Help me please.

[Mona]

Hi Wesley, thanks for your reply.

Do you feel ready then for the final questions?

Please ask away kind Wesley.

Hugs
Mona

[WesleySPK]

Hi Mona,

Comin' in hot.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

hug,
Wesley

[Mona]

Hi Wesley, thanks for your reply.

I will try to answer your questions as best as I can using words that are self limiting. I hope you'd understand and forgive me if I have not explained well.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

There is no separate entity. All action/thought is totally automated. I had this insight in a very honest moment of looking and I noticed that it was all on autopilot. Moments later I had immense clarity and many deeper realisations.

"There is no person in here."
"Hence, there never was a person in here."
"Hence, there never will be a person in here."
"Hence, there is no person in anyone else."
"Hence, there are no persons anywhere else."
"There never were, or will be any persons"

And many more realisations such as "If it is all automated then there is no reason to be annoyed with anyone for anything, for example - spilling coffee on your keyboard or even breaking up with you." or "That person is showing off his/her wealth - wow all on autopilot." or "The wind blew on its own, the heart beat on its own, the bird flew by on its own, the chewing happened on its own, weather changed on its own, the tree grew on its own." Without a doer.

"There is no person here, there is no person there. Maybe there is no 'there' there."

"This is not a belief, this is a fact, I SAW the automation, I did not read about it somewhere." "If this is a fact then there is no good/bad, there is no rich/poor, all is equal. Smack bang equal."

So with just 5 mins of extremely honest looking with rapt absorption in the Though/Action/Sensory input I was left with a realisation after realisation. Deeper and deeper into how many sand castles are built on an illusory Self. Everything flattened there within the next half an hour. It was like removing the most vital tile of a Jenga tower. No 'Me' means no Others and there goes all that is built upon such a belief. All of it.

Anybody can do this. Look honestly and you will notice that there is no Self. It is not rocket science. It is just boil, boil, boil it all down to the most immediate, raw sensation in this very moment. It is just a bunch of points where u feel body touching stuff. Now shut your eyes and you will notice those are some 5-6 points of Touch. Don't give it a name. Feet, Floor, Hand, Bum, Chair, Touch, Cold, desk etc are words. Your teacher lent you those words. It is borrowed rubbish. Remove those names and you will be left with a very raw sensation in 5-6 parts with a fuzzy boundary. Are you those points? Did you not just get fragmented? Disintegrated? Is that a person?

All the blah blah/Thoughts are what? Shapeless, formless, colourless, odourless, tasteless, nothings. Nothings.

Looking is real, looker is not.
Thinking is real, Thinker is not.
Smelling is real, smeller is not.
There is NO Cause to these effects. None. Anybody can investigate the false self. It is easy. It takes only 5 mins.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

Right from the moment we are born our conditioning to identify with a name, a family, a home begins. We are taught language, we are taught what is ours and what is other people's property. We are asked to share what is ours. All this rapidly builds a huge sense of personhood. We start seeing the world through the glasses of Cause and Effect, Subject and Object. To put it in simple words, we start believing in imaginary limits. Via Thought we go in an infinite loop of Them and I. Bring it back to bare minimum, say when we were a new born, we had no Self. We did not know the words I, Me, Mine. We were FED these words. We were fed ALL the words. Rest is history.

3) How does it feel to see this?

It feels relieving. It is like the guard dog has nothing to guard. That there never was a dog. There was nothing to guard. It is joy, freedom. Immunity to Thought. Immunity to suffering. No Me deletes sorrow/grief that comes from the sense of entitlement.

What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?

There is no difference from before this dialogue started. Just realising that there is no Self and to what extent there is no Self has dispelled attachment. And it is a 'phew' moment. I am still sometimes realising in how many ways the fiction of Self can permeate. It feels like exorcism. I feel exorcised.

Please report from the past few days.

So from hatching to popping, here is how stuff happened in this chat ...

1. In the past few days, I had several realisations with your help. I first realised that there is no Higher Self. I used to hold this belief that there is a Witness to experience. But, you helped me see that this is just the regular Ego Self, only a bit clever now. lol Pardon me if this implies that the Ego Self is real. It isn't but I hope you know what I mean. It was like I held on to the Ego Self this way, giving it a new home, new shelter as a Higher Self. There is no cause to the effect was my first realisation.

2. I then had another realisation that what I called Life/All that is happening is happening as Thought. You helped me to take another innocent look and see that there is nothing happening apart from Seeing, Hearing, Tasting, Touching etc. The most immediate stuff happening. Germany is not happening, it is a Thought. Yesterday/Tomorrow is not happening it is a Thought. Time and Space are not happening, those are just Thoughts.

3. We then investigated Thought. I had always held a belief that Mind makes sense of Sensory Inputs. Thus, those must be Thought based. But, you helped me see that raw sensory input is not Thought based. If Water was Thought based, it would not quench our thirst. The word Water is a Thought, but the sensation of Water is not a thought. I got out of this whole Thought is the bad guy thing. This opened another dimension of Looking. Part 4 of this is continued below ...

