Guide to truth

[forgetmenot]

Hey Carolyn....thank you for checking in. How is redoing the exercises coming along?

Love, Kay
xx

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay
I am continuing to slowly work my way through the conversation. It's making more sense this time.
Love
Carolyn

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay
I'm ready to start up again if you're willing.
Love
Carolyn

[forgetmenot]

Hi Carolyn,

I usually ask the following 5 questions at the beginning of guiding, but I never did in your case....can you answer them for me now...just in your own words, so we can both be aware of what your expectations are.

HOW WILL LIFE CHANGE?
HOW WILL YOU CHANGE?
WHAT WILL BE DIFFERENT?
WHAT IS MISSING?
WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO ACHIEVE OR OBTAIN BY THIS CONVERSATION?

Love, Kay
xx

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay,
I know from having worked with you and Barry that there is a right answer to these questions. Nothing will change. But that has never made sense to me-- why would someone make a commitment to go through this if there were to be nothing different? In any case, my expectations are far less grandiose than they once were. So here goes---

HOW WILL LIFE CHANGE?
I might understand that I'm not the doer of actions.

HOW WILL YOU CHANGE?
Less anxious?

WHAT WILL BE DIFFERENT?
Nothing will be different. Only my perception of it.

WHAT IS MISSING?
A sense of unity.

WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO ACHIEVE OR OBTAIN BY THIS CONVERSATION?
I would like to live with more clarity.

love, Carolyn

[forgetmenot]

Hello Carolyn,

I know from having worked with you and Barry that there is a right answer to these questions. Nothing will change. But that has never made sense to me-- why would someone make a commitment to go through this if there were to be nothing different? In any case, my expectations are far less grandiose than they once were.

No....there is no right answer to these questions. What I would like are just honest answers so we can have a look at what expectations you have and we can then look at those expectations. There isn't much else I can help you with in this exploration. We have been through thoughts, control/choices, the body, memory, time, subject/object and you still say you haven't seen. One reason for this is that there is an expectation of what seeing through the illusory self may look like, what it may or may not bring, what it should feel like etc, and the other obstacle is just plain fear of what will happen when seeing has occurred.

So, can you look at the questions again and just give me your honest answers and feelings, please.

Thanks, Kay
xx

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay,
You say you've been through all the aspects of the guidance with me. However, I wouldn't mind revisiting those aspects with you. I shall try to be honest below, though my answers from yesterday still pretty much stand.

HOW WILL LIFE CHANGE?
I might understand that I'm not the doer of actions. This would bring more of a sense of peace.

HOW WILL YOU CHANGE?
I would like to be less anxious.

WHAT WILL BE DIFFERENT?
Nothing will be different. Only my perception of it.

WHAT IS MISSING?
A sense of meaning.

WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO ACHIEVE OR OBTAIN BY THIS CONVERSATION?
I would like to live with more clarity.

love,
Carolyn

[forgetmenot]

Hey Carolyn,

Okay, so let's take your answers one at a time and forge ahead :)

HOW WILL LIFE CHANGE?
I might understand that I'm not the doer of actions. This would bring more of a sense of peace.

HOW WILL YOU CHANGE?
I would like to be less anxious.

WHAT WILL BE DIFFERENT?
Nothing will be different. Only my perception of it.

WHAT IS MISSING?
A sense of meaning.

WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO ACHIEVE OR OBTAIN BY THIS CONVERSATION?
I would like to live with more clarity.

[forgetmenot]

Hello Carolyn,

HOW WILL LIFE CHANGE?

I might understand that I'm not the doer of actions. This would bring more of a sense of peace.

Okay, we will look further at the idea of doership. However, there is an expectation here that peace is the goal. Peace either is or it isn’t. If you are looking for continual peace as a sign that you have seen through the illusory self, then this expectation will have already poohed poohed the seeing and you will just keep chasing your own tail. You are waiting for a continual seeing that there is no self and this just won’t happen, well not at this stage of the game. Seeing through the illusory self is just the beginning and further investigation continues to happen after going through the gateless gate. To have permanent clarity is another expectation that places doubts on what has already been seen. If you have already seen that there is no separate self, waiting for this to be a permanent seeing only prolongs the idea that you haven’t seen and you will go round in circles. LOOKING continues on a daily basis…and has to continue, that is just the way it is and LOOKING happens until it doesn’t.


Okay, so let’s have a look at this sense of ‘doership’.

We’ll do a little exercise on this topic. It has to do with the sense of seeing.

Take a few relaxed breaths to let the dust settle for a while, and then:
Look on your right.
Then look on your left.
Finally, bring your head back to centre, close your eyes and look in front.

Okay, so when you look on the right, the view on the right is seen (whatever that is).
When you look on the left, the view on the left is seen (whatever that is).
And then, when you look in front of you with eyes closed, the view in front is seen (ie black space).

