Yari here is the tkblumin thread

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tkblumin
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Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:05 pm

Hi Yari

I don't have a guide yet. I would really like to get started on the process. Can you help me out?

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Sun Feb 24, 2013 5:17 pm

Hallo Tracey,

Sure, we start now. Let's be clear and go straight to the point: what is it you wanna get here? What are your expectations about this and where is it you are stucked?

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:24 pm

Hi Yari,

This is the damndest thing. I decided to answer your questions directly and skip the back story. As I focus on where I am right now, it gets harder and harder to think! I keep expanding. Then an "I" thought kicks in and I feel a contraction. At the moment, it feels very sweet because the expansion is greater than the contraction.

This has been the process of the past few days, expanding and contracting. The other night I had that taste of experiencing life as a unified flow. In that state I felt free. It was like all this time I have been wearing a suit of armour and trying to look from the visor of the helmet and see myself. When the helmet came off, I realized that I was actually the one looking through the eye holes and I have always been here. It was just a shift of perspective.

Then the mind went into overdrive and I felt like the helmet was back on. It seems like the helmet is thoughts and mental structures and the rest of the suit of armour is a resulting tension in the body.

I have been hanging out more and more in that inside place. I guess I expected that the illusion of self, once recognized, would pop like a balloon and be gone. My experience is that "I" thoughts keep showing up but seem to be losing their potency. Is it just a habit that will eventually fade out?

So Yari, to answer your questions:

What I want to get is permanent residency in that state of satori. Suit of armour off for good.

Where am I stuck: Right now, I don't feel stuck. It feels like a process is unfolding and it feels right. Impatience arises and a fear that I might screw it up somehow, but more and more I see those are just thoughts.

Something I am wondering about: When I buy into the I thought and struggle and try to do something to control life, the I thought gets stronger. When I remember about being the one inside the suit of armour and direct my attention there, the sensation of trust and expansion grows. Who is choosing? I can't find a chooser but it seems that something is choosing and it has a preference. Any hints on how to look at this?

Thanks so much for your help
Tracey

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:29 am

As I focus on where I am right now, it gets harder and harder to think!
Do this simple exercise: try to watch your thoughts.
Can you do that? Observe the thoughts running through your mind. If the observation goes well, you'll start noticing that the more you focus on the mind the more thoughts start dissapearing. When thoughts start fading, you then find the silence beyond the noise (then another thought kicks in, but you were, for a moment, aware of the space between thoughts).
I keep expanding. Then an "I" thought kicks in and I feel a contraction.
That's how the ego works, it takes attention and wants to run the show. It monopolizes your energy.

This video explains something about its strategies, check it out:

http://youtu.be/XRzhDu31IAc



Notice that when you are the "I" you lose the state of pure thoughtless observation and are completely identified with your story and identity.
At the moment, it feels very sweet because the expansion is greater than the contraction.
Great. You'll see how limitless the expansion can get.....

This has been the process of the past few days, expanding and contracting
Like every other duality, this will continue even after liberation. Duality is a prime force in the universe. But when you see it is all One, then you are able to observe both sides of it from a "third" absolute level. You observe both ego and observer and both collapse into your Experience.
Barriers are removed.
Then the mind went into overdrive and I felt like the helmet was back on. It seems like the helmet is thoughts and mental structures and the rest of the suit of armour is a resulting tension in the body.
Precisely. You are not too far from resolution then, because you already see this. Keep going, observe how the helmet/armour enters the picture, it's all there. If you see it once it becomes easier and easier to spot till you unmask it.
My experience is that "I" thoughts keep showing up but seem to be losing their potency.
It will pop up again and again, but this is what liberation is: freedom from it. You are no more a slave to the ego. You see it for what it is so it cannot touch you anymore. You can pretend, but when you see the space behind it no one can take that awareness away from you.
Is it just a habit that will eventually fade out?
Yes definately. Time and depth of it depends on the persona/personal path/mind resistance, but normally after a while you only become a witness and have no identification anymore.
Ego loses grip when it is trascended. In the beginning you will strive to keep at least a little "I" to interface with the world but slowly that state will be harder and harder to maintain and you switch to the absolute view.
For example, I dont even remember how the state of identification was before my realization, it is very hard for me to form that concept again even if i focus.

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Tue Feb 26, 2013 4:12 am

What I want to get is permanent residency in that state of satori. Suit of armour off for good.
If you want it, you get it.
But to be more accurate the fact is that you cannot GET it, only allow it.
You peel away layers of ego till the state surfaces. It is already there.
Impatience arises and a fear that I might screw it up somehow, but more and more I see those are just thoughts.


