Bobu's journey

[Bobu]

Hi Kay.....

Sitting in your loungeroom now and there is a closed door…how is it known that there is something behind the door?

It's know....thats it.....how ....thats a mystery....a thought says it.....

Can you describe this 'awareness' that is looking? Is there a ‘seeing’ AND a ‘seen’? Is there a movie screen AND the movie?

A map shows how a country is seemingly divided into states and territories. Is the map made of those divisions? Or are those divisions simply the map being the map? The division are the map, but the map is not a division. Can you see this?

No I can't describe awareness...it just is ongoing...and there's no space between seen and seer...the screen and the movie are one.......
Yes the map is the map whatever it shows.....

The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

The broarders are the story thoughts tell about the picture...there are no seperate things on or in the tv....thoughts seperates the
Things......
No there's no choice about awareness being on or off....
I filled this out about 4 times and lost it each time.....
Thought says there somthing outside the door.........

Thanks Kay.......xoxo

[forgetmenot]

Hey Bobu,

The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

It's one thing...screen and movie....

Is it screen AND movie….or just screenmovie?

You’ve done some great LOOKING throughout this exploration...thank-you for being so diligent in looking and answering questions to date. I just want to be thorough and make sure that nothing important has been missed. Here are some questions to help determine if there are any areas that may still need further exploring. Just simple and quick answers will do, you don't need to take time over them. Please answer what's true for you right now, rather than any sort of 'ideal' answer.

Has it been clearly seen that there is no separate individual (“I/me”), and never has been?
Has it been clearly seen that there has never been a separate individual that could control or own life or anything?
Is there any chooser or decider of any kind?
Is there a separate individual/entity of any kind whatsoever that could be responsible for anything at all?
Is there a thinker of thought?
Has there ever been a separate self doing anything?
Is there a self in the body somewhere? Does it have a certain location, or feelings associated with it, or any other attributes?
Is there a self that is inside the body, perceiving a world that is outside?
Do you notice a difference now, to when you first started this exploration, and if so what are those differences?
Is there any confusion at all or anything you would like to address?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

It K

Has it been clearly seen that there is no separate individual (“I/me”), and never has been?
Has it been clearly seen that there has never been a separate individual that could control or own life or anything?
Is there any chooser or decider of any kind?
Is there a separate individual/entity of any kind whatsoever that could be responsible for anything at all?
Is there a thinker of thought?
Has there ever been a separate self doing anything?
Is there a self in the body somewhere? Does it have a certain location, or feelings associated with it, or any other attributes?
Is there a self that is inside the body, perceiving a world that is outside?
Do you notice a difference now, to when you first started this exploration, and if so what are those differences?
Is there any confusion at all or anything you would like to address?

When I do the exercises all this is true...afterwards the I and me is there...where ? In thoughts...during the looking I can't find a seperate me...but looking ends and the expirience returns to the original state.........suffering has increased.....
Thanks Kay....huggs from here to there!

[forgetmenot]

Hey Bobu,

When I do the exercises all this is true...afterwards the I and me is there...where ? In thoughts...during the looking I can't find a seperate me...but looking ends and the expirience returns to the original state.........suffering has increased.....

And you are clearly aware of the idea (thoughts) of ‘suffering’, but can you find anything/anyone that is actually suffering? Don’t look for the suffering to end but look for that which can suffer. Experience/awareness ie thoughtsensationcolour is appearing as the idea of suffering, not the other way round.

There is an expectation that LOOKING shouldn’t have to continue now that seeing through the illusory self has been realised. LOOKING must continue until it becomes second nature to where LOOKING happens on its own. When learning a new skill, did you not have to do it over and over for it to become second nature? This is no different.

Sometimes you may be totally ingrained in being a person. But how do you know anything about how it feels to be a person? What would it feel like not to be a person? Since there has never been a person then how could anything possibly be different to what IS appearing and already is? Seeing through the Illusion of “I” doesn't mean you will lose the “I” and with it the whole identity of “I”. The “I” doesn't exist, not even now as you are reading these lines.

