Living in the now

[Jobie]

Hello Jon

Feeling confused re the question.

Thoughts cannot be prevented from appearing - agreed (rephrased this statement leaving out the I).

Including the "I". No this cannot be prevented from appearing but when it does arise it is taken to be referring to "the little self" me, Jobie, which is not true. I am not the thinker of I or the owner of I, and I doesn't exist. So it is all a belief again that the thoughts relate to "I", this illusory self. Nothing to do with this being.

A little confused still but hope this seeing is as it is.

Regards

Jobie

[JonathanR]

Hello Jobie,

A little confused still but hope this seeing is as it is.

Not to worry. It's just that many people have not seen this, that thoughts that appear about 'I' or 'me' or 'self' do not connote a real living entity of some sort but simply the idea of one.

I am not the thinker of I or the owner of I, and I doesn't exist. So it is all a belief again that the thoughts relate to "I", this illusory self.

Excellent.

Nothing to do with this being.

Could you tell me a little more about 'this being'? What is it? Is it 'you'?


love

Jon

[Jobie]

Hello Jon

Tried to answer your question early this morning but couldn't genuinely answer it from a seeing or knowing.

I have been aware of awareness, experienced emptiness and nothingness and realise the thoughts aren't mine and there is no I.

So, what is this being, is it you? There is no 'you' only awareness experiencing life as stillness. Experiences come and go. And there is no one experiencing. Just experiences. Living this and recognising this is difficult at the moment.

Regards

Diane

[JonathanR]

Hi Jobie,

(or would you prefer Diane?)

. There is no 'you' only awareness experiencing life as stillness. Experiences come and go. And there is no one experiencing. Just experiences. Living this and recognising this is difficult at the moment.

Are you willing to say what it is about this that feels difficult?

Difficult it may be right now but you are on the right track.

Now, this may sound like an odd question but is the awareness in some way experienced as a separate thing from life its self?

Best wishes

Jon

[Jobie]

Hi Jon

Yes, I prefer Diane. Thank you. Jobie is the name given to the cat!!

This knowing seems too recent to be lived fully recognising no entity exists and that everything that happens are experiences arising in awareness. When writing this and sitting quietly I can see all this but when I get into the rush of life this knowing is forgotten and I play the role of the separate self. Although, I am aware of this seeing!!

Awareness is now being recognised as life itself, not a separate thing. There is only awareness, and life is being experienced as that and through that. I feel a lot of this could be mind based and not a true knowing/seeing. But it's coming stronger every day but still some confusion is arising.

Love

Diane

[Jobie]

Hi Jon

I haven't received your daily message. Is all ok?

Diane

[JonathanR]

Dear Diane

Please forgive me. I have been under the weather and terribly caught up in extra work. That's why I did not post.

I will post tomorrow afternoon.

Best wishes,

Jon

[Jobie]

Hi Jon
Hope feelings of being under the weather and the pressure of work pass soon. Get well please.

Looking forward to continuing our conversation when feeling better.

No need for forgiveness. Life is as it is. Take care.

Love

Diane

[JonathanR]

Hello Diane,

I'm better now thanks.

This knowing seems too recent to be lived fully recognising no entity exists and that everything that happens are experiences arising in awareness.

How would that actually feel? Can it be known how this should feel?

Who or what could be doing the full recognising?

Could 'full recognising' be a thought, an expectation about how seeing no self ought to feel or be?

When writing this and sitting quietly I can see all this but when I get into the rush of life this knowing is forgotten and I play the role of the separate self.

'You' do this, or there is a story going on about someone playing the role of a separate self?

There can seem to be identification with some kind of 'me' when life is a rush or there are many thoughts. Is this what you mean? Nevertheless if one stopped and looked for this separate self in experience, could one be found?

Although, I am aware of this seeing!!

Of course. Very lovely :-) But do you think we might change that from 'I am aware' to 'it is seen'? Does this make sense?

Awareness is now being recognised as life itself, not a separate thing. There is only awareness, and life is being experienced as that and through that. I feel a lot of this could be mind based and not a true knowing/seeing. But it's coming stronger every day but still some confusion is arising.

Let me know any doubts or confusions you may have?

Many people understandably search for 'a true knowing'. And after some struggling with not experiencing anything that corresponds to their idea of true knowing/seeing, disappointment can happen.

If you are sitting down, notice how there is a sensation where body and chair meet, possibly a kind of pressure or warmth? Would you say that this sensation is real?

love

Jon

[Jobie]

Hello Jon

So pleased you are better. Missed our conversations.

Seeing was immediately seen re the first statement "this knowing is too recent ........" that it is just a thought, a story by an imaginary someone, with an expectation of how it should be, feel. (Unfortunately, I only have an iPad so no facilities to highlight statements). Awareness would not feel anything, just watching and seeing. No feelings unless experiencing happens. That statement now feels quite ridiculous. Ugh!!

There is a continuation going on of the story, I guess in thought, thinking it's happening to a someone. Back in the trap again. Identification with a supposed me. I guess, life just happens and seeing seen of coming and going, in and out of awareness. No one experiencing anything just a seeing. Awareness is still there even if not seen. A separate self would not be found if I stopped in the middle of the rush, just awareness.

Recently, an issue arose concerning this home and feelings of being very bothered about it arose. Connected with the awareness and all was peaceful, nothing was bothered about the issue, so worrying stopped. Great!! End of worry.

Noted "it is seen" and not "I am aware". Change of language. Prefer to loose the I. Training as a counsellor was - always start a sentence with an I. Spent many years in the role of counsellor as an illusory person counselling and helping illusory people.
Quite a joke.

