AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

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CreatriX
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AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:21 pm

This week - while reading different discussion forums on spirituality, I have noticed that RuthlessTruth topics are hot and the most frequently visited recently.
So I am checking what is this about and if it really can free me from the ego ?
Because that's what I need and want all my life! It can be the end of the word for me (as I knew it)...
And I feel excited and enthusiastic about Direct Pointing method because it sounds to me so easy and simple, that its almost hard to believe.

I was raised catholic and my spiritual journey started 21 years ago. Before reading Eckart Tolle, I was inspired by Paul Brunton, Deepak Chopra, Stanislav Grof, Rudolf Steiner. I am interested in mysticism, astrology, magick, theosophy, joga, buddhism, altered states of concsiousness, art, nature.

I don't doubt that there's no ego, I know it's just a mind made construction, a 2 dimensional shadow .
I have to admit that I love to think and enjoy observing the thoughts in my mind -(I never get bored :-)).

According to the atmavicharya meditation, the question is : Who am I ? ( obviously, not the ego).
The answer comes from the heart : it's just "I AM" (the Overself = a qualitatively higher state of mind).
Now, what you are saying simply is: there's no you ! What is blowing away my mind.
What is your answer to this : Where does the Will come from ? (Not my will, but Thy Will ...)

The Kingdom of Heaven is a state of mind without the ego.
And its clear to me : No ego - no problem.
Lately, I am not happy with my life at all.
I admit that I have driven my life into a dead end street (my fault).
What I am going through is an existential-, midlife-, spiritual-, plus global c r i s i s all together.
I have no more ideas what I should to do about it - so I am doing nothing.
I feel that I have no future and nothing to loose, no energy and interest to keep going on - I am giving it up.
I would not mind to die soon (I am not afraid of death)- it would be a solution - though I would never kill myself.
My intuition says that all I have to do is to surrend, to sacrifice my ego. But I just DON'T NOW HOW !?
P.S.
I promise at least one post a day.
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Robin.
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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:35 pm

Hi Creatrix. This is Robin. I am new to passing through the gate. I am willing to help you join me and many others on the other side. The bottom line is that you will have to do it yourself. To do that I need you to be 100% honest with your answers to my questions. Not for my sake, but for yours. Would you like me to assist you?

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CreatriX
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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Mon Dec 19, 2011 9:29 pm

Yes, Robin, I am ready and honest as I can be...
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Robin.
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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:03 am

Great! Lets get going then.

please tell me what your direct understanding of "No self " and freedom from the ego really means.

And also what in your understanding the "I " is?


take your time to really think about these questions and don't feel obligated to come up with an Intellectual answer. Just answer in your own, heartfelt experience.

Robin.

P.S. A first name would be really nice, that way I can talk directly to a name you've had all your life.

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CreatriX
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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:53 pm

Robin,
By 'direct understanding' you mean my personal experiences in different states of mind ?

In the state of "No-self" everything just happens, flows by itself, without any effort from my side. There is this most natural feeling and knowing of being an essential part of everything what goes on in life.

For example, going for a walk : its like, I am not the walker but the ground is moving under the feet. There is a sense of less gravity being involved, an airy feeling of walking a bit above the ground, almost levitating...

Or, it's not me, who is listening to the music , but I am deeply inside in the Realm of Sounds, it's all over me; there is hearing, perceiving of the vibrations with every atom of the body...

And, there is no such thing (as in normal, ego-state of mind), that 'I am dancing'. It's not 'me' who is dancing, but the body is perfectly tuned into the Movement and resonates in harmony. There is this experience of that
the dance, the dancer, and the dancing is just one unlimited flow.

Intellectually and very simply my understanding is:
the I AM = God/Consciousness/Awareness/Tao/Being/Is-ness/Life/Love etc.
the ego (me, you) = personality, individuality bio-physical body, emotions, feelings, thoughts, concepts, ideas).

The human ego is a mental construction, created by thoughts. It 's source, origin is in the I AM.
The virtual reality , the cyberspace is just another mental realm created by humans.
The I AM is the only reality. Consciousness is all there is.

Freedom from the ego means for me : no more making decisions, choosing between two sides, no more thinking about what to do, what to choose, how to solve, and so on.
Freedom from the perspective of this binding duality. Rising above it, perceiving from a higher perspective.
P.S.
Can I have questions to you during this process of liberating ?
Agynes
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:22 am

Hi Agynes

Your reply tells me you are extremely well read on this subject. This second post, and your first also indicates what your expectations are from liberation. Now, let me take you and point you to the gate.
For example, going for a walk : its like, I am not the walker but the ground is moving under the feet. There is a sense of less gravity being involved, an airy feeling of walking a bit above the ground, almost levitating...

