Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

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spektrolyte
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Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:29 am

What brings you to Liberation Unleashed?:
If I'm honest I just saw it mentioned in a blog post and I understand the concept of liberation as it is something i have been pursuing for some time now in my own way.

What are you looking for? What do you expect from this:
I expect nothing, but work I have done in the past with others asking questions of me has led to some unusual states of mind. i expect experiences of greater awareness if i engage with the process correctly.
What is your background in terms of seeking and inquiry?: self questioning on enlightenment intensives, several months intense vipassana meditation over the course of 5 years, regular meditation practice, a while ago i stopped seeking and have gradually become more present. i am more relaxed after coming to terms with a near death experience.

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ElPortal
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:46 am

HI there, welcome to LU and thanks for your patience!

Do you understand that the guiding process here is not about changing or improving states of mind, but simply about seeing through the illusion of a separate self? Is this what interests you? If so I may be able to accompany you.

Cheers

Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:06 pm

Do you understand that the guiding process here is not about changing or improving states of mind, but simply about seeing through the illusion of a separate self? Is this what interests you?
Thanks for your reply.

Yes that is understood and the guidance offered here was the reason for joining the forum.

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ElPortal
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:10 pm

Ok, that's great. Then we're in business.

Before going any further, please watch the introductory videos, read the disclaimer on the home page (f you haven't already) and agree to some standard ground rules:

1. Post at least once every second day, even if only to say, "still here!" If you can't for some reason, just let me know.
2. There is no teacher here; all I do is point. You look, until seeing is clear.
3. Look deeply and sincerely, then respond with 100% honesty. There are no wrong or right answers.
4. Just respond simply and directly from immediate personal experience only (felt senses and observed thoughts), avoiding long-winded analytical and philosophical and stream-of-consciousness answers.
5. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies and such for the remainder of this investigation, even leaving aside other people's LU threads. Put all your attention into looking for yourself into this reality, as it is. If you have a daily and essential meditation practice, it is fine to continue that.

If you could confirm you have seen all the above, agree to them, and would still like to be guided - then we'll begin.

Some practical tips about posting in this forum:

1. When clicking 'Post Reply' at the bottom of the page you get the editor where you can type an answer. You can also preview the answer before it is posted. Experiment as much as needed. Nothing gets posted unless the 'Submit' button is clicked.
2. The forum can log you out without warning. If you're typing a post directly in the edit box here, and you get logged out before you click Submit, your words can get lost. There are two ways to avoid this. One, use the Preview button frequently. That will keep you logged in. Or two, type your responses in a separate program like Notepad first, then copy and paste them into the forum. (But that way you don't get to use the quote function and have to use BBCode to highlight quotes.)
3. Please learn to use the 'Quote' facility, it's a very useful tool (there is a post about this at the top of the 'Gate' forum).
4. It could be handy to know which time zone you are in. I am in France: Central European Time (= GMT+1).

Cheers

Mark

PS what would you like me to call you?
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:12 pm

I have seen the above and agree to be guided.

Is it possible to configure email notification of a reply to this thread? Have checked the control panel and am subscribed but did not receive a notification of the reply and cannot see the option to enable. Or does the page need to be checked regularly instead?
PS what would you like me to call you?
I can be called Thom, as it's a bit easier to spell :)

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:13 pm

I am an hour behind you.

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ElPortal
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:25 pm

Hi Thom,

1. Please let me know what, if anything you are hoping to change, and any fears that may also be noticed, along with their bodily sensations.

2. What comes up when the following statement is read: "there is no 'you' at all in reality, not any shape of form, nor has there ever been, nor will there ever be? There is only life moving freely without any general manager called 'you'"

As you consider these questions, and any others that I pose, and do the exercises which I suggest, always first and foremost look prior to any thought-out rational answers, and report back on what actual sensations come up on your first-hand NOW experience. Spend time each time to ponder deeply, and reply with WHAT FEELS REAL in this moment., ok?

