Let's go.

[Anki]

Are you feeling ready to continue? Have you seen through the "I" illusion?

[Korneliusz]

Still some resistance, false or imagined, I can't continue.

[Korneliusz]

Oh, no, I really don't feel like I've seen anything. I'm just going around, just being here. Not much happening. As much as I would like to get out of the state I'm in, I don't find any means to do that. Can you help me? Or am I condemned to go on about in my experiencing, in this nowhere-land, unnamed, unmanned, with a fear of future.

[Anki]

Hi Korneliusz... my last post to you did not appear...

What is the 'state' you are in? Is it "nowhereland, unnamed, unmanned.. ?" Who is in that?

What is this fear of the future? That it will be more of the above? Look closely there, see what it is that is at the root of this. Often the initial seeing that there is no legitimate, find-able self arouses fear. No one really wants to realize there is no "me"... it shakes the very foundation of life as it is known. So fear comes to push away what has been seen. Look. You saw this. It cannot hurt you; only the fear can cause distress. Perhaps that is why you are in the above "state"....

[Korneliusz]

I guess we will stop here for some time, or forever. Of course, I'm not writing it; it is being written. There is this "being" happening, and I don't find any suitable words for it. "Being" is a word, I guess, understandable in our culture in the context of this forum. Still, it's very dissatisfactory to call it.

[Anki]

We can certainly stop if you wish, Korneliusz. And continuing on might be helpful... unless you are satisfied with how it is now.. ?

Please let me know. Unless you say otherwise, my feeling is that you have seen. If that is the case there is benefit in continuing, I think.

Love to you...
Lisa

[Korneliusz]

It's not that I want to stop, I just don't see any way I could do anything else beside being what I am at the moment.
If you ask me about something, I will probably get stuck again and unable to reply, because, I don't know, there is some feeling of a blockage. I like to have something to do, and this is definitely one of the things I like to do - reading and replying - but the process in between doesn't seem to be about anything at all. That's what I think, that basically, with every seemingly new question the same response appears in the way my body feels or reacts. As such, I must be honest, though I'd like to have some activity, and I like doing this, seeking this, and the whole idea, I don't see much more potential in me, at this point, to go anywhere besides this, besides what is. I know that this is the point made here, it seems, that there is nowhere to go ("nowhere" = "now-here"), but then there is a point made about looking at what is. Like there might be something else than this. Am i missing something? Maybe, that would make sense, since the whole idea, in which I believe, is that it is possible not to see, as in, avoid looking at what is. Which is pretty much insane.

[Anki]

OK... here's my suggestion: I'll post the 5 questions, as a "temperature taking". Answer as honestly and completely as you can and from this we should know more. I agree... cannot do anything else besides being what you are at the moment. And the blockage you feel is not permanent... so let's go with the questions and see what shows up. Agreed?

Here they are:

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now. 

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look? 

5) Do you decide, intend, choose, control events in Life? Do you make anything happen? Give examples from your experience.

6) Anything to add?

[Korneliusz]

1) there's only a thought containing a grammatical unit, the word "I". There is no separate entity called "I".
2) The illusion of separate self is believing, or just living with an unquestioned premise in one's mind that there is something in a being that is separate,detached and/or independent from the rest of the world/life. The being is separate only in the sense that it can be distinguished from other beings, because of the mind's capacity to do so. Other than that, there is no control in that being, it's not a separate entity. The life is all beings, and every single being belongs to life. The life lives itself. "The consciousness is conscious of itself". A being does not choose his body, his actions, his thoughts, his beliefs. These are all occurrences happening in the awareness, or in life, since a being, like I said, is a construct derived from the mind's ability do divide life. Life cannot be divided, It's in the mind that it may seem to be divided. Just as one can make a map out of a terrain, very detailed map, made with computer, it's still just a map. Not the real thing. And on the map, you have these squares that are drawn on this map, and each square has a different number: A1, A2, A3, B1, B2, B3...and this is very fruitful metaphor, and I don't want to develop it any further. But that's an example of what the mind does with life, a similar thing to what map does to the terrain. In other words, in real life, there is no "me", "you", "mine", "theirs"...there are no boundary lines within which we live (or: within which life lives itself). And life is not a separate being, there is nothing except this life/awareness. It is not a product of a dividing capacity of mind, because there is no "no-life". Everything is "in life". You cannot point to something else, because the pointer, the act of pointing, and the pointed is already "in life". So whatever you point, it's life as we discuss it. Even the illusion of separate self is life.

