Guidance please

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TheO
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Guidance please

Postby TheO » Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:27 am

Hello my name is TheO, I live in Atlanta GA I am seeking a guide. Thank you 8)

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Wed Jan 21, 2015 9:48 am

Welcome to LU. My name is Tanya and I'd be happy to guide you. Could you tell me something about yourself and what your expectations are of this process? How do you think you life will be different from how it is now?

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TheO
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Re: Guidance please

Postby TheO » Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:41 pm

Namaste Tanya,
Just found this reply. Also just sent you another describing myself and journey. As to these questions, I am approaching out of curiousity and interest and currently have no expectations other than to learn about no self. My life is ever evolving moment by moment not sure how the difference will be, but I know I can learn from the experience and I approach with an open mind. Thank you, TheO

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:22 pm

Hi TheO

Great to see you're finding your way around the forum now.
Before we begin there are a few guidelines to guide this dialogue, please respond to confirm:
1. You agree to post at least once a day.
2. In general, the guide will ask the questions for you to respond to
3. Responses require your utmost honesty
4. Responses are best from direct experience (felt senses and observed thoughts). Longwinded
analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress.
5. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies and such for the remainder of this investigation.
Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily and
essential meditation practice, it is fine to continue that.
6. Please learn to use the quote function; instructions are located in the link below this line:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=660”

1)You can press 'subscribe to this topic' in the blue bar at the bottom of this page and receive a notification email every time I post here.

2) The site has a nasty habit of logging you out while you write a reply, which can mean you lose what you have written. One way to avoid this is to write elsewhere, then just paste the message into the 'reply' window when you're ready to send.

Looking forward to getting started!

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:05 pm

You mentioned in our other thread that you are bipolar are you currently stable? Seeing through the illusion is likely to call into question everything you ever believed; like having the rug pulled out from under one can be de-stabilising, which I don't want to do.

I'm quite happy to continue just thought we should clear that up before we begin.

Tanya :)

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TheO
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Re: Guidance please

Postby TheO » Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:56 am

Namaste Tanya, yes I agree to the guidelines, I am currently stable with my bipolar & ready to go forward...

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Sat Jan 24, 2015 8:48 am

Great! Let's get started...
The first thing to investigate is to find out what you currently believe yourself to be.
This should be kept very simple and should not be anything requiring in-depth analysis or thought. All that is required is to look into what is experienced directly.
How the 'I' or 'me' is usually experienced is that of a person with a body/mind.
Usually the 'I' refers to the body that appears here in awareness and that 'I' am in control of it. I am this body.
Since 'I' am this body 'I see','I hear','I touch' - I perform all of the senses.
This body was born - It will live a number of years - And then it (I) will die.

Feel free to reject what I have suggested if they don't match what you currently believe yourself to be.

Currently, would it be fair to say that you believe that currently you are a person sitting in a chair, looking at a computer screen and reading words off it right now?

Tanya :)

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TheO
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Re: Guidance please

Postby TheO » Sat Jan 24, 2015 3:21 pm

I believe I am a being a soul and spirit having a human experience.
TheO

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Sat Jan 24, 2015 8:41 pm

I believe I am a being a soul and spirit having a human experience.
TheO
Can you see that is just a thought? Looking at direct experience only. Only what can be found by looking at the five senses right now, what do you find?

Now we try to find the ‘owner’ of the body.
We are LOOKing for a real ‘I’. Real is something that can be found.

What I want you to do for our examination together, is to try to separate out thoughts from what is ‘real’.
But at first, as an example, let’s try to find Darth Vader.
We’re looking for a real Darth Vader that can be found.
In order to prove that it exists, we have to experience it directly by seeing, hearing, touching/feeling, smelling.

The image projected to the cinema screen is not it.
The poster on the wall about Darth Vader is not it.
The memory in ‘my head’ about Darth Vader is not a proof of its existence.
A thought suggesting that “he may be exist somewhere in the galaxy” is just an idea, but not a proof of it.
A lego figure of Darth Vader is not a real Darth Vader.
A life size wax figure exhibited in a museum is not it.
A twelve-year old boy dressed in a Darth Vader costume is not it.

