I'm ready to investigate

[Antony]

Hmm... what happens next? Mind blabbering on to itself may continue for a while, may stop. Oh wait a minute. It only ever stops now. Apparition of time.

[Antony]

Night Vince. Sleep well.

[vinceschubert]

Mind blabbering on to itself may continue for a while, may stop.

i liken it (mind blabbering) to Tinetus (constant ringing in the ears)
Awareness of it first occurred during a 10 day Vipassana sit. Then every time i/it was quiet it was there. Then i realised that there were great stretches of time (language again, sorry) when there was no awareness of it at all. With no awareness it didn't exist. Thoughts are the same.

[Antony]

Not sure sure what you're referring to now.
Can you try another language?
I'm getting the sense you're talking about stories appearing somewhat convincing when they arise and then there's no knowledge of when they ever disappeared until a thought arises that states, 'oh, when did that happen'. As if it never existed.

[vinceschubert]

i was saying nothing about how convincing they were, but that they might always be there in the background but that when attention is elsewhere, they don't exist.

[Damon Kamda]

Hi Antony,

It's been a pleasure followin your conversation with Vince.

I know Vince has asked you a similar question a couple of days ago already, but I'm very curious as to how you would introduce and explain all of this to a random person in simple, yet detailed language?

Thanks!

[Antony]

Hi Nomad,

This is a difficult question to answer. As i have no idea what the response might be to someone i'm speaking to, the explanation would only be of relative import. I'd have to make assumptions of what the person might think i mean by what i say. I feel that other than making the declaration of 'the realisation that the sense of a 'me' is not real' there is little more i can explain outside of a real dialogue. Perhaps we can role play? :)

Antony

[Damon Kamda]

This is a difficult question to answer. As i have no idea what the response might be to someone i'm speaking to, the explanation would only be of relative import. I'd have to make assumptions of what the person might think i mean by what i say. I feel that other than making the declaration of 'the realisation that the sense of a 'me' is not real' there is little more i can explain outside of a real dialogue. Perhaps we can role play? :)

Mmm... we're not asking you much, Antony, it's not like we're asking you to write a disseration about this.

Roleplay? Ok, sure. I used to love Dungeons & Dragons as a kid, so here we go.

Let's say a sixteen-year old emo guy walks up to you and start talking to you:

"You seem peaceful and ok with everything. I want that too. You see, the last couple of months have been shit really. I feel really disconnected from the people around me. Everyone seems to be enjoying themselves so naturally like it takes them no effort just to live their lives. All the while, I fee like a caged animal, locked here in a prison and I can't seem to get out of this. Could you help me?"

How would you approach this?

[Antony]

Hi Nomad,

I wasn't attempting to be difficult. It was just a genuine observation. Also the fact that my mind struggles at

Let's try this (to a 16yo guy) -
When you say you feel like a caged animal i assume you mean to all the thoughts and feelings that you are experiencing in life? So you are aware of the thoughts and feelings? So are you the thoughts and feelings themselves? Who is the knower of the thoughts and feelings? See that the one you call 'me' only appears as thought and feeling does. Where is the 'me' when the thought and feeling of 'me' is not there? Are you not the awareness of these thoughts and feelings arising as a 'me'? Stay with this investigating of your experience. Don't take it as a given. Ask yourself this - have you really checked out that all of what you're saying is true actually true. Find out for yourself. Really want to see the truth of these statements you are making. Keep looking.

A good exercise Nomad. Don't know if it really does what you're looking for. Let me know and i can have another go if not.

Antony

[Antony]

Oops. Didn't finish that sentence at the start. Haha. A self evident example of what i was about to say.

[Damon Kamda]

His reply:

"Yes, you're right. I am the awareness of all these thoughts and feelings. I am the awareness. That is why I feel so lonely and cut off from it all. It's as if I'm detached from everything that is happening. It feels cold and silent. I can't seem to get in touch with life".

[Antony]

Do you see that this 'detachment' is just another concept, a thought and feeling. Do you see how you are defining life is also another concept. Are you not the awareness that sees all these concepts passing through and not the concepts themselves?

[Damon Kamda]

"Yes, like I said, I am the awareness that sees all these concepts go by, not the concepts themselves. I know that. Yet, this doesn't make me feel any better at all. If anything, this is exactly my problem. It's like I can't take anything serious anymore. Like it's all just a game and everyone is pretending. And here I am, watching it all and there's nothing I can do about anything."

[Antony]

I'm really stuck here Nomad. I don't know where to point.

[Damon Kamda]

Nomad? Who is this Nomad you're talking about?

;-P (sorry)

Well, how about taking a closer look at the notion of awareness?

Is there a difference between awareness and objects of awareness?