When does it start? No idea. The illusion is about living from a point of view that is not true, in a sense dead, withdrawing reality as it is, molding every sensations into its frame of false identification. Life is never separated, impossible, but there is a "belief", a certain tying to false presupposition. Life is lived and this "belief" has a certain impact on it, but is a part of this lived life. At some point this illusion starts to build up. The child's mind registers perceptions. It starts to be called by its name by its parents. It starts to believe what they tell it, and make a whole world out of it, a mental representation of life, not backed by evidence, but by sounds in a form recognized by modern humans as language. It lives, and the mental representation is seen in its mind. This mental representation is called "life", "world", "reality". For example, the child hears: "you're stupid". This sound, which is, obviously, made of both language (lexical reference) and emotional tone (the way the sound is expressed) (but this division is not necessary and may bring only unnecessary complexities for someone to consider). This sound has an impact on a child. The sound is recorded in the memory. It is memorized and can be re-heard in the mind. So, along the living organism, there grows/expands this mental representation of life. And certain experiences ("traumas") are given more attention in mind. The fallacy is that: what has happened in the past, is bound to happen in the future. It is assumed that the being has a certain quality, to which the "trauma" experience points, but it can never be found. Why? These qualities are of illusory nature. Suffering is believing, pain is real. Living with a belief in a separate self is a suffering. The assumption that is not checked is the reason for suffering. That's all. That's the whole story of "suffering" in this world. That's why it may be hard to take somebody's suffering seriously. All the different sufferings (from their appearance) refer to this belief in somebody having a say in what is going on. The sufferings are not to be remedied, the belief is to be eradicated/checked. At least if we want to get rid of suffering. Maybe someone does not want to:) . The belief is that there is doer, controller of life of this body, that this doer is SOMEWHERE in this body, but the mind goes only this far - if it is asked to find this doer, it will go on searching, bringing up different references in its mental representation, different ideas, feelings, of various complexity and kind. The doer is never found, pointed to, seen by being. The idea of continuity comes to my mind, when I try to write more about this illusion - that what has happened in the past, is somehow indicating about what is in the present and will be in the future. But what has happened is a memory, it's dead, nowhere to be found, a story. So the continuity is false, as even time is seen as a made up construct. And there is nothing to know, nothing not to know. Even answering this question, when I come to think of it, is a story of its own. It's total BS :). Maybe you can resell it at your next book:).

3) I don't see much difference. In my life, I can only say about gradual change in perception. That's why I doubt any kind of "seeing", at least, in my case. And it does not involve any feeling.

4) As I've written in 3), there is no such thing in my experience.

5) No, I do not.

6) Not really.

[Anki]

Wonderful, Korneliusz.... :)

One final curiosity here.... when the word "I" is used to what are you referring?

Big hug!
Lisa

[Anki]

And one more (just came up with this): Please elaborate a bit on this....

That's why I doubt any kind of "seeing", at least, in my case.

Thanks!

[Korneliusz]

One final curiosity here.... when the word "I" is used to what are you referring?

To the body. To me. Somebody is typing this, you know. This somebody I call I.

That's why I doubt any kind of "seeing", at least, in my case.

Because there was no such thing. You just live. There is no illusion. Nothing is delusional. That's a myth. "Seeing" is not separate from "just living". You cannot not "see". I don't divide my experience into seeing - not seeing, now, in the past, ever.

[Anki]

Fair enough... and when you say "me", "somebody" does that point to an actual entity somewhere inside the body or.... ??

[Korneliusz]

no.

[Anki]

Korneliusz I am going to ask some of the other LU guides to take a look at your thread. It looks to me that you have seen clearly, and if you are interested, the LU Facebook groups might be to your liking. They are full of others who have seen and the conversations are often very interesting and helpful. So... will keep you posted.

Love to you,
Lisa