Ego mostly protects itself through fear. Keep this in mind. When you feel deep fear or anger, that means the ego feels thretened, good sign actually.
When I buy into the I thought and struggle and try to do something to control life, the I thought gets stronger. When I remember about being the one inside the suit of armour and direct my attention there, the sensation of trust and expansion grows. Who is choosing? I can't find a chooser but it seems that something is choosing and it has a preference. Any hints on how to look at this?
The ego feeds on itself. That means that it is always the ego who wants to get rid of the ego or arbitrarily states that the ego is in control. It splits in two, this is important. You cannot win against you, can you get that? You are playing against yourself and even then you are fighting a ghost. There is nothing there to be you.
There is no chooser, but there is the choosing.
If you think that "you" have to trascend ego, that's ego. The more importance you give to it, the more it is strengthened.
The truth is that it is not even there, it doesn't really exist, it is only an illusion of perception.

Notice where your attention goes. One facet or the other (ego vs pure observation) surface when looked. The outcome is defined by the experience. That is because you are the Observer. But aside from these different aspects of consciousness (identified or not) what is it that stands still? The observation. Above all there is the silent witness. The situation keeps going on indipendently of your concern on who is running the show.
But saying you are the Observer would still be a identification, so let's say there is only observation. Where and how you look determines the nature of your experience. Follow this?

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Tue Feb 26, 2013 4:41 am

Yari, it is so amazing. I was just about to post an update when I found your response.
Do this simple exercise: try to watch your thoughts.
Can you do that? Observe the thoughts running through your mind. If the observation goes well, you'll start noticing that the more you focus on the mind the more thoughts start dissapearing. When thoughts start fading, you then find the silence beyond the noise (then another thought kicks in, but you were, for a moment, aware of the space between thoughts).
This is exactly what I did this afternoon! I was so fed up today with being caught up in the ego mode and thinking I was never going to get anywhere other than being a ping pong ball in the mind that I sat in a chair with this one question:

Is it true that there is no separate self whatsoever in reality?

I just kept asking the question. Over and over. No farting off on tangents, no speculation, no expectations. Just returning to that question and watching the thoughts. And I did see that the gaps got l-o--n---g----e-----r .

After several hours of looking there was no sight of that elusive self anywhere. I am so certain of my answer that I'm not even concerned that someone is going to pull a separate self out of the closet and say "ta-da" here it is, we hid it on you!"

The answer to the question "Is it true there is no self whatsoever in reality?" is: Yes. It is true.

OK,, just found another post from you. I'll post this so I don't lose it and keep reading.
Thank you Yari!

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:37 am

Ego mostly protects itself through fear. Keep this in mind. When you feel deep fear or anger, that means the ego feels thretened, good sign actually.
Yes. Earlier when I wanted to declare "It is true that there is no separate self whatsoever anywhere in reality" I was certain of the answer but reluctant to claim it. Further investigation revealed fear. Fear associated to a thought of dissolution. I just sat with the fear and the idea that something that doesn't exist can't die so is there anything real here that can be hurt? Nothing showed up.
The ego feeds on itself. That means that it is always the ego who wants to get rid of the ego or arbitrarily states that the ego is in control. It splits in two, this is important. You cannot win against you, can you get that? You are playing against yourself and even then you are fighting a ghost. There is nothing there to be you.
Wow, I must be good. Today I had 3 entities in there — the mind bickering with the ego and the poor little me who had to listen to them carrying on! Just joking. This clarifies something I observed today. I saw the shenanigans of the "I" thought interacting with a "me " thought and yet there was still a very strong "me" who felt like all of this was happening TO me. No wonder I got fed up with it. Good pointer.
tkblumin wrote:
What I want to get is permanent residency in that state of satori. Suit of armour off for good.
If you want it, you get it.
But to be more accurate the fact is that you cannot GET it, only allow it.
You peel away layers of ego till the state surfaces. It is already there.
Again, thanks for the confirmation. When I asked, what was missing that I did not have the experience of satori now, all I could come up with was that nothing is missing, it is only the identification with the thoughts / ego that is preventing me from being in that state.

So is the process of peeling away the layers of the ego simply recognizing illusions for what they are?
saying you are the Observer would still be a identification, so let's say there is only observation. Where and how you look determines the nature of your experience. Follow this?
Yes. I get it. I will watch more tomorrow how the shifts of attention play out.

I really appreciate the time and attention you put into this. I am profoundly grateful for your input.

Tracey

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:56 pm

Keep going, observe how the helmet/armour enters the picture, it's all there. If you see it once it becomes easier and easier to spot till you unmask it
If you think that "you" have to trascend ego, that's ego. The more importance you give to it, the more it is strengthened.
The truth is that it is not even there, it doesn't really exist, it is only an illusion of perception.
This is where the helmet feeling comes from. The ego looking for the ego. Trying to do something to get rid of it. The effort of looking and trying actually caused a physical tension in the head.

There was an identification in there as the looker. It was so closely linked to the observing that is always happening that I didn't catch it.

Back to observing.

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:27 pm

Wow, I must be good. Today I had 3 entities in there — the mind bickering with the ego and the poor little me who had to listen to them carrying on! Just joking. This clarifies something I observed today. I saw the shenanigans of the "I" thought interacting with a "me " thought and yet there was still a very strong "me" who felt like all of this was happening TO me. No wonder I got fed up with it. Good pointer.
And who observes the "me" then? Can you sense a space beyond everything? Try to reach it. Before thought and before identification. In this space everything happens, the thoughts arise in it (from an empty mind), so when the me is in action it is simply "running on automatic" and observable from behind the scenes.
That is where you need to be to make the leap.
I did not have the experience of satori
What is satori to you?

