Request a guide

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pietalinda
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Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Fri Sep 04, 2015 12:32 am

-I really don´t know. Last thursday it became clear to me that I want to know the truth. I pronounced a wish to meet somebody who would ask me the right questions and perhaps help a bit. That was a funny wish since I´m currently staying by myself in a middle of nowhere in a country where I don´t know anybody. Well. The same evening I ended up cleaning the laptop and the book -Gateless gatecrashers- was on the desktop. No idea how, when or from where it got there. Just happened to have a look at the PDF-file before trashing it -or not. Started reading and laughing for that there were all these questions and some help too. After reading wrote 3 days around the answers. And here I am.

-I guess I´ve been seeking all my life. Was never really satisfied with the given answers about life and it´s purpose. The directions have been many and sometimes entangled, also very lost. The latest attempts were in Vipassana (Goenka style) but never got deeply engaged with that (fighting mind with mind didn´t make much mind to me), some yoga and basically just reading and thinking.

-Firstly I would like to be sure I´m clear and through with the help of the book only or if I need some furter hand holding and ass kicking. Not that I would have too much doubt either, but yeah, the mind is having its´ own stories. Secondly, if I´m clear, I would love some beginners baby-care and shareing. Or the guide if that´s the case.

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Sep 04, 2015 1:07 am

Hi Pietalinda,

My name is Kay, and I am happy to assist in exploring the illusion of the separate self, though I can only point the way. You have to see it for yourself. That is why we are described as guides, not teachers.

We will simply have a conversation, the aim of which will be for you to make the realisation that there is no separate self. That will be our focus. I will tend to ask various questions and set you some exercises, but nobody will be judging you. You can't get this wrong.

This process is a guided inquiry where specific areas can be examined. I am not a teacher. This is YOUR inquiry. I will not be giving you new ideas and beliefs; only assisting you in examining and questioning the ones that you already have.

Before we start, let’s get through the formalities first:
If you haven't already seen it, there is introductory info here, the disclaimer and a short video too.
http://www.liberationunleashed.com/

A few ground rules:
1. Post at least once a day, if you cannot post, or need more time, let me know.
2. Be 100% honest in your answers and inquiry.
3. Answer only from direct experience (felt senses and observed thoughts). Read this article at http://liberationunleashed.com/articles ... xperience/ for more help on distinguishing what is direct experience.) Longwinded analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress.
4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies and such for the remainder of this investigation.
Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily and
essential meditation practice, it is fine to continue that.
5. Understand that I will be guiding you, rather than teaching you, and the more you put into this process the more you will get out of it.

Technical support:
- You can reply to this thread by pushing the purple-orange coloured button 'Post Reply" at the left bottom of this page.
- You can learn to use the quote function, instructions are located in the link below this line:
http://liberationunleashed.com/nation/v ... ?f=4&t=660
- Please click the 'subscribe topic' link at the very bottom of the page to ensure you get an email whenever a reply comes in.
- The site has a habit of logging you out while you write a reply, which can mean you lose what you have written. One way to avoid this is to write elsewhere (word document), then just paste the message into the 'reply' window when you're ready to send.

If you are happy to agree to the above and have me your guide, we can start the process.

What are your expectations for seeing through the illusion of the separate self?
How will Life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Fri Sep 04, 2015 8:07 pm

Hi dear Kay,
I´m grateful to have you as my guide, thank

you.

Let´s get the party started!

What are your expectations for seeing through

the illusion of the separate self?
How will Life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?

I sure had some expectations but I can´t say any more. What is different now (after reading the book), there is much more space, laughter, energy and easiness in all. Certainty, no friction.

The biggest change is in thoughts; as there is no more "what should I think about this... What do they think about me... Where and how should I look to find my true self... etc." it feels very relaxing and such a relief.

Also a markable change is seeing that creativity is easy, not difficult. No need to search something extraordinary, it´s just like the thoughts go into the body and the body prints them out in a suitable form. Creativity is big part of my work and I´ve felt hilarious working today.

Tons of love!

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Sat Sep 05, 2015 3:30 am

Hi Pietalinda,

Is Pietalinda how you like to be addressed or is there another name which you prefer?

For the purposes of guiding and to fill your request to see whether you are 'clear' or not, I would ask that you answer all questions on an individual basis. Please read the instructions on how to use the quote function, as this function is important as it keeps the questions and answers visible and clear. Here is the link: http://liberationunleashed.com/nation/v ... ?f=4&t=660

Even though you have answered the questions, I would like for you to sit with each question again and then again give me your answers. You wrote about some changes that you have noticed and I would still like to hear if there are still any expectations for further changes and expectations on what being clear means. Expectations are what hinder clear seeing. So for the purpose of clarity, please answer the following questions individually:

What are your expectations for seeing through the illusion of the separate self?
How will Life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?