I nearly said yes re feeling the sensation of being real. So who was feeling the sensation? No one, so Sensation is just a feeling appearing in awareness!!

Love
Diane

[JonathanR]

Hello Diane,

Thank you for your post.

. Seeing was immediately seen re the first statement "this knowing is too recent ........" that it is just a thought, a story by an imaginary someone, with an expectation of how it should be, feel. (Unfortunately, I only have an iPad so no facilities to highlight statements). Awareness would not feel anything, just watching and seeing. No feelings unless experiencing happens. That statement now feels quite ridiculous. Ugh!!

Be kind to yourself. Who or what could be to blame?

And anyway, these seeings through of confusion or identifications are wonderful. :-) If you look into experience, can you find the one that is 'wrong'?

. Recently, an issue arose concerning this home and feelings of being very bothered about it arose. Connected with the awareness and all was peaceful, nothing was bothered about the issue, so worrying stopped. Great!! End of worry.

Yes that is lovely.

I nearly said yes re feeling the sensation of being real. So who was feeling the sensation? No one, so Sensation is just a feeling appearing in awareness!!

OK, take another look at these feelings right now,, not from memory or imagination but actually notice the sensations.

Or even better, place your hand against your cheek. Doesn't it seem that there is an immediate experience, a felt sensation where hand meets cheek?

Does it seem that there is a 'me' there, experiencing the experience? Or just the felt sensation?

Does it seem that this experience is happening IN something or just happening?


Best wishes,

Jon

[Jobie]

Hi Jon
Sorry no reply yesterday, a busy day and felt too tired in the evening. And still didn't sleep. Feeling fed up and mind saying this is all too much, give up and have a rest!! But know it's not true..

Had thoughts of not being authentic, spontaneous with answering and looking at your pointings. Controlled and need to say it right. But it is also seen that this statement is true. So going to just come from the heart. Be natural. What comes, comes.

want to look at feeling sensations. Putting hand on the body, yes is just experienced as a sensation, not in anything, and not a me experiencing it as long as I stay in the awareness state.

I saw my daughter the other day and a friend and really became a 'person' again, didn't like that 'person' but it was seen. Just went into my old way of being, but worse. Noticing anger arising and frustrations of life, which is not normally expressed. Normally stay very calm and patient.

Regards

Diane

[JonathanR]

Hi Diane,

Had thoughts of not being authentic, spontaneous with answering and looking at your pointings. Controlled and need to say it right. But it is also seen that this statement is true. So going to just come from the heart. Be natural. What comes, comes.

Yes. Don't be at all worried about 'not saying it right'. In fact the effort to 'say it right' can be tiring. you can't get this wrong and nobody is judging you. Speak from gut feeling, please :-)

want to look at feeling sensations. Putting hand on the body, yes is just experienced as a sensation, not in anything, and not a me experiencing it as long as I stay in the awareness state.

Ok. Very good.

Have you ever had the experience of not being aware?

I saw my daughter the other day and a friend and really became a 'person' again, didn't like that 'person' but it was seen. Just went into my old way of being, but worse. Noticing anger arising and frustrations of life, which is not normally expressed. Normally stay very calm and patient.

Do you feel this anger and frustration is somehow worse? Could it be that it was noticed more than before?

So there was a sense of it being 'my frustration'?


Regards,

Jon

[Jobie]

Morning Jon


There's something about when working with you tears arise. (Had an I in that statement and just taken it out). Going inside to take a look. Something to do with aloneness! Is there a sadness about loosing the I? Can't find anyone to be sad about losing the I. Tears still arising.

Yes there was a fear about being judged/criticised and getting it wrong. But that is only from a memory, a story, and it's not now so will always try and come from gut feeling.

Have I ever had the experience of not being aware. Said yes to start with then looked again and would say I have always been aware of this being's actions/feelings etc but not in such depth as now. Only sleep time, having an anaesthetic etc is there no awareness of awareness.

Yes, it is seen that anger has always been expressed but now it is being noticed more and so feeling worse, but it's not. There was a feeling of being wrong to express these feelings in front of my daughter and this "I" should be behaving in a more perfect way. What a load of shit and pressure to be carrying around to be perfect. Which has been seen and applies in lots of areas. So life becomes more stressful fulfilling this belief and role. I noticed I swore above which I never have as now feeling a need to express life more fully. Feels like I'm bringing in the concept of a person here.

Also, yes there was a sense of it being my frustration and anger. Not feelings arising. Afterwards when looking it is seen what was happening but not at the time. Too caught up in the game of personhood.

Thanks again Jon for your time.

Love
Diane

[Jobie]

Hello Jon

Some realisations arose today. Drove home from Sea Lane cafe where been sitting quietly and a feeling of emptiness appeared and so started some enquiry. When I looked there was no one driving, just everything happening automatically. Ps. Who is doing the enquiry??

Sitting in Sea Lane cafe, it was seen that the waves were just being waves, sun was doing what Suns do, shining, eating just happened and life was just happening all around with no one controlling it. When thinking takes place and says, you need to look up the time of the trains for tomorrow, or you need to put the car away. These don't appear to be random thoughts as things need to be done but a reminder steps in, hah,hah,it is the mind as the thought. Just seen it as writing it.

So who is feeling excited by these recognitions. Oh, again it is seen that excitement arises and passes so no one is feeling. Also, recognised today, was that the mind likes to label, everything that is seen in the physical world and in emotions etc. So, again, who is doing the recognising, or is it seen in awareness. Yes that's it. Writing this is helping the seeing. Does awareness need helping or clarification in the seeing. Confusion arising.

Love

Diane