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[Bill]

OK Joe, here's the 5 questions we ask all at the end.
You are certainly looking like you have seen that the self is not real.
Other guides will look at these and may come back with questions further.

Take whatever time you need to answer these.
Please be thorough on each of them.
Your words are the only gauge we have.

I'll let you know the next step after this.

Here they are:

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

3) How does it feel to see this?

4) How would you describe it to somebody who is very interested, but has never heard about this illusion.

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

[Socal]

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there evere

There is no "me" there is no "I".. This is a shokcing revelation..
There never was a me and apparently when i was a baby this was no issue and apparently the "joe" was fine with it. At some point i and others created me/I and my thoughts validated it and started creating problems and issues based on past and future thoughts.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

The seperate self starts sometime after one years old, thoughts take on an identity. These thoughts are VERY convincing and in my case dominated my life. Seperate self illusion fosters almost all of the problems I have ever had. It literally created misery and suffering. Everything in life seen from this perspective is hard and self serving. Even "good" things will eventually become problems. Also seperate self LOVES beliefs. Thoughts and Beliefs can be absolutley brutal and engaging at the sametime. But Niether are needed at all.

3) How does it feel to see this?
To see this and experience it is freedom. Life still is the way it is but It doesnt need to be taken so seriously as its not me that is the doer. As someone said its like watching a movie.. ultimately you know the movie isnt real and u dont have to get caught up in it.We all are waay more than a thought.

4) How would you describe it to somebody who is very interested, but has never heard about this illusion.

I would say its dynamic simplicity. Its so easy it may seem hard. A person needs to want to give up all thier thoughts and beliefs. Surrender basically. The answer is right where we are and suffering is optional. Its like learning to ride a bike. once you get it. you dont see why it seemed so daunting before you learned to ride and you can never go back to not knowing how to ride a bike.


5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
Well for me it was dealing with ALOT of suffering surounding an issue with my sister. I was up to it up to my nose. and for some reason i realized that this is only as bad as my thoughts about it are. If there is no me then who is suffering? who is upset? I felt a release and i saw happiness and a lightness was there.
there is upsetness if thats a word but its not attached to me. its just there and i dont have to take part in it. especially since there is no me or I. I wont lie and say i didnt return to sadness becuase I did. but from time to time I realize there is no I and I feel a release... a real lightness that truly makes no sense really but its there and available.

[Bill]

Joe - thanks for the thorough response.
It looks good to me.
We have a FB group that all of the guides are members in.
When someone has posted the 5 questions, they are informed to
come and take a look, and to see if they think the person is through the gate.
I will go ahead and post this up there. Someone may come in and ask a question
or two, or want clarification on this or that. Or not.
I'll let you know what happens. It might not be till tomorrow that this is done.

When you are all through and blued in color, there's a bit more of the website available
and we also invite you to the FB Unleashed group, which is a form of aftercare and discussion.
There are a couple other FB groups we have for discussion that you also might be interested in.
And also there is guiding others should you choose to do that.

I will let you know as soon as I find out.

Bill

[Bill]

Joe - a person on the forum wonders about this post just before the questions

The I although very convincing ... Doesn't exist ... Sometimes I
Realize it ... Sometimes I get caught up in it. When I realize it things seem lighter
And not so serious. There is a character created by my thoughts and other peoples thoughts called "joe"

He is wondering about your getting caught up in the I.
are you caught up in it, or not?

[Socal]

To be honest from time to time yes. I would love it if I never did.

[Socal]

strangely enough in parralel to me doing these inquiries.. "my" sister and wife are both upset with "me" and its a challenge.. i drift back and forth between knowing this is just a story and feeling stressed out. I'm just bieng honest. I have to keep reminding myself there is no me

[Socal]

I guess I'll just keep adding to this post...

strangely enough when i give this situation full attention and by all accounts its fairly serious.. "sister is cutting herself". i notice the pressure and stress has melted away today. I feel like im noticing the situation instead of caught up in it.

[Bill]

Joe - sorry your sister is having trouble.
It will all work out one way or another.
I wish the best to her.

You have been confirmed and I'll make your color blue on the forum.
There's a bit more of the website available
and we also invite you to the FB Unleashed group, which is a form of aftercare and discussion.
There are a couple other FB groups we have for discussion that you also might be interested in.
And also there is guiding others should you choose to do that.

Here is a page now that you are blue on the forum to check out.
the first part of it concerns the closed facebook group, email me with
the address given and we'll get you in there.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=696

Lots of info there on all the groups, etc.
Let us know if there's anything more needed.
Look for you on Facebook Unleashed.

If there's any more questions, please ask.
I will leave this thread open for awhile.
It's been great working with you!

Namaste,
Bill

[Socal]

Thanks Bill for all your help !

whats the link ?

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=696 ??

[Bill]

Joe - for some reason the link didn't get through correctly

http://liberationunleashed.com/nation/v ... ?f=6&t=696

Joe - just wanted to let you know also that the I does not go away completely
and it will make a resurgence from time to time.
You can always LOOK, like you have been doing here and check it out
you'll find just like you did here, that no one is there.

[Socal]

thanks !