Now, try to find the ‘I’ that supposedly owns the body. Look everywhere. Search every corner of the body, memories, feelings, thoughts, or any other places. Don’t leave any stones unturned.

Let's take 'seeing' as a first example.

Right now, these words on the screen are being seen. Examine the actual experience right now.

Tanya xx

tanyawilliams86
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Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Mon Jan 26, 2015 10:55 pm

Hey TheO!
Just wondering how you're going with investigating what I asked you :)

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TheO
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Re: Guidance please

Postby TheO » Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:01 pm

"Can you see that is just a thought? Looking at direct experience only. Only what can be found by looking at the five senses right now, what do you find?"
I see it as a thought, in fact everything is thought no? I find all 5 senses are functioning.

" Now we try to find the ‘owner’ of the body.
We are LOOKing for a real ‘I’. Real is something that can be found. "
To me it seems I function through use of the body, like a sensitive vehicle. I am able to use the 5 senses as well as someone else can see, taste , touch, hear, & smell me.

"Let's take 'seeing' as a first example.

Right now, these words on the screen are being seen. Examine the actual experience right now."
I am counsious, with eyes open I see physical reality, the screen is 2 feet in front of my eyes I read and see the screen.
TheO

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:12 pm

I see it as a thought, in fact everything is thought no? I find all 5 senses are functioning.
So without thought you can't experience the 5 senses?

To me it seems I function through use of the body, like a sensitive vehicle. I am able to use the 5 senses as well as someone else can see, taste , touch, hear, & smell me.
Leaving thoughts aside:
Is there a seer that sees or just seeing?
Is there a taster that tastes or just tasting?
Is there a toucher that touches or just touching?
Is there a smeller that smells or just smelling?
Who is this 'I' that apparently does all these things. Can you find an 'I' controlling the senses?

Right now, these words on the screen are being seen. Examine the actual experience right now."
I am counsious, with eyes open I see physical reality, the screen is 2 feet in front of my eyes I read and see the screen.
Try closing your eyes and see what you experience and then open them. We are looking at what is happening not what thought says. An arising thought is real but the content is not.

Now for a closer look at hearing and smelling
Pay attention for the background sounds. Go to the actual experience itself, and ignore the suggestions of thoughts.
Does a hearer arise in the actual experience?
Is there somewhere a hearer, of just hearing happening?
Smelling
Smell something, an orange, coffee or the hand.
In the fragrance that arises, is there any direct evidence that there is a smeller (or a nose) that is doing the smelling, or is there only smelling?

Of course, thoughts and mental images suggest ‘explanations’, but when they are examined closely, are they really the case?
Love Tanya

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TheO
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Re: Guidance please

Postby TheO » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:36 am

Namaste Tanya,

Yes I believe I am the reciever that experiences the senses outside of thoughts. Kind of like a television is to the tv signal, without the signal the tv is blank.

tanyawilliams86
Posts: 445
Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:03 pm

Re: Guidance please

Postby tanyawilliams86 » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:24 am

Namaste Tanya,

Yes I believe I am the reciever that experiences the senses outside of thoughts. Kind of like a television is to the tv signal, without the signal the tv is blank.
Can you find this 'reciever'? Is this not just another thought labelling experience? When we look in direct experience we are just looking at the 5 senses.
OK. When you're face-to-face to somebody observe what is happening. There is a body seen and labelled as ‘my boss’ or ‘co-workers’. In the actual experience that body can be seen, heard, touched, smelled, tasted. That's all. And yet, there is a belief that IN that body there is something, an entity with certain traits and characteristics.
But where are those characteristics?
How those characteristics of the boss are experienced, with which of the 5 senses?
You look at the body called X. It is believed that he the boss who behaves in a certain way.
But how is this known?
In the moment of seeing the body called X, where is the ‘boss’?
With which of the 5 senses the 'boss' experienced?
In the moment of pure seeing, hearing, touching where are these supposed entities in those bodies?
In the actual experience where are THEM? Where are OTHERS?
If there is no me here, are there others?

Love Tanya

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TheO
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Re: Guidance please

Postby TheO » Fri Jan 30, 2015 2:48 am

Ok, so if there is no TheO and no Tanya, how are we conversing? 8)


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