.
With (some) responsibility
And (some) control.
The difference to Anne is, that i am not content of stories, i observe them. ?

[s-p-a-c-e]

Conciousness is me. (or maybe there is even something above conciousness, i dont know. When i am unconcious i am still alive.).
Conciousness observes or is aware by focussing

We're better sticking to practical matters.
Observe. That's all that is required.

The same i experienced with observing. I observe s.th. and after that i can observe that i observed. Or am i wrong here?

Yes, observing is unobservable, but thoughts about what was observed, are observed.

Its hard for me to speak about this, because i am confused about vocabulary. And all the different stuff authors are writing. And me mixing buddhism and nonduality and other stuff i dont even know what its called. :)) it's a mess :))

Yeah, we'll use everyday kitchen sink vocabulary. No need for any fancy religious words.

I am me.
With (some) responsibility
And (some) control.
The difference to Anne is, that i am not content of stories, i observe them. ?

Often I read these are 'just stories', but these are way more than words.
Were they only words then the whole world would have seen the error of this self-perception.
Buddha would be out of a job. :D

'Anne', 'John' is conditioned in our psychology, emotions, physicality.
You could say the word made flesh. :)
Someone said that once.

Which is how come it feels so intrinsic and real.

When you bring that whole sense of being 'Anne', you ask, ok, this is 'Anne', I feel it, I sense it.
Now, is this an entity, a being in its own right?
Or have I made that whole shit up?

Much love,
John

[Anne71]

Hi John,

Often I read these are 'just stories', but these are way more than words.
Were they only words then the whole world would have seen the error of this self-perception.
Buddha would be out of a job. :D

'Anne', 'John' is conditioned in our psychology, emotions, physicality.
You could say the word made flesh. :)
Someone said that once.

Which is how come it feels so intrinsic and real.

EX ACT LY!

Yesterday and this morning i was super annoyed of my life. Wanted to give it back to somebody who needs time (maybe mother with three children and cancer).

I mean, whats left?
Looking at birds and smelling gras and counting the hills a mole digged in my flowerpatch (at the moment 4) in the last 12 hours.
Well the mole was there first.

When you bring that whole sense of being 'Anne', you ask, ok, this is 'Anne', I feel it, I sense it.
Now, is this an entity, a being in its own right?
Or have I made that whole shit up?

Its not an entity, it kind of assembled of thoughts and feelings and body bc family and others and later me behaving as if it was real. Everything that was observed was set into relation and connected with Anne.

.

What if this anger i am feeling is just energy? Being used to look outside, i think others caused this and named it ‘anger’. But what if, it is just energy looking for an outlet?

Even with the neighbour-problem, i am not sure it is Annes problem. It might be something learned from parents and grandparents - to mistrust nosey ppl.

So i am just observing but nothing belongs to me. I keep muddling along.

I know i keep asking about this responsibility stuff and you keep not answering :)
You know what? Fuck it. I dont care (at the moment). Its just mindstuff.

I dont know what this lifeshit is about and how it works and if i can do ANYthing.

I am not crying. I make Chuck Norris cry by hugging him.

Anne

[s-p-a-c-e]

Hi Anne,

Its not an entity, it kind of assembled of thoughts and feelings and body bc family and others and later me behaving as if it was real. Everything that was observed was set into relation and connected with Anne.

.

What if this anger i am feeling is just energy? Being used to look outside, i think others caused this and named it ‘anger’. But what if, it is just energy looking for an outlet?

Even with the neighbour-problem, i am not sure it is Annes problem. It might be something learned from parents and grandparents - to mistrust nosey ppl.

So i am just observing but nothing belongs to me. I keep muddling along.

I know i keep asking about this responsibility stuff and you keep not answering :)
You know what? Fuck it. I dont care (at the moment). Its just mindstuff.

I dont know what this lifeshit is about and how it works and if i can do ANYthing.

This kind of inquiry is often characterised as seeing, or looking. But really, what's important is the extent to which we are willing and open to receive.

By being open to receive, I mean being willing to open our hands and let go of our prize perceptions, the ones that keep us safe, the devils we know.

This is a condition of seeing anything.

I'm not sure right now whether you are in a place to receive more than you have thus far.

I may be wrong.

Look forward to your response.

Much love,
John

[Anne71]

Hi John,

:) seems like you see this as avoidance:

What if this anger i am feeling is just energy? Being used to look outside, i think others caused this and named it ‘anger’. But what if, it is just energy looking for an outlet?