Cheers

Mark

PS on the email notification issue, once you are online you should be able to tick the 'SUBSCRIBE' box at the bottom left, and/or the tick at bottom left which says 'Notify me when a reply is posted'. If you have already done this and the notifications have not come through to your email, please let me know and I'll get an admin to look into it.
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:39 pm

1. Please let me know what, if anything you are hoping to change, and any fears that may also be noticed, along with their bodily sensations.
Not sure I understand the question regards change, but I will report fears and sensations
2. What comes up when the following statement is read: "there is no 'you' at all in reality, not any shape of form, nor has there ever been, nor will there ever be? There is only life moving freely without any general manager called 'you'"
Difficult to answer because i am familiar with the concept intellectually, the immediate reaction was "I agree completely, how could it be any different"
If you have already done this and the notifications have not come through to your email, please let me know and I'll get an admin to look into it.
I am subscribed and have the option checked. Also consulted the spam folder but no messages.

I should probably add at this point that since Sunday I have been experiencing an altered state of awareness. The mind is not making any noise and I am completely present. This occurred after watching a lecture by Rupert Spira filmed at the Science & Non-duality conference.

States similar to this have occurred before and have been finite in length. This length is approaching unusual given past experience.

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:16 pm

It should be clarified that there are thoughts but mostly objective. The subjective ones induce a variety of feelings ranging from ambivalence to ridicule and mindfulness appears to be high. It's a very ordinary experience.

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ElPortal
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Thu Feb 04, 2016 6:10 am

Hi Thom,

Thanks for those responses.

So where is the report on felt experiencein response to those two questions?
Not sure I understand the question regards change, but I will report fears and sensations
So just to clarify, instead of saying 'Please let me know what, if anything, you are hoping to change' we could read: 'Should anything be different from the way it is now?'

Regarding the present state, thanks for reporting this. As mentioned in my first post, we are not really looking into states here, which as all of Life's movement come and go, but our job is to look into into what always has been and can only ever be. So a 3rd question will be:-

Can a real individual called Thom be found except in thought? If so please describe how he is recognised.

Cheers

Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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ElPortal
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Location: France

Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Thu Feb 04, 2016 6:11 am

PS I'll have a word with one of the admins on the notifications subject. Will let you know when I have something on that.

M
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Thu Feb 04, 2016 10:57 am

Good morning Mark,
So where is the report on felt experience in response to those two questions?
The thought of the first question was "What is there to change?" It is what it is. No fears apparent.

And the second; Nothing comes up, it's like someone telling me the sky is blue.
'Should anything be different from the way it is now?'
A more fitting question would be "Could anything be any different?", to which the answer has to be "No" because it couldn't. I recall the idea of should, but find it difficult to relate to right now. I should have some breakfast as it is 10am. Is that what you mean?
Can a real individual called Thom be found except in thought? If so please describe how he is recognised.
The correct answer is probably "No", but who is answering it? The mind, is answering it and I watch the mind saying "I am a walking talking bag of bones, blood and tissue" as an objective response. There is no subjective feeling about this at all.

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ElPortal
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Thu Feb 04, 2016 11:26 am

Hi Thom,

Thanks for your reply.

1.
The correct answer is probably "No"
Ok, but it is not the 'correct answer' that is sought, but more felt answer, together with what sensations (if any) come up. So, to rephrase the question:-

Can a real separate individual called Thom be found anywhere in actual first-hand experience? If so, please describe?
If not, please describe what is experienced.

2. Then, when you have considered that, here is an invitation to do an simple exercise:

Sit for 2 minutes and notice everything which happens: all sensations and thoughts, making a list of them as you go.
After the 2 minutes are up and you have your list, please go down each item on the list, labelling after each either (T) or (E). (T) indicates a thought, an assumption, a commentary, an interpretation. (E) indicates a sensory experience (via the senses). Of course it is necessary to use words, labels (T) even to note this down, but we will allow those for the purposes of communication. ok? Then let me have your list.

Cheers

Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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ElPortal
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby ElPortal » Thu Feb 04, 2016 11:29 am

Take your time with these considerations ok?

PS on the email notifications, I'll send you a private message on this, as it involves your email address.

Cheers

Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.

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spektrolyte
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Re: Would be grateful for help with focusing my enquiry

Postby spektrolyte » Thu Feb 04, 2016 12:21 pm

Yes I haven't had any emails alerting me to your replies, have just been refreshing the page as it occurs to me.


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