Or, it's not me, who is listening to the music , but I am deeply inside in the Realm of Sounds, it's all over me; there is hearing, perceiving of the vibrations with every atom of the body...
O.K. This is second hand information, paraphrased, or it could even be copied and pasted from the writings of someone else.
What I want you to do Agynes is drop all the knowledge you have on none duality, oneness, or liberation. Lets pretend you know nothing. Only by direct seeing can you move forward. I want you to look closely and describe to me exactly what you see.

O.K.. When looking inside yourself for the "I", where is it? Really look for this I and tell me what you feel. What thoughts arise and where in feelings do they manifest themselves?

Don't be tempted to Intellectualise, just simply allow yourself to be like a child that is describing what she is seeing in all honesty, and innocence.

If you can manage a walk outside, keep these thoughts of your "I " and tell me what you notice about yourself in relation to everything around you.
Can I have questions to you during this process of liberating ?
Yes by all means ask me anything you like.

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Wed Dec 21, 2011 6:04 pm

No, dear Robin. These are all my own personal direct experiences !
Is this a misunderstanding here?
I understand that If you have never had these kind of experiences, you will not understand how does it feel and what I am talking about. Well, I regret writing about it. Silence is golden...

Anyways, if I am supposed to forget about them in this process of liberation, I am willing to do it.

You want me to describe what I see. What I see with my physical eyes or with my inner seeing (intuition, heart)??

I would say that the "I" is in my aura. (My physical body is also a part of it.)
It is just vibrations,various patterns, waves. And if I get sad, those vibrations change their color, frequency,
A part of my "I" is also in this post and anybody who reeds it, gets in touch with my I.
The "I" is attached to my every thought and feeling - they manifests through the I.
The 'I" is everywhere and nowhere, it cannot be localized. The 'I' can be projected even into the eye of the galaxy.

It seems to me that the question ' where is the I' is just not right.
It's like asking: where is God? Do you see it? No? Then God does not exist !
Oh, I guess, probably I just don't get what you mean... Sorry.
Are we trying to catch a black cat in a totally black room - when there is no cat in there...?
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Wed Dec 21, 2011 7:27 pm

No, dear Robin. These are all my own personal direct experiences !
Is this a misunderstanding here?
I understand that If you have never had these kind of experiences, you will not understand how does it feel and what I am talking about. Well, I regret writing about it. Silence is golden...
If these are your own direct experiences you could not possibly want to be searching for anything else. You have found the ultimate requirement for complete satisfaction with no further questions that needs answering
would say that the "I" is in my aura. (My physical body is also a part of it.)
It is just vibrations,various patterns, waves. And if I get sad, those vibrations change their color, frequency,
A part of my "I" is also in this post and anybody who reeds it, gets in touch with my I.
The "I" is attached to my every thought and feeling - they manifests through the I.
The 'I" is everywhere and nowhere, it cannot be localized. The 'I' can be projected even into the eye of the galaxy.
Tell me where this "I" can be found Your physical body does not contain you. Your physical body contains your brain, which contains your thoughts, your moods, your so called personality, and most of all and to the point. Your ego. All of which are not The "I" Or the I am.
If you examine your thoughts and watch how they come and go. I ask you to try and stop them. Its impossible. Now try and predict what your next thought will be. You can't. If your I is your body. What happens when you lose a part of it? Does part of you die? If you are your consciousness, where does this go when you are sleeping.

I personally have experienced all kinds of wonderful things. But until I was liberated from the false belief that There is duality, even between self, and body. I never experienced anything.

Now if you would like me to carry on I am more than happy to. But I do ask you again to look inside yourself, and tell me where you can find an I. You will only find a brain that is conditioned, by your parents initially, and then by many, many, other people along your life's path. These false beliefs about yourself were strengthened without any challenge, and your egoic self then took over controlling you.

I asked you to pretend you knew nothing about liberation, and none duality to enable me to help you through a process that would free you from these illusory beliefs through direct seeing. Until you can see for yourself that there is no "I" You won't be able to go any further. Everything in your head is all thoughts, and feelings, and beliefs. Search for the I that is you. And tell me where it can be found. This is not a belief system we are offering here. Its assistance in seeing the absolute truth by yourself. When this happens, words are inadequate to describe what happens in my experience.

Much respect

Robin.

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CreatriX
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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Wed Dec 21, 2011 9:11 pm

In duality, in this level of consciousness, I am right now, there is a self, because I have a sense of being myself.
I agree with you that I cannot find it because it does not exist.
I do KNOW that it is illusion - but it does not FEEL like that to me.
So, free me from it - please. Lead me to the next step.