A couple of extra questions:

What is missing?
What would you like to achieve or obtain by this conversation?

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Sun Sep 06, 2015 9:36 am

Dear Kay,
Ok, sure.
Is Pietalinda how you like to be addressed or is there another name which you prefer?
-Pietalinda is good, it's my given name.
What are your expectations for seeing through the illusion of the separate self?
-Freedom from the story of the stories, truth.
How will Life change?
-It will keep on changing as it always did.
How will you change?
-I don't change, the perspective does.
What will be different?
Nothing in reality, just how I see everything.
What is missing?
-Oh nothing at all. Life is overwhelming.
What would you like to achieve or obtain by this conversation?
Clarity.
Love and gratitude,
Pietalinda

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Mon Sep 07, 2015 5:40 am

Hi Pietalinda,

Thank you so much for taking the time and effort in learning the quote function and for answering the questions again – I appreciate it! :)

When you read my responses to your answers, I would like you to watch for any resistance that arises and to take note of the resistance and let me know what the resistance is and how it showed up.
What are your expectations for seeing through the illusion of the separate self?
-Freedom from the story of the stories, truth.
There is no separate self; a separate entity that could be free or not free from any story. Thoughts just appear but nothing is having or thinking them, so there is nothing that could gain freedom.
How will Life change?
-It will keep on changing as it always did.
Yes
How will you change?
-I don't change, the perspective does.
Yes
What will be different?
Nothing in reality, just how I see everything.
There is no separate entity/individual, other than an idea to see everything differently.
What is missing?
-Oh nothing at all. Life is overwhelming.
There is no separate entity, other than an idea, that can be overwhelmed by life or anything. Thoughts appear that say life is overwhelming, but thoughts know nothing.
What would you like to achieve or obtain by this conversation?
Clarity
There is no separate entity, other than an idea, that could achieve or gain clarity or anything.

Once again please be mindful of any resistance that arises and let me know, in detail, what the resistance is.

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Mon Sep 07, 2015 1:23 pm

Kay darlink!

Thank you for the sweet patience and compassion.
There is no separate self; a separate entity that could be free or not free from any story. Thoughts just appear but nothing is having or thinking them, so there is nothing that could gain freedom.
Yes. The words you use open up, expand. With freedom ment that there is nobody believing in "me" so the truth can be seen. That shrinks into vast now for that freedom is conditional.
There is no separate entity/individual, other than an idea to see everything differently.
Yes.
There is no separate entity, other than an idea, that can be overwhelmed by life or anything. Thoughts appear that say life is overwhelming, but thoughts know nothing.
Yes. Life is full of life. Overwhelming was not a good choise of a word. That also brings clarity, to really ponder around the words.
There is no separate entity, other than an idea, that could achieve or gain clarity or anything.
Clear. (Bhihii!)

Luv,
Pietalinda

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Wed Sep 09, 2015 2:09 am

Hi Pietalinda,

Nice looking! So let’s take it further. Let’s be clear on thoughts in general. Sit for approximately 15 or more minutes and investigate the following questions.

Where do thoughts come from?
Where are they going?
What is the thinker of thoughts?
Do you think thoughts or are there only thoughts about you?
What do thoughts belong to? What owns them?
Is there anything that is has sequential lines of thoughts?
Is there anything that controls thoughts?
Can anything choose not to have painful or negative thoughts?
Can you stop thinking a thought in the middle?
Is it possible to prevent a thought from appearing? Including the thought 'I'?
Can you predict your next thought?
Can you push away any thought?
Yes. Life is full of life. Overwhelming was not a good choise of a word. That also brings clarity, to really ponder around the words.
What ponders words and is there anything that is pondering or choosing words?

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Wed Sep 09, 2015 8:34 pm

Kay darlink!
Where do thoughts come from?
Where are they going?
From nowhere to anywhere.
What is the thinker of thoughts?
No one.
Do you think thoughts or are there only thoughts about you?
Only thoughts about me.
What do thoughts belong to? What owns them?
Nowhere and nothing. Would be a bad joke / heavy curse to be the owner of thoughts.
Is there anything that is has sequential lines of thoughts?
Is there anything that controls thoughts?
Thoughts by themselves sometimes get organized. Nothing behind them having a lead.
Can anything choose not to have painful or negative thoughts?
Noup.
Can you stop thinking a thought in the middle? Is it possible to prevent a thought from appearing? Including the thought 'I'? Can you predict your next thought?
Can you push away any thought?
No, no, no. None.
What ponders words and is there anything that is pondering or choosing words?
Mind ponders if we can call this automatically running multi-functional program as mind. There is a thought choosing the most suitable symbols to express itself.

