TB

[ThomasBurdic]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
That the sense that there is a controller, subjective centre of consciousness in the brain/body which is directing the body, is illusory. That actuslly the body simply functions by itself pretty much. And that, that illusion is in some way the source of suffering

What are you looking for at LU?
To be guided to see the nature of existence more clearly. I hope to commune and interact with people who are on the same path in life, who have deeper insight than i do, who can be helpful in guiding me to these realisations myself.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Clear, direct guidance from someone who is patient also. Who will give clear pointing, which comes from their own authentic insight and realisation. I expect there will be a back and forth of me expressing my authentic experience, what’s arising for me, and them speaking directly from their authentic experience.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
I’ve done meditation on and off for some years now. Also been very much into online non-duality teachers such as eckhart tolle, Rupert spira, Angelo dillulo etc.. and tried out inquiry before but not very deeply or consistently

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self? 10

[Daniel777]

Hi Thomas,

It’s been a while. If you’re still interested, I’d be happy to guide you. Before we start, however, we should clarify a few things to avoid misunderstandings during the process.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Clear, direct guidance from someone who is patient. Someone who offers clear pointers stemming from their own authentic insight and realization. I expect a dialogue where I express my authentic experience—whatever comes to mind—and the other person speaks directly from their own authentic experience.

We need to draw a very important line here: this process is 100% about *your* experience, not mine. I won’t tell you stories based on my own realizations to show you the way. My only task is to keep the spotlight unwaveringly focused on your current perception. In this process, I am not a dialogue partner sharing a journey; I am simply a finger pointing at your reality.

Are you ready for a conversation that revolves—quite radically, and perhaps in a way that feels unusually one-sided at first—entirely around what is present for you right now?

What do you expect from LU?
Guidance to see the nature of existence more clearly.

That is a beautiful, grand goal—but for our work here, we need to scale it back significantly. Liberation Unleashed isn’t about the nature of existence. We aren’t here to search for cosmic truths, states of enlightenment, or the meaning of the universe.

Why? Because the question regarding the "nature of existence" presupposes the existence of a "self" (Thomas)—an "I" that exists separately from existence and wishes to fathom it.
LU is far more mundane, sober, and down-to-earth. We are asking just one very simple question here: Does this "I"—the one you take yourself to be—actually exist in reality?
We are not looking for the big picture; instead, we are examining the supposed "seeker."

Are you ready to completely set aside the big philosophical questions about existence for the moment and focus on this one precise inquiry: Does Thomas exist?

I look forward to hearing from you
Daniel

[ThomasBurdic]

Hello Daniel. Thanks for the reply. I would like to be guided by a guide called Elad if thats possible.

[Daniel777]

Sure thing. I've forwarded it to him.

Kind Regards
Daniel

[ThomasBurdic]

Great thank you 🙏

[Elad]

Great thank you 🙏

Hi Tom, Elad here :)

Let's start fresh. Please write me whatever might be relevant for me to know, as we start out? Wishes, fears, needs, what is clear, what is not clear, etc.

[ThomasBurdic]

I wish to shift into perceiving existence as more impersonal so as not to suffer as much. And the recognition of noself seems like it does that so I’ve heard. And it seems like, if this is true, then surely it should be possible for this to be seen. It should be obvious surely. But it doesn’t seem to be.
What is not clear for me as of right now is what is actually necessary for noself to be recognised. I feel like I conceptually can understand it, but it’s never “clicked”. I’ve tried self-inquiry before but just doesn’t do anything. I feel like when I try see that there is no self, nothing happens, and the persistent sense of “me” just continues as it always has everyday.

I have subtle fears that only “special” people get to recognise noself, or that it’s just something that happens randomly to some people, or not, and isn’t under any control by using these methods of inquiry and exploration. Or that I’m Not smart enough to recognise it or something.

But on the other hand I’m hopeful in that, if noself is the truth, it should be simple and easy for it to be recognised.

[ThomasBurdic]

Great thank you 🙏

Hi Tom, Elad here :)

Let's start fresh. Please write me whatever might be relevant for me to know, as we start out? Wishes, fears, needs, what is clear, what is not clear, etc.

I wish to shift into perceiving existence as more impersonal so as not to suffer as much. And the recognition of noself seems like it does that so I’ve heard. And it seems like, if this is true, then surely it should be possible for this to be seen. It should be obvious surely. But it doesn’t seem to be.
What is not clear for me as of right now is what is actually necessary for noself to be recognised. I feel like I conceptually can understand it, but it’s never “clicked”. I’ve tried self-inquiry before but just doesn’t do anything. I feel like when I try see that there is no self, nothing happens, and the persistent sense of “me” just continues as it always has everyday.