There was no duality and it was a direct experience of the Truth, the Reality , when I was in altered states of consciousness, induced by psychedelics. But it is gone... That's the problem.
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:07 am

In duality, in this level of consciousness, I am right now, there is a self, because I have a sense of being myself.
I agree with you that I cannot find it because it does not exist.
I do KNOW that it is illusion - but it does not FEEL like that to me.
So, free me from it - please. Lead me to the next step.

There was no duality and it was a direct experience of the Truth, the Reality , when I was in altered states of consciousness, induced by psychedelics. But it is gone... That's the problem.

Ah! Now this makes more sense to me. Your experiences were drug induced. I can relate to this easily being an ageing hippy. I have had many such drug induced incidents, though I hasten to say, it was a long time ago. They were no more real than the no-one who is writing this to no- one now.


Now Agynes. We both know that Psychedelic, or psychotropic drugs are extremely dangerous, and induce hypnotic states, unlike opioids which have a different effect, though do create a high, but none the less are extremely damaging, and are illegal.

Can you tell me Agynes. Are your expectations of liberation to be liken to your experiences from taking drugs?

Can you see that the I that is watching all your thoughts, and feelings cannot be found anywhere?

When searching within to find the I. What feelings if any do you get? And where are they located?


Much love. Robin.

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:25 pm

We both know that Psychedelic, or psychotropic drugs are extremely dangerous, and induce hypnotic states, unlike opioids which have a different effect, though do create a high, but none the less are extremely damaging, and are illegal [/quote]
NO COMMENT

Are your expectations of liberation to be liken to your experiences from taking drugs?[/quote]
I don't expect anything. I let myself to be surprised.
Life has already taught me not to expect anything anymore - this way I can be grateful all the time for everything what meets me.

Can you see that the I that is watching all your thoughts, and feelings cannot be found anywhere? [/quote]
By watching you mean observing ? Are you asking : is there an observer or no?
My feelings and thoughts I sense in my aura, in my whole body (flesh and bones, brain and cells).

When searching within to find the I. What feelings if any do you get? And where are they located [/quote]
I get the feeling of searching. It's a sense of light electric current in my brain.
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Thu Dec 22, 2011 8:16 pm

We both know that Psychedelic, or psychotropic drugs are extremely dangerous, and induce hypnotic states, unlike opioids which have a different effect, though do create a high, but none the less are extremely damaging, and are illegal
NO COMMENT[/quote]

Perhaps I should have added that I have had a similar experience as this using drugs. The experience wasn't anything like the experience I had at liberation. The difference being. The drug experience was experienced by my ego. It was as a result of chemicals in my brain interfering with my perception. I was not being judgemental of your use of drugs. I personally suffered seriously from drug usage. I use the term "I" loosely by the way.
Are your expectations of liberation to be liken to your experiences from taking drugs?
I don't expect anything. I let myself to be surprised.
Life has already taught me not to expect anything anymore - this way I can be grateful all the time for everything what meets me.[/quote]

Good. I'm glad you don't have any expectations as anything you can imagine, or think you have, or will experience is nothing resembling what happens when you are through the gate. Words cannot describe what you may feel. Everyone is unique, and so is their experience.
Can you see that the I that is watching all your thoughts, and feelings cannot be found anywhere?
By watching you mean observing ? Are you asking : is there an observer or no?
My feelings and thoughts I sense in my aura, in my whole body (flesh and bones, brain and cells).[/quote]

I am asking. When watching as your thoughts come and go, can you see that there is a watcher separate from the thoughts which are your ego. Yes or no?
Your feelings and thoughts appear in your mind, which is an activity within your brain and is possible to monitor scientifically with instruments. Your aura is the outer extreme of your etheric body, not your physical body. This can also be seen using scientific instruments. We're not interested in your aura here. I am asking Can you see that there is another presence watching the activity within your brain?
When searching within to find the I. What feelings if any do you get? And where are they located
I get the feeling of searching. It's a sense of light electric current in my brain.[/quote]

Good. Do you agree with the following. The person Agynes. Is a construct of thoughts feelings, sensations, and emotions. She lives within a body that thinks and is operated by a brain. Agynes was constructed slowly over her lifetime by repetition, conditioning, and a certain amount of free will that developed as she grew older. Nothing about Agynes is authentic, except the watcher, that watches the coming and going of thoughts, feelings etc (The brain ) ?