Even with the neighbour-problem, i am not sure it is Annes problem. It might be something learned from parents and grandparents

This kind of inquiry is often characterised as seeing, or looking. But really, what's important is the extent to which we are willing and open to receive.

By being open to receive, I mean being willing to open our hands and let go of our prize perceptions, the ones that keep us safe, the devils we know.

What do you think is my prize perception? My devil?

I mean, its not that i killed somebody.
Maybe i dont want to let go ppl. who hurt Anne, yet. I am working towards that.

Or more generally speaking… what could a prize perception or devil may be?

This is a condition of seeing anything.

I dont know why i got agitated so much in the last 10 days. It kind of build up.
Maybe because looking at all the shame and fear.
I dont want to go on, living like that. So i have to look at it, sooner or later.
I dont think that intense emotions are bad. I think they are a sign of resistance and being in the perfect place to keep going. Its good that they got stirred up, after feeling ‘ok’ all the time and pushing them away. And my arguing is the ‘mind’ trying to find a way out. I am identified with it, but i notice later, that it belongs to a story.
That is why i found it super helpful when you wrote about stories being conditioned in emotion and body and psychology.
I am not sure if to follow emotion and thought to let them play out, or to stop them when i notice its the same story again. Theres a trigger and a belief and an emotion following.


What confused me is this unconditional accepting of me. This was meant to be Anne, right? Why build up something that is not real?

I'm not sure right now whether you are in a place to receive more than you have thus far.

I may be wrong.

I dont know.
You have more experience than me.


When i am identified, i am not open.

I got that i am a human being.
I observe thought and emotion and sensual stuff.
There is the fiction of Anne who was believed to be owner of all this.
Sometimes there is identification with thought or emotion or story.
Circumstances and feelings and thought can trigger each other.
I keep on reminding me to focus on me.
And to perceive problems i have with other ppl as my own shit.

Look forward to your response.

You chose me, so it is up to you, if you want to go on.
I know i can be a bit intense sometimes. But i am super committed.
I know i run in a lot of different and opposite directions. That is probable why i do not achieve very much and are exhausted anyway.

I’d love to keep going on with you.
Maybe its helpful to set some rules and use the zenwhip.

How’s your motivation level?

Big hug
Anne

[s-p-a-c-e]

Hi Anne,

What do you think is my prize perception? My devil?

'Anne'.

I mean, its not that i killed somebody.
Maybe i dont want to let go ppl. who hurt Anne, yet. I am working towards that.

It's more deflection away from 'Anne'.
No problem with deflection, we deflect because we don't want to face aspects of ourselves, but face them we will, sooner or later.

I dont know why i got agitated so much in the last 10 days. It kind of build up.
Maybe because looking at all the shame and fear.
I dont want to go on, living like that. So i have to look at it, sooner or later.
I dont think that intense emotions are bad. I think they are a sign of resistance and being in the perfect place to keep going. Its good that they got stirred up, after feeling ‘ok’ all the time and pushing them away. And my arguing is the ‘mind’ trying to find a way out. I am identified with it, but i notice later, that it belongs to a story.
That is why i found it super helpful when you wrote about stories being conditioned in emotion and body and psychology.
I am not sure if to follow emotion and thought to let them play out, or to stop them when i notice its the same story again. Theres a trigger and a belief and an emotion following.

Working with emotions/hurt etc is on-going and a way of making a clearing, the conditions of opening. It's like velcro. 'Anne' is a sticky form made of emotional hooks. To the extent that we leave our conditioning in place, the loops, then the hooks attach to loops.

What confused me is this unconditional accepting of me. This was meant to be Anne, right? Why build up something that is not real?

It's not the me, its the unconditional accepting.
When we don't accept, we resist.
We resist, we avoid.
It persists. No learning. Status quo.

Unconditional accepting is not unconditional agreeing!
It is taking what is happening, and recognising it, accepting it as happening, rather than wishing it wasn't and rejecting it, wanting to fix it, which creates a whole perfection dynamic.

When i am identified, i am not open.

I got that i am a human being.
I observe thought and emotion and sensual stuff.
There is the fiction of Anne who was believed to be owner of all this.
Sometimes there is identification with thought or emotion or story.
Circumstances and feelings and thought can trigger each other.
I keep on reminding me to focus on me.
And to perceive problems i have with other ppl as my own shit.

It always comes back to you.
However much we talk about consciousness, or karma, or awareness, or any other concept, it comes back to you. The messy business of you, and me.

'Anne', 'John' is a structure that we feel to be intrinsic.
You can crack it.
You can see it's transparency.
You can see it was never real.
You can see you have been fooling yourself for decades.
You can weep.
You can fear.

