Ready to talk

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woooway
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Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:36 pm

Looking to be nudged
:-)

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:44 pm

Hello, Damon here.

I'd gladly nudge you in the right direction.

Let's simply begin by talking a bit about your reasons for posting on this forum.
What do you expect to happen here?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:52 pm

Cool. Thanks.

Well I had a big kind of blissful experience in meditation about 1 year ago. For days i felt like i was living what felt like the truth. Other things fell away and i was just really present. Then life as i knew it gradually came back, with all usual concerns etc. Since then I have come to realise many errors of habit in how i have viewed things, and have started to experience a much lighter clearer sense of being throughout my daily life. Been reading advaita stuff, and i don't know feel like a connection with another might help me let go of whats still in my way. For a long time i was *trying* everything but ive realised that i can only let things happen as they are already happening. So i have started to give up and just rest in what happens and it feels right.

What abt you? :-)

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:02 pm

What abt you? :-)
Hehe. No expectations here. My only job is to point your attention the right way. Your job, if you're ready and willing is to look at experience and tell me what's being seen. Sounds like it's going to be nice and easy.
feel like a connection with another might help me let go of whats still in my way
So, what is still in your way? What is your way in the first place? What makes the way yours?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:41 pm

Hmmm. I don't know. I guess up till now i've been waiting for an experience of some kind to confirm something to me, but i've started to realise any experience is just that and its probably the memory of what happened a while back which has caused me to look for something. Although when i had that *experience* it definitely was a sort of non experience. I remember being totally aware of everything just happening. So i've probably idealised that to a degree. I mean i don't really feel that there is a way that's mine right now, but also i know deep down i am not there yet, wherever there is. I have moments of complete rest, and in daily life i can be very active in work for example and as soon as my environment changes i am back to that rest without any effort. In fact effort has pretty much gone. I've realised that the I and the striving that comes with that inhibits that relaxation and have understood that maybe whats been there all along will be more available once the illusion that I am doing any of it has completely gone. It is sometimes hard, this solitary way, reading other peoples insights and digesting them is great but i haven't engaged with anyone about this, so maybe i feel that's something i need.

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:08 pm

It looks as if you've had some glimpses of what we're pointing to here, so that's wonderful and will make this much easier.

You're right- it's a non-experience, not an experience, it is experience itself, uninhibited, spontaneously flowing, non-separate.
It is sometimes hard, this solitary way, reading other peoples insights and digesting them is great but i haven't engaged with anyone about this, so maybe i feel that's something i need.
It can be tremendously useful to talk about these matters with someone. That's exactly why we built this forum.

Feels to me as if you're ready to dive in.

As you probably already noticed, we're not into theorizing and speculation here.
So whenever I ask you something, simply look at what is actually real right now.
We're looking for the obvious, the simple, the down-to-earth truth of what is really going on right at this very moment.
Ok?
but also i know deep down i am not there yet, wherever there is
This is the crux of the matter.
Tell me, what is the I that knows this deep down?
What is the I that isn't there yet?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:29 pm

hahaha. there is no hiding here. i like it.
what is the I that knows this deep down?
well right now, there isn't that I, that was before half an hour ago or something. Now i am simply typing and my thoughts are in a different place, that thought is no longer here. In thinking about myself and what was holding me back i began to narrate. But now its just the screen, the letters and my hands doing the work.

Same with the I that isn't here yet. That too feels like a soap bubble that popped and right now i can't find it. I feel like right now I could fabricate a whole strategy to employ the truth you just pointed to and make sense of it in thoughts, in order to fill some space and say something more, but in truth i don't see the point.

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:33 pm

hahaha. there is no hiding here. i like it.
;-)
well right now, there isn't that I, that was before half an hour ago or something.
What was there half an hour ago that isn't here now?
I feel like right now I could fabricate a whole strategy to employ the truth you just pointed to and make sense of it in thoughts, in order to fill some space and say something more, but in truth i don't see the point.
How about not fabricating anything for a moment and simply look at what's present right now?

Do you exist at all?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:42 pm

What was there half an hour ago that isn't here now?
... those thoughts, the experiences, the objects that were in view. but everything essential or even real is still the same. the same sense, is unshifting.

Do you exist at all?[/quote]

Well yes in the sense that stuff is going on and i am aware of changes and movement in my consciousness. but no in the sense of any thing that is to be found in what is changeable?? if that makes sense. A strong sense of happening and change but not a labelled identity as such. I guess even my body is different, although i recognise it it is being perceived differently to before..