I tell you how i had my first one: look at your experience NOW.

There is you and the rest of the room.

There is you and this moment.

There is you IN this moment.

There is THIS moment now.

There is an internal experience and an external experience. Internal= personal; External = THIS

There is a split; Inside and Outside. It is 2.

NOW you are in the present moment...

NO, you are not.
Look, there is ONLY the present moment and you are one with it.

There is only this moment.


Satori is where duality collapses: there is no 2 anymore, just one Experience. Complete. The observer and the observation collapse in ONE experience.
How good have you been in this? :-D

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:49 pm

So is the process of peeling away the layers of the ego simply recognizing illusions for what they are?
That's one way of saying it, yes. The more you root yourself in the state of observation the more ego is seen and then, finally, trascended.
It takes some time to build the gap from thoughts (and identification with them) to observation of the mind, but once you see how it works it becomes easy.
Just practice during your day, watch your thoughts when you remember to.
Even simple things, observe your mind while doing stuff like making a mental list of the stuff to purchase at the supermarket, or the swirling and continuous chattering of your mind before going to sleep.

It has to be unmasked, the ego has to be seen for what it is: the illusion that you are it. The illusion that you are any part of your thoughts, they are just thoughts talking about a "me"! How can you be an immaterial thought? You are not there.
I really appreciate the time and attention you put into this. I am profoundly grateful for your input.
I love you Tracey. It's a matter of reciprocity, you'll understand...

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:02 am

Yari wrote: Satori is where duality collapses: there is no 2 anymore, just one Experience. Complete. The observer and the observation collapse in ONE experience.
I followed your description of satori through step by step. This is what happened:

Standing in my living room, looking out the window at a big cedar tree waving in the wind. Shifted back into that space behind thoughts. Observing. No thoughts coming. Just aware. Feeling feet on carpet, tension in belly, seeing wall, window, tree, hearing fan of fridge. Sensory experience with NO LABELS.

I still saw, heard and felt everything and realized that without labels there is no separation: No inner, no outer, no body, no room, no me, no other. It is very clear that the I shows up only in thought. With no thought of I there is no I. Just awareness. Just is.
Yari wrote: And who observes the "me" then? Can you sense a space beyond everything? Try to reach it. Before thought and before identification. In this space everything happens, the thoughts arise in it (from an empty mind), so when the me is in action it is simply "running on automatic" and observable from behind the scenes.
Yes. I can get into this space and watch the thoughts playing out. It is getting easier. Will stay with it.

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:49 am

Hi Yari

I read the book you recommended. It was a fun read.I'm familiar with what was in it and I have been able to watch my thoughts and shift into the state of thoughtless awareness for a while. The big difference now is the seeing that there is no me there watching the thoughts! The experience is totally different without the I in there! There is no struggle.

The past couple of days have been pretty awesome. For the most part I am just hanging out and observing. The I thoughts still show up. Some of them are neutral, and some of them have teeth. The ones that have teeth are the ones that show where there is still some I identification lurking. It is getting easier to recognize them and not get sucked in (and bitten :-)).

Here is an example: Today I was trying to explain something and I was growing more and more frustrated by my inability to find the right words. As I became angry, the memory came that anger was a sign that the ego is feeling threatened. The next thought that came was to ask "who is angry anyway? Who needs to be understood?" Nobody, of course. The anger dissipated. That was pretty cool. With no one there to fight, the whole thing just fell apart.

Watching will continue .....

Hugs,
Tracey

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:19 pm

he ones that have teeth are the ones that show where there is still some I identification lurking. It is getting easier to recognize them and not get sucked in (and bitten :-)).
What is it that bites Tracey?
The anger dissipated. That was pretty cool. With no one there to fight, the whole thing just fell apart.
Now imagine your whole life as impersonal. Like you are just watching a movie on a screen. Where does all the anger go? Where is it that worries arise? It just doesn't touch you anymore.
Watching will continue .....
Ok, if you feel stucked somewhere, analize that realistically and post about it. It can only progress...once you have a glimpse of it you go back for more...and more...and you'll see how deep it can go.

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby tkblumin » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:36 pm

Yari wrote: What is it that bites Tracey?
Nothing bites Tracey. No thing biting, no thing getting bitten. It is all labels used to try to describe energy moving as thoughts and feelings experienced within the body.
Yari wrote:Now imagine your whole life as impersonal. Like you are just watching a movie on a screen. Where does all the anger go? Where is it that worries arise? It just doesn't touch you anymore.
Yes. The recognition that there is no I is reverberating through the system. The story is playing out and it is not happening to me anymore. It feels detached.

The process is unfolding.

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Re: Yari here is the tkblumin thread

Postby Yari » Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:43 pm

It is all labels used to try to describe energy moving as thoughts and feelings experienced within the body.
Excellent


It's life lifing! :-)


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