Darkness is just a colour, like any other, no different from light. Thought labels darkness as the absence of some 'thing' but it is no less knowing/known than light is.
Empty space is no different to solid matter, it is still a some 'thing', not a lack of some 'thing'. So when the eyes are closed, what is seen is undefined, it is untrue to say that nothing is seen, there is still some ‘thing’ ie darkness/black ‘space’.

SO, WHEN THE VIEW ON THE RIGHT IS SEEN, DO YOU HAVE THE ‘CHOICE’ NOT TO SEE? I’M NOT ASKING CAN YOU ‘CHOOSE’ TO SEE SOMETHING ELSE LIKE ANOTHER VIEW OR BLACK SPACE IF YOU CLOSE YOUR EYES. THE QUESTION IS, CAN YOU TURN SEEING OFF? CAN YOU NOT SEE WHAT IS SEEN?

SAME THING WITH THE VIEW ON THE LEFT, CAN YOU NOT SEE THE VIEW ON THE LEFT?

SAME THING WITH THE VIEW IN FRONT WITH CLOSED EYES, CAN YOU NOT SEE THE BLANK SKY?

CAN YOU TURN OFF SEEING?

WHAT DID THE 'CHOOSER' CHOOSE? DID A 'SELF' CHOOSE SOMETHING?

IF YOU CAN'T CHOOSE WHAT YOU'RE AWARE OF, THEN WHAT ELSE IS THERE TO CHOOSE?

Love, Kay
xx

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay--

Wow-- this exercise was totally awesome. Very powerful for me. It was the first time I've experienced a pointing "viscerally."

SO, WHEN THE VIEW ON THE RIGHT IS SEEN, DO YOU HAVE THE ‘CHOICE’ NOT TO SEE? I’M NOT ASKING CAN YOU ‘CHOOSE’ TO SEE SOMETHING ELSE LIKE ANOTHER VIEW OR BLACK SPACE IF YOU CLOSE YOUR EYES. THE QUESTION IS, CAN YOU TURN SEEING OFF? CAN YOU NOT SEE WHAT IS SEEN?

I absolutely can't choose not to see. It's all just there and there's no "I" that has anything to do with it.

SAME THING WITH THE VIEW ON THE LEFT, CAN YOU NOT SEE THE VIEW ON THE LEFT?

I can't un-see the view.

SAME THING WITH THE VIEW IN FRONT WITH CLOSED EYES, CAN YOU NOT SEE THE BLANK SKY?

When I close my eyes I'm not in control of what is seen.

CAN YOU TURN OFF SEEING?

I can't turn off seeing. Or any of the other four senses.

WHAT DID THE 'CHOOSER' CHOOSE? DID A 'SELF' CHOOSE SOMETHING?

No-- clear that no one chose anything. It's just there.

IF YOU CAN'T CHOOSE WHAT YOU'RE AWARE OF, THEN WHAT ELSE IS THERE TO CHOOSE?

I can't choose what I'm aware of in terms of the senses. Or thoughts. Or emotions. Or bodily functions like breathing. Or health. Or what the world's going to do next.

But yes, it comes down to awareness and I can't choose that.

See-- I knew we had more to do together!
love,
Carolyn

[forgetmenot]

Hi Carolyn,

I can't choose what I'm aware of in terms of the senses. Or thoughts. Or emotions. Or bodily functions like breathing. Or health. Or what the world's going to do next.

But yes, it comes down to awareness and I can't choose that.

Great! Nice LOOKING. SO CAN YOU FIND A 'DOER' IN ANY OF THAT?

Here is a suggestion on how to go about your day and taking absolutely EVERYTHING at face value.

You're in the kitchen and you hear a song playing from the other room. Of course, it’s only thought that says that, isn't it? So take that thought for face value. Then look again, that song isn't coming from anywhere is it? In fact, it is not a song at all, is it? Only thought says it’s a song. In reality it’s just sound. So, stick with that, discard everything that isn't obvious and apparent.

When sitting in a café enjoying a coffee. Do the same. Look around and thought will say that you are looking at other people drinking coffee. But that is only thought that says that, isn’t it? So take the thought at face value ie as the AE of thought only. LOOK again. What thought points to as people, are in fact not people at all, but colour.

At work you are getting anxious because you aren’t able to meet a deadline. But that is only thought that says that, isn’t it? But LOOK again. What thought points to as a person at work getting anxious is in fact, sensation.

When washing the dishes or the body. Do the same thing. Thought will say that you are washing the dishes using your hands. But that is only thought that says that, isn’t it? So take the thought at face value as the AE of thought. LOOK again. What thought points to as a person doing the dishes (hands, soap suds and water) are AE of colour, and what thought points to as hands moving and hands holding dishes and hands going into water, is AE of sensation. And what thought points to as water sloshing is AE of sound.

Do the same with smell and taste. This will help in breaking down what SEEMS to be happening into what actually IS.

LET ME KNOW HOW YOU GO.

