Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to dependan

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ilazmit
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Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to dependan

Postby ilazmit » Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:19 pm

What brings you to Liberation Unleashed?:

It was suggested by a friend and I was intrigued after reading a book about Kabbalism. and after being dumped by a boyfriend.

What are you looking for? What do you expect from this:

Inner peace and an alignment with Truth.

What is your background in terms of seeking and inquiry?:

Studied various religious beliefs, practised Nicheren Daishonin Buddhism. witnessed my mother passing away and it was a spiritual experience.

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JonathanR
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby JonathanR » Wed Jan 13, 2016 9:44 am

Hi Ilazmit,

Welcome to Liberation Unleashed. My name is Jon.

Would you like me to address you as Ilazmit or by a different name?

I expect you may have read a little bit about what we do but anyway, we guide towards the realisation that there is no 'self', that self or 'I' is an illusion. This can be worked out or known conceptually but here we aim to guide you to see it directly. It cannot be predicted how this will be experienced.

What we would do here is simply have a converstaion, the purpose of which would be for you to make the realisation that there is no self. This will take the form of an inqury in which I will ask a succession of questions and it is for you to look at your own experience. Nobody will be judjing you and you can't get this wrong.

You have said a little about how you have arrived here but please take a little time and let me know what sort of expectations or hopes you may have of this inquiry?


Warm regards,

Jon

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Wed Jan 13, 2016 11:41 am

What I hope for from my inquiry is to possibly receive a confirmation as to a view of the all that I already have .

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JonathanR
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby JonathanR » Wed Jan 13, 2016 1:30 pm

Thank you Ilazmit,
What I hope for from my inquiry is to possibly receive a confirmation as to a view of the all that I already have .
Could you say a little more about that, please? It may help to form a starting point for inquiry.

Before we go further, you probably have read it already but please read this disclaimer : http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2/

...and agree to the following few ground rules for our conversation:

Please post at least onece a day or let me know if you can't manage this. Regular posting will definitely help whilst sporadic posting tends to hinder.

For the duration of our conversation please stop reading spiritual literature or teachings or watching videos on spiritual paths. Instead focus on this conversation.

Please try to avoid long and intellectual answers. Often brief and direct responses to questions are better than 'worked out' answers and the latter may even hinder realisation.

Honesty is essential. Please agree to be completely honest in answering questions.

Let me know if you cannot agree to any of these requests.



Best wishes,

Jon

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Wed Jan 13, 2016 4:56 pm

Read the disclaimer. I'm 54 and have never been diagnosed with a mental disorder, and I will try to be as honest as possible. I am not available most Tuesdays and Fridays since I start work at 8:30 and finish 20:30. I appreciate your efforts.

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Wed Jan 13, 2016 5:12 pm

To elaborate on my statement:"What I hope for from my inquiry is to possibly receive a confirmation as to a view of the all that I already have", From my 54 yrs. of experience, I have come to the conclusion that what we experience with our 5 senses and thoughts may be a hindrance to what really is.

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Wed Jan 13, 2016 6:27 pm

I am seeking a way to put this concept into practise and I believe I have come to the right place.

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JonathanR
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby JonathanR » Wed Jan 13, 2016 10:10 pm

Hi Ilazmit,

Thanks for agreeing to my requests and for letting me know about your hours. I understand about Tuesdays and Fridays so we will just work with that.
From my 54 yrs. of experience, I have come to the conclusion that what we experience with our 5 senses and thoughts may be a hindrance to what really is...

I am seeking a way to put this concept into practise and I believe I have come to the right place.
Thank you for elaborating about this. I have to ask how you come to this conclusion about senses and thoughts being a hindrance? In what way do they hinder? Do you feel hindered by them, and how?

best wishes,

Jon

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Wed Jan 13, 2016 10:25 pm

I think that there is much more to reality than what can be constrained by our 5 senses and our thoughts. There are certain repetitive thought patterns that I would love to not be attached to, and I feel hindered by them because they feel somewhat parasitic. for example, "Man, are you getting old"

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Wed Jan 13, 2016 10:28 pm

I really appreciate this Jon , especially since my friend told me that this is all volunteer .

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JonathanR
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby JonathanR » Thu Jan 14, 2016 12:28 am

Hi again,
I think that there is much more to reality than what can be constrained by our 5 senses and our thoughts.
Do the five senses constrain? I want you to take a look directly at your experience here. Is there an experience of being constrained by senses or of senses causing some kind of constraint? How does this constraint manifest?
There are certain repetitive thought patterns that I would love to not be attached to, and I feel hindered by them because they feel somewhat parasitic. for example, "Man, are you getting old"
Yes, that is a familiar one! Thoughts do seem to have a life of their own, don't they? I mean,(take a look at this by the Way), if there were actually a separate self somewhere, a real entity, 'me', surely that self would have it organised to think only nice or creative thoughts?

By the way you may have noticed I am quoting parts of text. I am using the 'quote' function that is available if you scroll down and click the 'Full Editor' button. Try using it when you wish to quote something. You get two bracket's that appear and then its just a case of positioning your cursor between these and pasting in the quote.

Best wishes,

Jon

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Thu Jan 14, 2016 12:48 am

I think I understand the concept of there not being a separate self. It's putting this into practise that I have difficulty with.

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JonathanR
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby JonathanR » Thu Jan 14, 2016 12:59 am

Ok, in that case, where is a sense of self most obviously centred in your experience? Does ircseem to be somewhere in the body for example? Or behind the eyes? Or perhaps its strongly associated with thoughts or feelings? Let me know.

Jon

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ilazmit
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby ilazmit » Thu Jan 14, 2016 1:14 am

Hello Jon, and thanks for your help,
I would say my sense of self is most obviously centered in feelings of pain due to rejection, frustration, anger, etc. and the place I feel it most would be in the gut , or on the top of the back of my head. When in a state of euphoria , I don't think I am so very aware of my sense of self. I could be mistaken but I think losing the sense of self causes euphoria. When looking at a photo or in the mirror I definitely get a sense of self.

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JonathanR
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Re: Looking to end my suffering caused my attachment to depe

Postby JonathanR » Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:42 am

Hi Ilazmit,
. Hello Jon, and thanks for your help,
I would say my sense of self is most obviously centered in feelings of pain due to rejection, frustration, anger, etc. and the place I feel it most would be in the gut , or on the top of the back of my head.
You are very welcome.

Such definite feelings give a very clear focus, and provide a good opportunity, though not an easy one.

If possible focus on these feelings right now where they are experienced. Don't resist them and don't be afraid of allowing them to flow. They may be powerful but they can't hurt you.

Now, look. Is it 'your' pain? Or simply pain? Look into to the heart of the experience. In the pain or anger, is there a 'someone' found, 'experiencing pain', or is it simply pain flowing and hurting?

Who or what is hurting? Or is there just the flowing of pain?

(I apologise if this exercise is found to be too annoying or painful. But its definitely worth trying).

Best wishes,

Jon


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