It changes nothing.

The fraud requires our collusion.

Let's continue.

Much love,
John

[Anne71]

Hi John,

Let's continue.

Great. And thank you for speaking out whats on your mind.

What do you think is my prize perception? My devil?

‘Anne'.

Oh good. I thought it was something specific i feel guilty about or else.

Working with emotions/hurt etc is on-going and a way of making a clearing, the conditions of opening. It's like velcro. 'Anne' is a sticky form made of emotional hooks. To the extent that we leave our conditioning in place, the loops, then the hooks attach to loops.

Funny thing is, as angry as i was, there was also some pleasure in that. In being Anne.

It's not the me, its the unconditional accepting.
When we don't accept, we resist.
We resist, we avoid.
It persists. No learning. Status quo.

Unconditional accepting is not unconditional agreeing!
It is taking what is happening, and recognising it, accepting it as happening, rather than wishing it wasn't and rejecting it, wanting to fix it, which creates a whole perfection dynamic.

Ok.

It always comes back to you.
However much we talk about consciousness, or karma, or awareness, or any other concept, it comes back to you. The messy business of you, and me.

'Anne', 'John' is a structure that we feel to be intrinsic.
You can crack it.
You can see it's transparency.
You can see it was never real.
You can see you have been fooling yourself for decades.
You can weep.
You can fear.

It changes nothing.

The fraud requires our collusion.

Hmpf.
Dont know what to say to that.
You mean i am giving it power?

Big hug Anne

[s-p-a-c-e]

Hi Anne,

Funny thing is, as angry as i was, there was also some pleasure in that. In being Anne.

Yeah, indulgence again. But it is what it is.
For as long as you find pleasure in being 'Anne', 'Anne' remains.
Why be free of something you like to be?

The fraud requires our collusion.

Hmpf.
Dont know what to say to that.
You mean i am giving it power?

It's your creation, you maintain it.
It feeds off your support.

Much love,
John

[Anne71]

Yeah, indulgence again. But it is what it is.
For as long as you find pleasure in being 'Anne', 'Anne' remains.
Why be free of something you like to be?

There is a difference between pleasure and joy - for me.
Pleasure needs more and more to be satisfying. Pleasure comes with the cost of downsides.
I want be to be free of it, bc it is not freedom. It is conditioned. And its mostly frustrating.

I wouldnt want to live in a marriage, that is a lie.

And i am curious what life will be without.

It's your creation, you maintain it.
It feeds off your support.

Yeah, i came into a dilemma here by avoiding spiritual bypassing.

[s-p-a-c-e]

I wouldnt want to live in a marriage, that is a lie.

Quite, and who wants to live as a lie?

And i am curious what life will be without.

It'll be what is for you. Anyone else's description won't come anywhere near.
To taste the strawberry, you just gotta eat it.

It's your creation, you maintain it.
It feeds off your support.

Yeah, i came into a dilemma here by avoiding spiritual bypassing.

As most do. It's understandable. Finding a quick way to escape hurt, frustration, melancholy.
Wanting change but not wanting it.

Also, this can't be forced. All we can do is clear one obstacle after another, until the wind blows through where we were.

Much love,
John

[Anne71]

Quite, and who wants to live as a lie?

:)

As most do. It's understandable. Finding a quick way to escape hurt, frustration, melancholy.
Wanting change but not wanting it.

Also, this can't be forced. All we can do is clear one obstacle after another, until the wind blows through where we were.

Accepting is accepting the emotions too. And even identifying.

There is more silence today.

I found a book i read years ago and always wanted to read again (sinueh the egyptian) in an old english phonebooth which is used as a giveaway place for used books.
Dont know if this is magical thinking or just coincidence. :)

Story of Anne does not like feeling lost or moving in the wrong direction.
But at the moment in am ok with being here.

[s-p-a-c-e]

There is more silence today.

I found a book i read years ago and always wanted to read again (sinueh the egyptian) in an old english phonebooth which is used as a giveaway place for used books.
Dont know if this is magical thinking or just coincidence. :)

Story of Anne does not like feeling lost or moving in the wrong direction.
But at the moment in am ok with being here.

Being here is where you always are.

And when the silence falls away, the stories of 'Anne' and being lost and finding a good direction continue to pitter patter.

You can watch the stories.
Wonder how you ever believed in them.

And sit, silently, with no name, no identity, breathing.
Follow the breathing a little while.
Breathing.
Here.

Nowhere to go, always where you are.

Looking, breathing, smiling, breathing, thinking, breathing.

much love,
John