Love, Kay
xx

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay,
SO CAN YOU FIND A 'DOER' IN ANY OF THAT?
I can't find a doer. Nor can I control the feeling that there is a doer. I can't control the feeling that I'm still making decisions.

You asked how it was going with breaking everything down into AE. My mind (I know there isn't one, but don't know how else to say it) balks at doing this. I tried it with the early morning birds and I know there was just the sound of their song. But thought stories kept coming up about how if I went outside I would see birds in the cypress trees. No control over that either!

love,
Carolyn

[forgetmenot]

Hello Carolyn,

So can you find a 'doer' in any of that?

I can't find a doer. Nor can I control the feeling that there is a doer. I can't control the feeling that I'm still making decisions.

Terrific….so just keep looking for the ‘doer’ when you can, to see if you can find a ‘doer’ that is doing, controlling, thinking or choosing anything!

You asked how it was going with breaking everything down into AE. My mind (I know there isn't one, but don't know how else to say it) balks at doing this. I tried it with the early morning birds and I know there was just the sound of their song. But thought stories kept coming up about how if I went outside I would see birds in the cypress trees. No control over that either!

No, no control over what appears or what thoughts appear.

IS THERE AN OUTSIDE AND AN INSIDE? IS THERE A DISTANCE BETWEEN THE SOUND AND THE ‘HEARING’ OF THE SOUND? ARE THERE TWO THINGS PRESENT? SOUND AND EXPERIENCE?

How will you change?

I would like to be less anxious.

Let’s break ‘anxiety’ down into AE.

The label ‘anxiety’ is the AE of thought and not the AE of anxiety
The sensation labelled ‘anxiety’ is the AE of sensation and not the AE of anxiety
The colour labelled ‘me/I/body’ is the AE of colour and not the AE of anxiety

So, is there actual experience of ‘anxiety’ or what is actually appearing is label + sensation + colour
When ‘anxiety’ appears, do the following:

1) Look at the label/thought ‘anxiety’ itself…bring it to the ‘minds eye’.
Inquire into the label/thought and ask it the label/thought knows anything about ‘anxiety’?
And then look to see if there is anyone/anything in the thought itself that can be ‘anxious’.

2) Look at the sensation and ignore everything else but the sensation itself.
Inquire into the sensation and ask if the sensation itself knows anything about ‘anxiety’.
And then look to see if there is anyone/anything in the sensation or behind the sensation that can be ‘anxious’.

3) Look at the image/colour labelled body, whether that image be ‘mental’ or ‘visual’.
Inquire into the colour and ask if the colour itself knows anything about ‘anxiety’.
And then look to see if there is anyone/anything in the colour that knows anything about ‘anxiety’ or that can be ‘anxious’.

When you have inquired into these and if no one/no thing is found, then just sit with the sensation. Just breathe normally, notice the thoughts and images that appear but just allow the sensation all the room it needs in the body without pushing it aside or judging it. If it becomes too intense just take a couple of deep breaths into the sensation itself, and then notice your floor under your feet, notice your backside on the chair and then notice what is in the room you are sitting and name them out loud, while being aware of the sensation and remember to breathe normally.

LET ME KNOW HOW YOU GO.

Love, Kay
xx

[Prahathit]

Hi Kay,


IS THERE AN OUTSIDE AND AN INSIDE?

It feels as though there is an inside here and an outside there.

IS THERE A DISTANCE BETWEEN THE SOUND AND THE ‘HEARING’ OF THE SOUND?

No, there's not a distance.

ARE THERE TWO THINGS PRESENT? SOUND AND EXPERIENCE?

There is just the sound.

Since it was a Sunday, I didn't experience the normal morning anxiety of a weekday morning. So I'll have to experiment with that exercise tomorrow.

love,
Carolyn

[forgetmenot]

Hi Carolyn,

IS THERE AN OUTSIDE AND AN INSIDE?

It feels as though there is an inside here and an outside there.

AND HOW DOES THAT ACTUALLY FEEL? DESCRIBE TO ME EXACTLY HOW AN INSIDE AND AN OUTSIDE FEELS IN ACTUAL EXPERIENCE?

IS THERE A DISTANCE BETWEEN THE SOUND AND THE ‘HEARING’ OF THE SOUND?

No, there's not a distance.

THEN HOW CAN THERE BE AN INSIDE AND AN OUTSIDE? HOW IS IT KNOWN THAT THERE SEEMS TO BE AN INSIDE AND AN OUTSIDE?

ARE THERE TWO THINGS PRESENT? SOUND AND EXPERIENCE?

There is just the sound.

SO, HOW CAN THERE BE AN INSIDE AND AN OUTSIDE IF THERE IS ONLY SOUND AND THERE IS ONE EXPERIENCING SOUND?

Since it was a Sunday, I didn't experience the normal morning anxiety of a weekday morning. So I'll have to experiment with that exercise tomorrow.

Okay, I look forward to hearing from you.

Love, Kay
xx