The Gate

-What brings you to Liberation Unleashed?

I've pondered alot with jed mckenna and adyashanti writings.. one day i read an article where adya talks about direct experience, and got curious in what he might mean.. so i stumbled upon this forum..

-What is your background in terms of seeking and inquiry?

Pretty deep and broad.. done alot of inquiries and contemplated alot with philosophy or metaphysical. Which i think eventually it was an intellectual distraction and to keep my eyes closed in this maya..

-What do you expect of the conversation on this forum?

I expect to sort out my confusion regarding emotions in this journey of d.e.

I've read few of the guides and inquiries that helped me see what felt like a DE? Which I'm unsure because it felt like it was a temporary thing.. my fears and emotions and like mentioned in the FAQ of this web, beliefs and conditioning came back.. Which, i guess pulled me back into Maya?? Or maybe it wasn't a DE since i was pulled back into maya? Not sure where i stand in that aspect of gatelessness..

So.. what to do with all these emotions? I totally lose DE when emotions come flooding.

Please guide me on this matter.. Would so greatly appreciate to have someone help me out with strong emotions with this journey..

Hi Jkim,

Welcome to Liberation Unleashed. My name is Jon and I'm happy to guide you if you wish? At least, I'm happy to assist you in your inquiry.

Thank you for your brief introduction which is interesting.

So.. what to do with all these emotions? I totally lose DE when emotions come flooding.

Perhaps it's not so much what to 'do' with them as much as nticing what is really going on?

I expect to sort out my confusion regarding emotions in this journey of d.e.

That sounds realistic, provided you are willing to be completeley honest?

Warm regards,

Jon

Hi Jkim,

I'm wondering if you picked up my first message to you? I'm very happy to offer to guide you, if you wish? Just let me know.

Regards,

Jon

Hi jon!

I didn't get notifications, and was unaware of your reply..

Thank you for your interest..

Lately i was able to look further into this..

I guess i've been getting other's guiding s intellectually. I thought I had understood it experientially. Until after the (first) initial post..

I decided to read some more examples in the pdf book.. yeah. When emotions stir, i sort of lose focus.. but its about noticing the thought that i remember a me thinking, and believing a thought, that which stirs certain emotions when believed.

Its hard to pinpoint because there is no me in this right now..

I finally get it.. but that focus slips easily.

Like for example right now as i type this in, i am immersed in this character.

But to think about it, its only a remembering of a past me.

I can't remember a me that thinks. That does this thinking.
I can only remember a past me, but cant nail who is the i that remebers.

So, i guess i just have to keep noticing this... thought.. how long to get this focus stronger? I guess it depends on my willingness and diligence........

Is it best to make this awareness stronger while alone?

Because when j try to do it in social settings, i seem to appear like im spacing out..

Will a time come soon that ill have this awareness simultaneously while interacting with someone?

I am seeing more and more jon..

The witnessing of seeing a thought through this false identity is becoming more... easier to notice?

Its still hard noticing this seeing through a story while doing something (like typing at this moment).. but i am seeing more and more!

Hello Jkim,

Please accept my apologies for not replying to you sooner. Somehow I failed to notice that you had replied.( I thought you had vanished!) So I have only just read your three posts, which are very interestng.

I can't remember a me that thinks. That does this thinking.
I can only remember a past me, but cant nail who is the i that remebers.

It is great that you notice this.

Try this exercise... Right here and now the words on this screen are being read. But what are they being read by?

Conventionally it is said that it is 'me' that reads the words. It is often said that it is the body, or eyes that are doing the seeing. But look at this experience. Is there an experience of 'eyes seeing' or is there just the seeing happening, the seeing alone?

Regarding guiding, you and I will simply have a conversation, the aim of which will be for you to make the realisation that there is no 'self'. That will be our focus. I will tend to ask various questions and set you some exercises, but nobody will be judging you. You can't get this wrong.

This process is a guided inquiry where specific areas can be examined. I am not a teacher. This is YOUR inquiry. I will not be giving you new ideas and beliefs; only assisting you in examining and questioning the ones that you already have

I am still willing to guide you, if you wish? I need to ask you to read and agree to the following ground rules and disclaimer, please?

