My humble and sober request for a guide...

[Delma]

Wow. This is weird!

I can't get you to unhook from thinking about thinking and instead look at what it is that's experiencing it. "The same thing that's experiencing the rest of it." doesn't answer what the "thing" is.

Can you find the thing and describe it? What knows that there are thoughts, feelings, stickiness? Where is the thing that experiences all of that?

[Dimitri]

Weird indeed. Not sure what I'm missing.

Maybe it's because I can't find "the thing" that experiences. There's nothing there, just the experiences themselves. Experiences literally land nowhere. They just occur. Isn't that how it is for everyone?

[Delma]

Um....


Nothing is found where a self is supposed to be?

[Dimitri]

Nothing! There is this body. There are sensations in this body. There are thoughts. There are feelings. Thoughts and feelings seem to at times trigger sensations in this body. Sometimes thoughts get amplified by other thoughts and get bigger. Sometimes that triggers even bigger sensations in this body.

But who or what knows any of this, owns any if this? I have no freaking idea. There's nothing there. I can't find anything or anyone home. These things simply occur and there is view, awareness, recognition of them. Where that recognition or view occurs, I haven't a clue. Who or what is doing it? No idea. I can't even say where view lands, it just is. It's right here in fact! I can't find anything or anyone, anywhere that/who is knowing any of this.

Honestly this body and how it's linked to view, is beginning to feel like a worm hole, a view portal where these eyes, ears, this nose, skin, and tongue, are simply input peripherals for some remote cloud computing data center at some undisclosed, secure location. Nobody will ever know where the data goes, how it's processed, why it's being collected.

That's all I've got.

[Delma]

so if there's nothing there, then what's this stickiness about?

Stickiness sticking to itself? Stickiness sticking to what?

[Dimitri]

Sticky is as sticky does. It seems like something I've been doing as opposed to something that actually happens on it's own - identifying with thoughts, feelings, "denser" clusters of each, and even the idea of stickiness itself.

The stickiness seems like nothing now too. I can't actually find it. I can only find ideas about it, ways in which I've made an idea or a set of assumptions into something - this idea that stickiness is a thing. It simply feels like a bad habit.

[Delma]

Is there a you that controls this habit, the ideas about it? When it comes and goes?

Look for what "has" the habit.

(I know, I'm pounding away at the same thing, but seriously, it's important) We're getting into the finer layers.

[Dimitri]

No worries. I like the pounding. I will look.

[Dimitri]

The habit is just thoughts. They arises just like the rest of it, seemingly out of thin air, not run or owned by anyone.

The stickiness is just like the thought that a bunch or grains of sand that look similarly, somehow constitute a beach. It's just labeling, idea-ing which is of course just more thought.

Thoughts arise and fade. They are now owned. There is just a pattern of identifying with them, believing them, which somehow leads to the sense of the self controlling it all, manifesting it all.

[Delma]

Yes.

The stickiness is like grains of sand. Nice analogy.

So, what happened when you looked for what they stick to?

[Dimitri]

These "grains" of thought seem to just stick to other grains, which creates a more convincing looking beach. The more similar looking grains, the more they stick to one another. The more sticking occurs, the more it all feels real. I can't find any actual landing place for the grains or anything that they stick to besides themselves. It's all like some grand self fulfilling prophecy.

[Delma]

self sticking grains, sticking to themselves.

Yes.

We've looked at thought, and looked at the body a bit, but let's review to see where we are.

are you able to find any sort of boundary between a You, and the world?
Is there an Inside and an Outside?

Do you have any questions?

Delma

[Delma]

One more point. You mentioned that the more the grains stick together, they more they feel real.

What does "real" mean in this case? Are you saying that they feel like a self? If so, please look at some common language.

"I feel depressed."
"I feel excited."
"I feel anxious."

Can you see that there is the collection of sand which is labeled with "depressed, excited, anxious"? Is the label the same as a self?

Take a look at a university. Is a university a real 'thing' or is it a collection... buildings, students, ideas.... which is then commonly called or labeled "university"? Does a university exist in and of itself? Or is it a convention of language?

Delma

[Dimitri]

It seems as if "real" just points to "sticky" - that is, more thoughts about thoughts, a more convincing beach. Still not seeing an actual self here, just a more convincing illusion when the thoughts stick to one another.

An inside and outside? Me and the world? Not sure. It still seems as if there is space but then there's space between my toes too.

Feeling confused again.

[Delma]

Confused is ok. Again it means that you are challenging the status quo, and that's what we want.

All good.

By inside or outside, I mean the exercise with tge senses that we did earlier. Close your eyes and listen. Is sound inside, outside, or neither?

What about touch?

With eyes closed, how big is the body?

You're doing well. I need to keep coming at the same things from different angles, so I appreciate your sticking with this process.

Delma

Delma

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