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

4. We then boiled it down to investigating Raw Sensory Input. Here the 'body' just comes apart. There are no arms, or legs there. Just a bunch of floating 'fields' of Touch with no definite boundaries, away from each other with nothing in-between. Again, anybody can do this.

Now what is and what is not was crystal clear. Precipitated to these shifting pockets of raw sensation led to realisations. There is NO SELF had a deeper meaning now. This sentence had matured. There are no boundaries, no limits, no thresholds.

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.

Oh, there is no such thing as decision, intention, free will, choice or control. It only APPEARS that way. Can I quote an example from my past post?

I picked a cup - Result of seeing the cup and Thought about wanting tea. Sensation in mouth when one needs hot tea.
I picked the kettle - Meanwhile the other hand had reached for a teaspoon. hahahaa
I had filled the kettle with water while I was thinking "Hmm... that just happened on its own." The kettle was already switched on before I could wonder how I had put the teabag in the cup on autopilot.
I looked at the kitchen floor (sensory input) and while the kettle boiled I found myself reaching for the mop.

By now I was extremely focused. Noticing hand movements, how the mop passed from hand to hand and made its way back. The kettle had boiled and the water got poured into the cup the teabag was dipped and removed while the other hand threw it in the bin and the first hand had already opened the fridge door. Wow.

I now thought, "Hmm.. this is all happening on auto pilot. I will prove everything wrong and NOT shut the fridge door".

"I will prove everything wrong and NOT shut the fridge door"

"That was a Thought you fool. It just popped up. As a result of a prior Thought." Aaahahahaaa "Now go climb a tree".

What makes things happen?

Things happen, nothing makes it happen. If we believe anything/anyone made it happen then we will never get to the realisation there is no Self. Such a belief will by default lead to a fictitious Self. And that is when you are doing it wrong lol. I did for 7 years, I know.

How does it work?

An action happens like say having food, soon a thought pops up "I feel full." Isn't that silly? What's with the word I? What's with this sentence that popped up in the head? All that happened was a few hand movements, munch munch and belly space getting occupied by food. Where is the doer? As if the sensation of full belly won't happen without this sentence "I feel full." Does it in anyway depend upon this pop up ad? How does it help to have this pop up. Will the water not quench our thirst if we called it Floozycloot instead of Water. Or if we didn't call it anything at all? Or if we had no thoughts about water. Water will still leave the same impact no matter what language or what word we use or not use in our heads about it.

What are you responsible for?

Nothing. Guess why. Because I ain't real. Aaahahaa lol lol lol

Give examples from experience.

Broom is seen, dirt is seen, hand reaches for it, movement of arms does the brooming. The end.

6) Anything to add?

Yes.
I came here looking for someone who could help me get to La La Land, to have an otherworldly moment, to get a psychedelic experience without the use of psychedelics. I think I got one. It is nothing like I imagined it to be. There were no fireworks, there were no lights or flying through a galaxy like moments.

But, I am in a La La Land of sorts. It is just a room with some typing noise, with a whirring sound emanating from a corner, some light reflecting from a screen. Same old same old. But it is breathtaking without the illusory Self.

Last but not the least, a big Thank You.

Lots of Love
Mona

[WesleySPK]

Hi Mona,

Lovely post :). Pleasure to read your answers. I will get back to you shortly.

Hug,
Wesley

[WesleySPK]

Hi Mona,

So congratulations the conversation has come to an end and it looks like you have gotten what you came here for :).

It seems that you've had some potent shifts and realizations, which is good, to have experiential shifts. I suggest to enjoy it, relax and have fun. If things change, or simmer down a little it is normal there is no need to fret.

Your name will be turned to blue in the forums and you should receive a message by an admin with access to the facebook LU aftercare groups. It really is a wonderful community and supportive community. There are many options afterwards which you have access to through these groups, one of which is guiding should you desire. There always seems to be lots of people waiting at the gate, and I personally recommend it as not just a nice way to give back but it is immensely rewarding and can deepen your own realizations.

It was a real pleasure to guide you, warms my heart to watch your process unfold! Should you ever want to contact me I am on the FB groups :).

Big hug,
Wesley

[Mona]

Hi Wesley thanks for your reply.

If things change, or simmer down a little it is normal there is no need to fret.

You helped me See. Now I cannot Unsee. Also fretting is no longer an issue. You know why. Aaahahaaa Thanks a bunch.

There always seems to be lots of people waiting at the gate, and I personally recommend it as not just a nice way to give back but it is immensely rewarding and can deepen your own realizations.

Always ready to help those who are in the same situation as me before this chat. Would need some guidance from the seasoned guides.

Should you ever want to contact me I am on the FB groups.

I created an FB account and have already sent the request there. Thanks.

Hugs
Mona

[WesleySPK]

Hi Mona,

You helped me See. Now I cannot Unsee. Also fretting is no longer an issue. You know why. Aaahahaaa Thanks a bunch.

Wonderful :). My pleasure.

Always ready to help those who are in the same situation as me before this chat. Would need some guidance from the seasoned guides.

Yes the first time guiding you choose a mentor who will help you.

Sending love,
Wesley