Luv,
Pietalinda

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Thu Sep 10, 2015 2:21 am

Hi Pietalinda,
Thoughts by themselves sometimes get organized. Nothing behind them having a lead.
Are thoughts capable of organising anything?
Can a thought ‘do’ anything?

It seems that thoughts get organised, but that is just another thought saying that thoughts get organised; and thoughts know nothing.

Can you see this?
Mind ponders if we can call this automatically running multi-functional program as mind. There is a thought choosing the most suitable symbols to express itself.
Where can this mind actually be found?
What does a mind look like? Describe it to me please.

What is experiencing ‘automatically running multi-functional program’?
Where is this ‘automatically running multi-functional program found’?
What is the actual experience of 'automatically running multi-functional program'?

What is the actual experience of a ‘symbol’?
What is choosing ‘symbols’?

Can a thought choose to ‘express itself’?
When does a thought choose a ‘symbol’ to express itself?
What actually is expressing?

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:25 pm

Dearest Kay,
Are thoughts capable of organising anything?
Can a thought ‘do’ anything?
Thoughts can get organised around subjects like making a shopping list or answering this question. Thoughts can 'do' in order to send an impuls to the body. Thoughts can also solve some tasks, for example calculations.
It seems that thoughts get organised, but that is just another thought saying that thoughts get organised; and thoughts know nothing.
This i don't see no matter how hard i try. Aren't thoughts organised when making a shopping list? Thinking of what is missing and needs to be bought and from where and how to drive there and so on. Aren't thoughts organised when having a conversation? Listening, understanding, thinking, thinking an answer, speaking? They don't just run loose then.
Where can this mind actually be found?
What does a mind look like? Describe it to me please.
Mind is a word i used to point to the non visible space where thinking, emotions, likings and so on happens. I cannot describe how any of these look like. They are not visible. And no, mind is not a separate entity. Let's forget about it and speak about all of them separately.
What is experiencing ‘automatically running multi-functional program’?
Where is this ‘automatically running multi-functional program found’?
What is the actual experience of 'automatically running multi-functional program'?
That awereness that has an access to these thoughts, emotions etc. It is found around that body. The actual experience is a possibility to observe these thoughts, emotions etc. around that body. Cannot observe the ones around somebody else's.
What is the actual experience of a ‘symbol’?
What is choosing ‘symbols’?
Symbols, like words feel right -or wrong- to describe thoughts. They get chosen accordingly.
Can a thought choose to ‘express itself’?
When does a thought choose a ‘symbol’ to express itself?
What actually is expressing?
Some thoughts choose to be spoken, written or otherwise shared. The symbols are used to make that possible. Expressing is giving a form to a thought/s.

Uh, that was hard today. Something is missing here but I just don't see.
Luv,
Pietalinda

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:36 am

Hi Pietalinda,

Let’s see if what seems to be ‘missing’ can be ‘found’! Let’s start with an exercise.

This is a 20 - 30 minute exercise I would like you to do please. Then answer each of the questions one-by-one please.

Sit quietly and pay close attention to thoughts for 20 - 30 minutes. Notice that thoughts seem to appear out of nowhere and have no obvious cause or reason for their appearance or their sequence. Can you predict the next thought that appears? Observe thought closely. Try to determine what thought will appear next before it appears. Can you do this? Isn’t a thought only known as it appears? It seems that thought has some logical ordered appearance, but look carefully and just notice if there is an organised sequence or is that just another thought that says ‘these thoughts are being organised, and that one thought follows another thought’?

1) Were you able to control any thoughts?
2) Could you predict what thought would appear next before it appeared?
3) Were you able to determine what thought would follow another thought?

All thoughts are thoughts.

Can you see that “these thoughts are being organised, and that one thought follows another thought” - is itself a thought that is appearing?

Can you see that?

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Fri Sep 11, 2015 9:53 pm

Dear Kay,
I need more time with that. I'll write tomorrow.
Luv,
Pietalinda

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forgetmenot
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Re: Request a guide

Postby forgetmenot » Sat Sep 12, 2015 7:35 am

Hi Pietalinda,

Thank you for letting me know.....I really appreciate your thoughtfulness. I look forward to your post.

Love Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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pietalinda
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Re: Request a guide

Postby pietalinda » Sat Sep 12, 2015 7:20 pm

Dearest Kay,
Thank you for patience.

Along with sitting quietly i had to observe speaking and listening closely to see something.
Were you able to control any thoughts?
No. Thoughts seem to cease momentarily when observing them and while listening or speaking, also when speaking "by myself " mute. So speaking is not a process where thoughts translate into words. No, speaking is speaking, thoughts are thoughts.
Could you predict what thought would appear next before it appeared?
Nope.
Were you able to determine what thought would follow another thought?
No.
Can you see that “these thoughts are being organised, and that one thought follows another thought” - is itself a thought that is appearing?
Yes, now i see that.

Luv,
Pietalinda


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