And finally. What comes first to this body. Thoughts, or feelings? Please watch very closely and observe how your thoughts do not stand still. How you have no control over them. How when you try to stop them they become louder. The only thing that is constant is the watcher who is watching this happening. Where can this watcher be found.

Please work hard at this. Do not use second hand information. do not allow anything you have read, or heard influence you. Only use first hand information that "you" actually feel in the present moment.

Much love R

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:05 pm

First arise the thoughts, then comes the feelings and they are felt in the body.
There is a watcher in me - and I am in IT at the same time (because IT IS everywhere).

And, honestly, I am feeling lots of heavy frustration. Because my impression is that you don't understand what I mean and I don't understand what you mean - and I feel angry about it and have been crying on an off since yesterday. Confused by words, sentences, questions.

Yeah, I am giving it up ...
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby Robin. » Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:39 am

First arise the thoughts, then comes the feelings and they are felt in the body.
There is a watcher in me - and I am in IT at the same time (because IT IS everywhere).

And, honestly, I am feeling lots of heavy frustration. Because my impression is that you don't understand what I mean and I don't understand what you mean - and I feel angry about it and have been crying on an off since yesterday. Confused by words, sentences, questions.

Yeah, I am giving it up ...
Agynes. Anger to these questions is simply a sign of your ego tricking you into protecting itself. Before I can move any further in helping you It is essential that you see the fundamental basics that you are in no way related to your ego, or the created personality of Agynes. You have to drop all beliefs such as.
There is a watcher in me - and I am in IT at the same time (because IT IS everywhere).
My next question here would be this. have you direct experience of this happening now, or is this just a belief in your mind based on a past experience.

If you read other liberations you will see that I don't ask anything confusing. You have a complete understanding of the English language, it seems to me.

Yes! There is a watcher in you and everywhere at the same time. But if you were experiencing that watcher right now! As I am also. You would be elated, not sad.
I think you are basing your experiences of complete body/ego detachment on past experience, not present seeing and feelings. What you experienced through induced detachment of your brain was only a temporary feeling. I can sympathise with you to some extent as I have felt similar feelings when I was experimenting with mind altering substances many years ago. I am now a 59 year old man, and I can say with my hand on my heart that liberation, and the "beginning" of self realisation that I am not who I thought I was is not even close.

When you can view your ego for what it is. You will realise that this is operating independently of the watcher. Its job is obvious. It is there to protect itself, and your physical body. It will do anything to stop you seeing through its attempt to trick you. "You" are not your ego" This is fact. It is attempting to make you feel upset at not understanding a simple question. (In my case it filled me with acute anxiety and fear) In turn, it wins the battle and makes you say. "I am giving up" It is causing you to have your back against the gate, rather than facing it.

When liberation is complete, it is only then that you can begin to work on deepening your realisation and experience who knows what? I am finding new experiences every day.

By being liberated,you will no longer be a victim of feeling sad, upset, depressed. You will see that these are simply stories happening as you watch. "Sadness is happening" but it happens to no-one. Why? Because you are that watcher. Anything that happened to you a minute ago is now gone. So relating to any happenings, experiences, feelings, is false. There is only ever the present moment. Past and present cannot be relied upon. When you replay the video of past events in your head, it has no bearing on the present moment.

You must only use direct seeing/experiencing in the NOW.TRUE liberation and enlightenment cannot be induced by chemicals.Similarly, it is not practical to walk around in a state of euphoria, caused by the effects on certain brain receptors. Some chemicals can take you out of the 3rd dimensions, and drop you into the 2nd dimension for instance. Can you see how dangerous this would be when you need to walk to the shops ?

I hope you reconsider your intention to give up. This is only the very beginning of what is a life changing, wonderful transition from this fake world, and body mind we live with. I KNOW, I cannot help you in any way to reach the state you felt while under the influence of psychedelics. This wasn't a reality.Trust me.
If you would prefer someone else to try and help you I'm sure it can be arranged. There are many of us here from all walks of life who have seen through the illusion of self. My expectations, based on what I had read, and heard from the many satsangs, and writings of Papaji, Eckart Tolle, Ramana Maharshi,Tony Parsons, and many, many others, including Jesus. Were not what I expected. I was told this before I was liberated, and it was so very true. What you expect does not relate to what actually happens.

Much love,

Robin.

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Re: AWAkening is just a click AWAy ... (ifUwant2)

Postby CreatriX » Fri Dec 23, 2011 7:16 pm

Thank you Robin.
I don't know what to do.
"The teaching that the ego does not exist, can create intellectual confusion. The ego is only an idea--however strongly held by the mind--and as such does exist." Paul Brunton
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org ... vaita.html


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