And there is no attachment to ‘your’ stories or to the story about an “I” labelled Bobu.
Your = thought story
Attachment = thought story, riding piggyback on the 'your' thought story.
Thought referring to thought.
Simply notice the story about the story.
See if you're actually in it.
And see if it's actually yours

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Hi Kay....yes looking is continuing and I was noticing how what ever it is being felt I look to see who is feeling this...im on the job for sure...its funny cause after I wrote to you I asked who is this who s suffering.....lol.....no doubt it is thoughts indicating this suffering...its sensation and thought......thats about it......thanks down under,,,,,, Have a Good doy or night...love bobu...

[forgetmenot]

Hey Bobu,

Here are signposts that point to Rome, London, Berlin etc. All of these signposts are labels that seemingly point to something. Do the signposts have any idea what they are pointing to?



Love, Kay
xx

[forgetmenot]

Hi Bobu,

Here are the final questions. Can you answer them with some detail please, and with Q5, provide examples.


1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Here are signposts that point to Rome, London, Berlin etc. All of these signposts are labels that seemingly point to something. Do the signposts have any idea what they are pointing to?

Nope how could they......?

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

It can't be found ....looking doesn't find one....or it or what ever ......

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

Now it appears to be a thought with more thoughts and sensations that appear to be taking things that are happening to be personal......happening to me..........and when it kicks in, it brings a chain of thoughts that make the illusion seem real...its a belief that I'm thinking....an I is thinking.....and doing and all the rest of what's ongoing....

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

It's startling to say the least.......i see that I'm looking at thoughts more freely and allowing them to be....seeing sensations the same way....not continuously but more than ever before in a clearer way...its growing.....the looking is taking more attention as it progresses....its not hard...but forgetting to look happens....and the seperate self seemingly takes over.....the job is ongoing....rewarding to say the least......

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

Today it was discomfort and strong sensations and thoughts that I was suffering...after a while there was an urge to look at this discomfort and identify what it was that was claiming the situation as mine.....then things slowly desolved...the guitar was handy so playing began and thoughts changed and sensation was pleasent and enjoyable.....hearing and enjoying ...hands moving sounds happening......pure fun......watching...all of it was one happening...not seperate playing hearing enjoying moving...lolol...flow of life...no interference from an I claiming it...looking saw this quite clearly....now looking at laughing...

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

Well decision is a thought about a thought about a thought...in the end it's still a thought.....intention is seemingly a thought be for an action.....free will is not free at all ...it seems to be resistance to what's happening.....mosty confusion....looking back its not seen at all. But resistance to what is ,happened a lot.....

More to come....

[Bobu]

Hi Kay...

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

Control is also an illusion.....its believed that the seperate self is in control.....
Life makes things happen...knowing how it works is not to be found it just does....there are thought and senses hearing tasting smelling seeing and it all operates as one thing without seperation from what being seen tasted heard.. awearness is ongoing
I'm not responsible for any thing ,,,,there is no i to be responsible.............this whole thing just seems to have happened...i was ready and you appeared...the guide......today was full the answer to this question.....as the day progressed I looked...and things flowed once I began the task at hand...i gave some examples before....ill practice this like learning to play guitar..the more its done the easier its get......doing this everyday was awsome.......ending is sad.....so be it...love you Kay....no doubt...bobu

[Bobu]

Hi Kay..i see plans are possible...and they are thoughts about the futute...a thought tonight about tomorrow can be followed by an action tomorrow... conditioning exists....not sure but it's habits formed by pain or rewards...looking shows that....thats all for tonight....later Kay.......xoxo

[forgetmenot]

Hello Bobu,

Hi Kay..i see plans are possible...and they are thoughts about the futute...a thought tonight about tomorrow can be followed by an action tomorrow... conditioning exists....not sure but it's habits formed by pain or rewards...looking shows that....thats all for tonight....later Kay.......xoxo

How is it known that tomorrow is tomorrow, what is the AE of tomorrow? How is it known that when sleep seemingly happens that time has passed? What exactly is it that is going to sleep and waking up in the morning?