If you haven't already seen it, there is introductory info here, the disclaimer and a short video too.
http://www.liberationunleashed.com/

Please read and agree to the following:
1. Post at least once a day, if you cannot post, or need more time, let me know.
2. Be 100% honest in your answers and inquiry.
3. Answer only from direct experience (felt senses and observed thoughts). Longwinded
analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress.
4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies and such for the remainder of this investigation.
Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily and
essential meditation practice, it is fine to continue that.
5. Understand that I will be guiding you, rather than teaching you, and the more you put into this process the more you will get out of it.

(By the way, is it OK for me to call you Jkim or would you like me to use a different name?

Warm regards,

Jon.

Oh hi jon,
Yeah i thought i was dismissed or something tbh lol.. well thanks for even the late reply..

Yes ive read and agree on terms and rules..

"Try this exercise... Right here and now the words on this screen are being read. But what are they being read by?"

-just to give a short update while i had some time doing inquiry waiting for a reply, i think i came to see this thing even more clearly.. like. I do see it.

So to get back to your question, the words are being read by this human being called julia (you can call me julia btw), and this unlocatable whatever is seeing or notices this human julia reading.. or having thoughts..

There still seems to be this human seeing what is happening.. yet, im not this human julia. It isn't personal..

Hi Julia,

Thanks for your reply.

So to get back to your question, the words are being read by this human being called julia (you can call me julia btw), and this unlocatable whatever is seeing or notices this human julia reading.. or having thoughts..

There still seems to be this human seeing what is happening.. yet, im not this human julia. It isn't personal..

Again, good looking!
Good to notice the unlocatable whatever that is seeing...

So, look at this seeing experience again. Focus on the immediate experience here and now. Is it possibke to find 'a human being' 'reading'? Notice the actual experience.

Is it fair to say that any thoughts about experience are something added on, something extra to the seeing?

Check the direct experience of seeing words on screen. Does an entity (labelled Julia) 'do reading'? What is the actual experience?

Love,

Jon

"Is there a human being reading?"
No as in everything is a thought. And outside the context of thoughts or ideas, nothing is real.. but yes as in no matter how much i realize that there is no self and i want to transcend this physicality, i cant disregard the fact that there will be this physicality and my bodily existence embodied by this whatever unlocatable awareness...

Currently there is, this human being. It all feels real as i am able to feel sensations relating to emotions.. however on the awareness level, nothing is real.. or absolute. But words cant comprehend..

- are thoughts something extra to the seeing?
Hmmm

Ill get back to that..

Thanks,
Julia

Thoughts and whatever is being seen is all in the same context.. it has no reality into it..

-Does entity julia do the reading?
It seems to be whatever is in for this julia's world or life.., it happens.. and this unlocatable me is a bystander who notices and feels everything julia human notices or feels.

Hi Julia,

Thoughts and whatever is being seen is all in the same context.. it has no reality into it..

Let's run with this a little bit. But we will switch to hearing now instead of seeing.

Sit quietly where you will not be disturbed for a while. Begin to notice sounds. This may include the sound of breathing, a distant aeroplane, the sound of a fridge humming in another room. Whatever sounds are expereinced just notice them right here and now. This can be quite relaxed, a little focus maybe but no great effort of concentration.

Is there a 'me' that is 'hearing sounds', or is there just the raw experience of hearing?

Look for the hearer. See if it is possible to find a hearer of sounds?

Is thought about the hearing the same thing as the hearing or would you say that it is a different sort of function?

Does the hearing comment on the hearing or would you say that it is thought that passes comment about the hearing?

Love,

Jon

Jon,
I wasn't able to have a sole time today and tomorrow.. weekend you know.. hehe

I will try to find a time tomorrow and post again..

Julia

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Hi Julia,

I look forward to hearing from you. Yes, you need a little time to focus on this exercise.

Best wishes,

Jon

Jon,
In d.e. there is only sound..
In d.e. there is no hearer.

A thought labels a sound heard.. then creates the image of a spinning fan.. like.. instantaneously..

I guess it is the thought that passes comment about the hearing? ?

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