"Reading this again I get the feeling that it is seen but it's not fully realised yet. I don't have more than an intuition but I get the sense that there is some key insight missing or something isn't clear yet"
Can you say more about this?The wast majority of us - if not all of us - keep deepening insight and get new insights after the initial seeing. Typically the initial seeing is that it becomes clear that "I" is only a thought amongst other thoughts, that thoughts do not control or chose and do not have a permanent nature, I.e. that there is no doer/controller and no separate self. After that there is for most an ongoing process where more subtle identifications are seen through and worked through.
I am somehow under the belief and expectation that I should be aware of no doer all the time. And that's not the case. It's only clear if and when I'm looking. But I am not sure in between these moments of looking if something in my awareness should change? That's why I'm guessing that there's some insight missing.
Like I get it that there's no controller or doer but I also don't get it at the same time. Like there is no deeper insight about this, things move the same way they did before.
Don't get me wrong, i do notice the changes that come with realising this but I feel like there is still a big doubtful part that doesn't get it. "I don't get it. I'm a bit dumb and slow in some ways"
Also the insight doesn't feel that dramatic to me. I've pondered the question of selfhood intuitively (without following a teaching) for decades, like I'm not my body because my body is made up of cells and they constantly die and recreate themselves without me even noticing. My body is more of a molecular tornado that processes food into compost and energy, also I don't really end where my skin ends because things are just so deeply interdependent at soo many scales and levels and we all influence each other in some way. Really basic stuff.
So the point is to see that "I" don't have control, and that things just happen by themselves? I feel like the thing is that I've been hiding inside my "head," in (and behind) a reality mainly made from, and based on thoughts for so long, that it was my home for such a long time, the understanding doesn't crystallise that easily. I was dissociated from my body and emotions for most of my life.
I used to "see" words instead of reality. Like the first step of this was in 2016 when I discovered flowers. Before that all flowers looked the same to me. Like the word flower. Then I started actually seeing them and realising how different and varied and alien looking they really are if I looked longer than a millisecond :)
Simply put: there's a lot of thoughts still. Ruminating, being in thoughts feels safe and familiar. Even though I know deeply that it's not safe or familiar and I have been working really hard to get out and back to my body and feelings for the last 22 years. And I have had so much success. Many emotions came back, some that feel like I haven't felt them ever in my life. (still waiting to get my tears back though)
But now there is some final boss still standing, it's made of several aspects. I've been grinding down "should" for the last 2-5 years, there's the "narrator/parrot" which has also significantly lost influence during the last two years.
Adhd and autism is a very paradoxical combination to work with. I'm so happy that I know this about myself now. But that combination is like my mind's settings are at maximum "distractibility/restlessness/chaos" aaand maximum "stubbornness/rigidity" at the same time.
I don't feel bad about it, it just means that I gotta experiment a lot to find a path that works for me.
"Also now I realised that there is this deep fear of stepping into the unknown.. I believe there is still a big step needed to welcome this existential fear and look beyond it."
Can you say more about this? Any thoughts on how to test this/move forward with this? One thought that comes here is that we will all face deeper levels of existential fear only in situations that trigger them, however they might come about. Of course if we sense a certain fear is close to the surface and/or possible to invite/trigger and work through, we can do it if we want.
I had this intuition at some point in our process because I heard people describing this existential fear that you gotta jump into, like "forever falling with no ground," you know?
At some point I had this again, which happens very very rarely after having a short nap that there is this mega profound fear that's very existential and very voidy and takes my breath away for a second. And I remembered that and somehow started wondering if that is the same fear that I heard folks talking about.
How to test it? My hunch is jeah like you said trying to invite the fear, increasing capacity for it, at the beginning of our process you mentioned something about asking the fear what it is afraid would happen or somehow to get to look behind it?
I believe that obviously I'm already falling. Like the thought structures are not protecting me from dissolution and change, cause they aren't solid. So I guess there's nothing to be afraid, just to take my hands off my eyes and enjoy?
My journey with existential fear started when I was a kid at some point I just realised how massive the world is and how I never ever will experience all the precious and amazing things that are happening. And I just got this huge fear of missing out. I think I remember getting a bit numb after that. Jeah and before that i had episodes of micropsia and macropsia with high fever. And i was "seeing" and "sensing" some external/internal "structures" I couldn't explain. And that went away also with the bullying in high school latest.
I know that I'm ready. I don't know how to proceed.
One hunch has to do with the sense of "this is really really real!" i had these experiences with cannabis in my twenties where I felt like I got a strong fear and then I fell through the ceiling into a realisiation that everything was real! It was euphoric in a terrifying sense but there was also a sense of pleasant groundedness to it, like a deep deep knowing that it's all good.
And sometimes I would fall through a second layer, "no, but it's really really REALLY real!"...
Anyway, in 2013 I got to try MDMA for the first time at friends home in Poland and it was very fascinating. First I started crashing but then I understood that I gotta get moving, so I started dancing in the kitchen and then I went to the balcony. And then this realisation happened that was like the above mentioned thing with cannabis but instead of breaking through 1-2 layers I broke through ALL of them like a meterorite, it felt like a proper skyscraper of layers, at least 20. And I came out the other end feeling I was both tiny and completely insignificant, and extremely powerful/all encompassing at the same time. And then my whole entire body was on fire.
Is this helpful?
If you have not yet done this exercise below, please do:
Explore ‘Sense of Self’
Let’s say that you have lost your keys and you swear that you left them in your coat. You go to look and check all the pockets - the keys are not there. You swear they must be as that was the last place you remember them. You have a vivid memory of putting them there after you left the house. But when you check they are not there. At this point you can keep believing that the keys are in your pocket, or you can admit you were mistaken. This is just like that. You may see clearly that the self is an illusion but still feel a sense of self - just like the keys. But feeling something to be true and seeing that it is or is not is different. This is why we may find ourselves coming back to your expectations at the start and at the end.
Now, I’d like to ask you to explore this SENSE of self very-very thoroughly. Not by thinking about it, but by FEELING it.
Keep the focus of attention on the sense of self and inquire:
Does the sense of self have a location?
Yes. The location is changing though. Depending on the time.
This is based on: I've been observing the sense of self throughout the last few weeks. I am not able to do this exercise right now because my adhd is through the roof and I cannot focus long enough.
please clarify if i misunderstood your instructions.
Does the sense of self have a shape or a size?
Yes. Or no. It co-arises with sensations usually of tension or constriction. The "sense of self" doesn't have a shape or size it is a thought.
Does the sense of self say or communicate anything?
"everything's ok, keep walking, nothing to see here"
If the answer is yes, how does the sense do this exactly?
Telepathy. The label is just there. Or is it a very engrained hunch?
Does the sense of self have any characteristics or attributes?
It co-arises with a sense of tension. That is interpreted as "ownership"
What is the sense of self ‘made of’? An image? Sound? Taste? Smell? Sensation? Thought?
Thought and sensation. But as I mentioned above the sensation is not connected to the thought except that it arises at the same time.
Okay, so every day respond as sincerely and deeply as possible to these three points:
1) Is there a separate self at all, a controller, a doer, has there ever been?
No. This is not something I can find in direct experience.
2) Is it 100% clear, if not what is not clear?
How is no-self different from what I'm experiencing now?
I'm noticing that it's getting harder for me to get into beginners mind with these questions the last few days. Do you happen to have some other questions to switch it out to for the sake of my novelty based brain? Or is the repetitions purpose to grind down my defenses? If yes it doesn't seem to be working :D cause doubt and frustration are rising. Just fyi.
Thanks for working with me <3