I have subtle fears that only “special” people get to recognise noself, or that it’s just something that happens randomly to some people, or not, and isn’t under any control by using these methods of inquiry and exploration. Or that I’m Not smart enough to recognise it or something.

But on the other hand I’m hopeful in that, if noself is the truth, it should be simple and easy for it to be recognised.

[Elad]

Hi Tom,

These are very common thoughts and concerns to have. And the wish to be able to see the more impersonal nature of what happens, so as to be less caught up in negative stories, suffer less, makes sense. We will work here with exercises and questions, and gradually or suddenly a shift will take place. This is an organic process that neither of us can or should predict or be intellectually on top of. Here as exercise for you:

“I” labelling

Get a sheet of paper and draw a line that divides that sheet in half. Label one half 'self' and
the other side 'other'. Sit down and start a timer for 5 minutes. Every time you have a
thought make a mark on the sheet. If that thought is about the self put a mark on the self
side, if it’s about something else, mark the other side. If a thought about food occurs due to
feeling hungry, mark that on the self side. Any thought that refers back to a self should go
on the self side. (I'm bored, I'm tired, is the door locked (my safety) that video was funny (I
was amused), my back hurts, I am frightened) get it?
Let me know how you go and what you notice.

[ThomasBurdic]

Hi Elad,

Yes so I found that;

My thoughts are 99% of the time about managing my feelings somehow.

I have compulsive habit of daydreaming imagining myself having conversations, or living in a fantasy reality, because it gives me an emotional high, many thoughts such as this which stimulate pleasant sensations in the body.

Some thoughts popped up like thinking about negative past experiences, and urges to ruminate/obsess over this.

Or just random stuff like music, which I think is still a subtle attempt to avoid feeling boredom/dissatisfaction.

Also lots of thoughts about food, changing my sitting position etc. to feel more comfortable

A lot of of my thinking is in avoidance of certain feelings in my body for sure

[Elad]

Hi Tom,

This is great clear and sincere noticing!

Do you have a practice with just sitting with nonverbal raw feeling/experience?

For today can you do that at least one period of 20 min?

Beside the "just being with experience" whenever attention goes to other stuff (the kind of stuff you described so well in your post), LOOK: Is there a self that is choosing to do that, to shift attention to the pleasant fantasies/obsessing/etc? Or it just happens when it happens?

NB! What will help is not to think about these questions (although that will probably happen a fair bit due to conditioning/habit force), but just to LOOK when it happens, and be as honest as possible about what is seen.

[ThomasBurdic]

Hi elad,

Yes I would say that;

There does seem to be an ‘automatic’ element to how these thoughts and impulses arise that isn’t chosen.
But then there seems to be this ability to consciously choose whether I “indulge” in a particular thought or impulse, or not.
So it feels like there is a control/self element to that.

[Elad]

So far so good. Look more.

Practice more periods of "just sitting" and keep looking like a hawk: What makes anything happen?

Small movements, thoughts, sensations, attention shifts et - what makes everything happen? And this includes the thoughts that seem more "in control" or "mine" like "I will stop indulging that" or "I will indulge that a little more". Really. Look closer. Look super close. How does all that happen???

Can a self be found anywhere that controls any of it, or is it just an old belief, that is so habitual, that it is habitually taken for evidence (it is so because I believe it is so). Is everything actually in reality happening by itself?

[ThomasBurdic]

Yes often as I do this, it does bring more attention to the ‘automatic nature’ of bodily movements quite clearly- like when my body is doing something physical like brushing teeth etc.. it can really seem like “it’s just happening” when I pay attention to that fact.
But then I’m not sure whether that’s just another thought or not! It’s hard to tell.
It feels quite foggy

with those more subtle appearances like thoughts/impulses that can feel very “me” especially when attention is very focused,
I’ve noticed that the sense of ‘me’ is quite intertwined with these body sensations especially in my chest..

I will continue to do this practice and become more focused and ‘hawk’ like.

[ThomasBurdic]

Also,

It’s like, ‘how things happen’ in direct immediacy is quite mysterious really. The thoughts/sense of “I’m doing this” and also “there is no controller doing this” both kind of arise as thoughts slightly after the fact maybe ?

I can’t really “get a hold of” the immediacy in that way I think

But then I don’t know. There’s a lot of doubt/confusion around it, like am I just making it up haha