Upon waking up in the morning, can a decision maker be found making the body leave the bed?
Where does the ‘decision’, the ‘command’ to get up come from?
What makes the body get up, is there a ‘you’, or a decider that commands the body?
When lying there, shout 'GET UP' internally as loudly as you can. Does that affect the outcome?

How does the decision happen?
Does a decider come in and take over, weighing pros and cons, looking at possible consequences?
Or does getting up just happen, or not?

Now apply that to taking action whether thought said it was pre-planned the night before or not and tell me what you find.

Love, Kay
xx

[forgetmenot]

Hello Bobu....I am waiting for your responses to my last questions. What's happening?

Kay
Xx

[Bobu]

Hi kay......

How is it known that tomorrow is tomorrow, what is the AE of tomorrow? How is it known that when sleep seemingly happens that time has passed? What exactly is it that is going to sleep and waking up in the morning?

Upon waking up in the morning, can a decision maker be found making the body leave the bed?
Where does the ‘decision’, the ‘command’ to get up come from?
What makes the body get up, is there a ‘you’, or a decider that commands the body?
When lying there, shout 'GET UP' internally as loudly as you can. Does that affect the outcome?

How does the decision happen?
Does a decider come in and take over, weighing pros and cons, looking at possible consequences?
Or does getting up just happen, or not?

Now apply that to taking action whether thought said it was pre-planned the night before or not and tell me what you find.

Love, Kay

A thought....memory of the night and several wake ups and changes are presently seen.......... light from the sun starts to appear...a very noticeable process.....like writing this...its noticeable......a process.....
The sleeper is .....expirience suddenly changes....a shift in thinking from one situation to another...very noticeable like a wall of thought and picture falls and another pops up.....this has been looked at and is in memory...thoughts as it were...then it shuts off and no references are present ..but light changes.....the clock changes....sensations are suddenly present...shockingly so...

No command unless some other is saying get up......tiredness makes the impulse to get up not so strong and it passes a few times..then suddenly I'm up....

No dicision maker gets me up ...laying there thoughts apear..then suddenly I'm up....
If a chore or function needs doing that a thought and writing it down has been seen and done...it gets done....that looks like a planned action.......


Thanks Kay...xoxo......bobu.....

[forgetmenot]

Hi Bobu,

A thought....memory of the night and several wake ups and changes are presently seen.......... light from the sun starts to appear...a very noticeable process.....like writing this...its noticeable......a process.....
The sleeper is .....expirience suddenly changes....a shift in thinking from one situation to another...very noticeable like a wall of thought and picture falls and another pops up.....this has been looked at and is in memory...thoughts as it were...then it shuts off and no references are present ..but light changes.....the clock changes....sensations are suddenly present...shockingly so...

What this initial exploration is about is simply seeing through the concept of there being a separate self. To go into the above goes beyond that and is for another discussion in a different forum in LU, which can happen if you desire, once this thread has been finalised.


So, what I will do now is ask other guides to have a look at your thread and your answers to the final questions. This is just to make sure that I have covered everything thoroughly with you. This may take a couple of days. If they have no further questions for you then you will receive an invite to join LU’s Aftercare FB group.

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Ok Kay..that sounds great....i clearly see there is no seperate self..and have become conscious of this fact....deeply so...you did a great job of pointing to this fact and its alive in thoughts all day long....seeing how things are done without a doer ....thought without a thinker and thats true for senses. And all other awarness attributes.....the other stuff is minor compared to this realization.forever greatfull.....every effort was made in honesty and diligent looking....thanks a million down under...mate.....bobu.