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:01 pm

but no in the sense of any thing that is to be found in what is changeable?? if that makes sense. A strong sense of happening and change but not a labelled identity as such.
Yes, that makes sense. That's step one. No self is to be found in the endless stream of changes.

Let's move on to step two. ;-)
stuff is going on and i am aware of changes and movement in my consciousness
Who or what is aware of changes and movement?
What is consciousness and what makes consciousness yours?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:24 pm

That's step one.
lol
Who or what is aware of changes and movement?
I don't know some ineffable kind of always-being-there sense which i cant grip hold and don't want to either. But its continual and feels like it should be identified with. Spacious, self-perpetuating, unchanging but sometimes forgotten or overshadowed or out of focus, peaceful and formless. blah blah blah. could use many more words but no point.
What is consciousness and what makes consciousness yours?
[/quote]
What is consciousness? God, or Oh god is what i mean hahah. Erm.. i dont know what it is. I have spent along time trying to figure it out. I guess its just something greater than I am, the I that knows its own history or the I that can put words to things. It is a sense of greater than only, beyond me. When i look now i cant see it i can just feel a hum or a ground zero kind of imperceptible on-feeling. It doesn;t feel like mine particularly, it just feels like its there and that's as far as it goes. its animating me but its not mine to claim or something along those lines...? :-S

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:50 pm

lol
;-) no, seriously.
I don't know some ineffable kind of always-being-there sense which i cant grip hold and don't want to either. But its continual and feels like it should be identified with. Spacious, self-perpetuating, unchanging but sometimes forgotten or overshadowed or out of focus, peaceful and formless. blah blah blah. could use many more words but no point.
Ok, focus now.

WHAT is being aware?
Is anything being aware? Is anything doing the being aware?

Is the "ineffable kind of always-being-there sense which i can't grip and don't want to" what is being aware?

How can a "sense of" do anything?
I guess its just something greater than I am, the I that knows its own history or the I that can put words to things
And that I is what?
It is a sense of greater than only, beyond me. When i look now i cant see it i can just feel a hum or a ground zero kind of imperceptible on-feeling. It doesn;t feel like mine particularly, it just feels like its there and that's as far as it goes. its animating me but its not mine to claim or something along those lines...? :-
Do you mean simply the sense of being- the simple sense of being alive? Life itself?
Why call that consciousness and reify it?

In what sense is it animating you?
What is the YOU that is being animated?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:17 pm

Ok.
WHAT is being aware?
Is anything being aware? Is anything doing the being aware?
no nothing is being aware. And nothing is doing it. Its just doing itself.
Is the "ineffable kind of always-being-there sense which i can't grip and don't want to" what is being aware?
and no this is just a thought about it, not what it is. whatever it is is doing itself. and it comes before my thought about it expressed as a a sense.
And that I is what?
It is just a thought or file in my brain.
Do you mean simply the sense of being- the simple sense of being alive? Life itself?
Why call that consciousness and reify it?
Yes exactly that, life itself. No i dont mean to reify it as if its something of which im too derivative to *get*. Ah i see do you mean that looking at it from the perspective of the ego/I makes it into an object?
In what sense is it animating you?
just in that it gives its sense to everything, is always present in all things. And even the me that tells a story which then dissapears, it dissappears into that and is expressed in that.
What is the YOU that is being animated?
[/quote] Everything that is in my awareness. This touches something in me. I feel like everything that is in view is me in some way simply because its in my view. But i also feel that the sense of being alive we are pointing to is experienced clearly when my energy rests naturally in the space between whats coming and going in my awareness, when i am not under whatever I-illusions i might be having. But, that itself seems to reify it somewhat no? and make it an object. To answer your question It feels now like the me that is being animated is just the collection of expressions of whatever that consciousness is producing at that time, incl whatver delusions or i-thoughts i might be experiencing. It is total.

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Damon Kamda
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby Damon Kamda » Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:32 pm

But i also feel that the sense of being alive we are pointing
That's not what we're pointing to here specifically, however.

The question was: do you exist?

What appeared as an answer was the sense of being alive and consciousness/awareness.
the sense of being alive we are pointing to is experienced clearly when my energy rests naturally in the space between whats coming and going in my awareness
This isn't about making the sense of being alive stronger or experienced more clearly. It's simply about seeing what is real.
when i am not under whatever I-illusions i might be having
Who is under I-Illusions?
Who is being deceived?

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woooway
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Re: Ready to talk

Postby woooway » Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:58 pm

This isn't about making the sense of being alive stronger or experienced more clearly. It's simply about seeing what is real.
ok.
Who is under I-Illusions?
Who is being deceived?
[/quote]

no-one i guess, no one i can find. nothing in my experience right now tells me there is anyone there


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