Need a guidance

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Pashuk
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Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:10 pm

Hi!
My name is Pavel.
I suppose I need some help. Or not. Well, let me explain.
Several years ago I recognized that I am not what I think. It was great, but the habit to lie to myself was so strong that it created a tension in my head and throat along with a fear of almost everybody. I tried some practices but feel no benefit of them. Last year I was told about this forum. I read a good part of the book and Ilona's blog and the simplicity of the solution struck me. Everything became so obvious and natural. All the questions fell off. Just one "problem" left: I don't feel much love and compassion and so on; and the tension with the fear are still here, but they don't grab so much attension as they did before and I see that it's only matter of time to dissolve this old conditioning. Or I can approach it with better focus and try to see it clearer (of course, there's no me who decided and will accomplish this). This is the main reason I write here: your pointing questions will help me focus and see it better. Furthermore, I'm eager to show people how simple the truth is and help them to get out of suffering.
Thank all of for what your're doing <3
Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:59 pm

Hi Pavel

Welcome!

So you seem to have expectations that love and compassion will show up and tension and fear will fall away, when 'I' is seen through. Any other expectations?

You have recognised you are not what you think. What are you?

I can be your guide
We will have to post at least once a day
Generally I will ask questions for you to answer
You will refrain from spiritual search while we work together

greetings Vivi

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Pashuk
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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:20 am

Hi, Vivi!
Thank you for answer.
So you seem to have expectations that love and compassion will show up and tension and fear will fall away, when 'I' is seen through. Any other expectations?
Yes, I'm pretty tired of that tension. It's exhausting. It's not really that I expect immediate solution for that. I just see that one part of me wants to get rid of it and live normal life while another part knows that everything is for the best. My only expectation is to see clearly.
You have recognised you are not what you think. What are you?
When that recognition happened the question "Who am I?" lost its sense. I just burst into laughter. But this sudden knowledge did not take its shape in words - in communicative part of me - and that caused the fear of people who did not seem to care the obvious. This fear grabbed most of my attention and that was why I started seeking. Looking for people who understand this. And finally I found this community. Or it found me.
As for the essense of your question, I could answer "I just am", but that wouldn't be correct. Words always lie. In the feeling of "amness" there's no 'I'. 'I' is just an empty slot where you can insert everything you want.
Thank you once more. And ready for proceeding.
Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Wed Apr 03, 2013 4:13 pm

Hi Pavel

Good!

1. Are you the thinker of thoughts?
2. How does control happen?
3. Give examples from daily please.

Greetings Vivi

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Thu Apr 04, 2013 2:36 pm

Hi, Vivi!
Thank you for the questions.
What is control? It is a wish something to be this way, not that way. "I want her to be calm and loving. So if my behavior irritates her I would shut up and do whatever she wants." It resembles a magnet: all the thoughts and actions are drawn straightly along the force lines of its field. So thoughts and actions don't have thinker or actor. They just happen according to a specific program. And that program is being executed in this moment which has more power – the attention – at this very moment.
Most of the time the attention is occupied by one of the program, but once in a while throughout a day it jumps off and seeing is happened. And then it is pulled back by some power like vacuum-cleaner. This program contains many offences, hopes, wish to be in love and no trust in human love at the same time, and therefore loss of the sense to live and all-consuming sadness. But above that all there is the program that restricts any emotional expression. It's a miracle I write about this. Feel a little relaxation but still much left.
Thank you
Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:56 pm

Hi Pavel

So it functions according to a program.

When you look right now, where is that program to be found? What is it? Where does it come from?

Greetings Vivi

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:09 pm

Hi, Vivi!
Thank you very much indeed for these pointers for they helped me to detect the access to where all the programs take their birth. In the childhood this "place" is haunted and almost lived in. How could forget it? Yet the experience is not stable and it's difficult to describe.
It is the well known but long forgotten "state" or "perspective of observing" from where the world turns inside out: what seemed to be internal – thoughts, subtle senses – appears external, and vice versa, what seemed to be external – the body and all surroundings – appears internal. From this perspective everything seems magic, full of joy, silent and fully alert. It is the calling abyss of peace and happiness.
But that tension in the throat resists falling into the abyss, and the 'program' that supports it is clearly seen: "I must not abide this place because other will not understand me and therefore will not love me". I think I should take more time with this.
Thank you so much!
Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:34 pm

Hi Pavel

Yes take more time with that!

Isn't it great - guiding happens by it self :)

Greetings Vivi

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:57 am

Hi!
Something deeply shifted in me. Although the tension is still there, it becomes soft and transparent. Some deep relaxation begins in the belly and it somehow softens and expands the entire body. The deep control at the very foundation of my being is clearly seen now and starts to fade away.
My daylife is becoming full of the true sense of simple being; waves of immense joy shake up what is in tension; everything feels close, bright, fresh – including my own body; the relationship with my wife gets soft and nice. Yet still much left to dissolve, but that doesn't bother. Everything goes as it goes and that's what is truly wished for.
I'm very grateful to you and to the universe for everything that happens.
With love,
Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Sat Apr 06, 2013 3:02 pm

Hi Pavel

Sounds great!

Enjoy the state as it is right now AND be aware that we are not looking for a specific state. What is, is what is. No matter what 'What is' looks like. At the moment it sounds as if the experience is labelled 'joyful and easy' other states might be labelled ' hard and difficult'. And the labelling is not what IS!
Everything goes as it goes and that's what is truly wished for.
Everything goes as it goes. Exactly.

Look if you can find an 'inside' and 'outside' right now.

Greetings Vivi

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:58 am

Hi, Vivi!
Of course, I'm not looking for a state. I see now that what drove me in this search has nothing to do with any personal concern. It is sort of "will of the universe", that drives everything here. If a "personal will" concurs with it, every movement of this person will be taken effortlessly, and therefore we can say that there's no such thing as "presonal will" or "person". Everything is one movement.
There's no "inside" or "outside", "top" or "bottom", "far" or "near", "hot" or "cold" etc.- these all exist because The One pretends to be "something else" somehow by changing point of perspective. Actually, I have no idea what is happening here.
The habit to label though is quite strong and insistent but now I'm able just to observe it as one of the processes happening. I must thank you once again for giving me right point of perspective. It's my job now to widen and deepen it.
Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:22 pm

Hi Pashuk

Nice read.

Who is there to have a job of widening and deepening?

Are there any doubts left'?
Any questions?
Have you seen that 'I' is not there?

Greetings Vivi

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:50 pm

Hi!
I felt a certain reaction when you called me Pashuk instead of Pavel. I used to be extremely offended when someone shows no respect for me. Now its only a slight movement of air. Ha.
Surely there's no "me" or someone that will do that job, but I somehow feel that it will be doing. Like something very big is going to manifest through this body and it has to be ready.
There're neither douts nor questions left. There's no anything to understand. What left is just to live the life directly and honestly.
As for the last question, yes, I have seen that there's no "I" and there never was one. "I" is the very cause of all the confusion and all the suffering followed. They say, if you want to conseal something, put it rihgt before one's eyes.
Thank you, Pavel

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Re: Need a guidance

Postby dreamer » Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:17 pm

Sorry PAVEL :)

Here are some questions:

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
 
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now. 
 
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
 
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look? 
 
5) Do you decide, intend, choose, control events in Life? Do you make anything happen? Give examples from your experience.
 
6) Anything to add?

Enjoy!
Greetings Vivi

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Pashuk
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Re: Need a guidance

Postby Pashuk » Mon Apr 08, 2013 6:52 pm

Hi, Vivi!
I feel words are so useless. They are good only in expressing egoistic emotions. I feel to keep silent all the time rather than to talk craps.
Anyway, here are the answers:
1) No, there's no and there never was and there never ever could be a separate entity called "I" or whatever.
2) When I was a child, it felt equally discomfort to hear: "You did it well" or "Shame on you". "What do they mean?", I felt, "Why do they regard me as the cause of what happens itself?" But I never dared to ask those questions aloud – I feared to be off the game that everyone is playing, I feared of loneliness. And this fear forced me to believe that I am actually the character (a body, a person on a planet, in a country, from a family etc.) and not just an empty bamboo as I really felt. It forced me to lie to myself to maintain this character and to attain the ability to survive in proposed conditions of the game (good description of this mechanism – "doublethink" – is given in Orwell's "1984"). So the main engine of sustaining the illusion is fear.
3) I feel now more independent of thoughts and reactions, even though they don't seem to surrender and sometimes suppress even harder, but some deeper space appeared in me that is completely untouched. This space is home of ultimate peace and silent joy that is real and always here. I feel more relaxed – nothing has to be worried about; and I even laugh – that was almost impossible before. Everything is losing its significance but meanwhile the true sense of simple things shows up. The sensations become sharper and brighter and stronger (pain as well); breath becomes deeper and lower. And of course, the very root of the ego is seen much more clearly.
4) When I started to look in the direction of programs for what they are, the perspective somehow shifted and here they are – all the programs are just bubbles popping out of and back into the joyful calling silent abyss. When a bubble is somehow put on (or believed: "I am this") it becomes a way of thinking (or a world, or a program). If "I am this" doesn't happen a bubble soon disappears. And all that is happening without anyone or anything doing it. It is a mystery.
5) No, I don't control, decide etc. Everything that happens happens by itself – recognitions, seeing, awareness, actions, reactions, observation, intention, attention, resistance, release. When body performs an action or a state of consciousness it is driven by a certain program that bubbled out of nothing and believed (put on)(see #4). The illusion that 'I' controls anything in life created all the suffering.
6) I have nothing to add. No I have no add
Pavel


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