Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Mon Dec 18, 2023 7:19 pm

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)
Ha, ha! I just saw it now as I read your post. It's those things! Just being present with one or more of the senses (DE). That makes me chuckle.

Thanks for sharing your story. Reading it now. :-)
With gratitude,

Katty

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Mon Dec 18, 2023 8:25 pm

I can relate to a lot in your journey. I've had insights that came out of nowhere (like getting my masters degree in Counseling - came out of nowhere - and I never questioned it; Let me to being a psychotherapist which I would have never chosen on my own), and dreams that were definitely guides.
This was not a resignation, but a relinquishing of giving authority to thought. When fear said “Everything will collapse,” the response was “So be it.”
I'm there. That is a delight to not let the mind torture me with fears anymore.
My process has always been like this. I follow what is interesting. This may not work for everyone, because jumping around can be a way to avoid uncomfortable material.
Me too. But I trust it. Interesting. The Power vs. Force book is on my shelf, waiting for me. The title calls me, but not yet enough for me to actually read it.
When two or more of the above components are entangled, a sense of self can arise. When questioned, nothing is found.
Ha, ha! I've got it!! :-D
Later in 2023, I began guiding others on this path, which helped me go deeper.
I hope our interaction will be enriching to you as well. I love it when things are mutually beneficial. It is so inspiring!
There’s a feeling that this isn’t it, there’s something better beyond the horizon.
Such a trap! I'm getting to clarity on this - that whatever is coming tomorrow will come on its own time. Enjoying now (or at least being in the now) is where it's at. Being in the head about tomorrow or yesterday is generally a waste unless it's clearly directed (e.g. deciding about a vacation and making reservations, etc).
If you made it this far, thank you.

I hope you found this useful.
You are welcome and yes, I did. Have a wonderful evening! ;-) I hope I help you to figure out what to write next. Maybe we'll find a collaboration of sorts. I'm not inspired to write (not yet at least), but I have been gifted with so much knowledge about human beings and maybe there will be something we discuss that will help me pay-it-forward through your writing. Who knows.

We were meant to connect this way, right? :-)
With gratitude,

Katty

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Bluejay
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby Bluejay » Mon Dec 18, 2023 8:30 pm

Ha, ha! I just saw it now as I read your post. It's those things! Just being present with one or more of the senses (DE). That makes me chuckle.
So is the now in direct experience anything other than sensations labeled 'now'?

Does the now exist?
I hope our interaction will be enriching to you as well. I love it when things are mutually beneficial. It is so inspiring!
Yes :)
We were meant to connect this way, right? :-)
Perhaps a question is the answer: Could things have turned out any other way?

Since you mentioned being in the head about past or future, here's the next pointer we can explore:

Memory Exercise

Almost everybody believes that a memory thought is referring to something that has happened. That a memory thought is a different thought than a non-memory thought.

During this exercise. please don’t go to thought explanations, but just let a memory be there, and look at it.

Look at what is actually going on and not what thoughts say. Focus on direct experience.

What is memory exactly?
What is the memory ‘made of’?
WHEN does the memory appear?
What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘memory’ thought?
How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘memory’ thought refers to something that has happened?


Then, look at a thought about the future.

What is the future thought ‘made of’?
WHEN does the future thought appear?
What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘future’ thought?
How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘future’ thought refers to something that will happen?


Then let’s compare a thought about past and a thought about the future.

What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?

If there is difference and how is that difference known exactly?

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Mon Dec 18, 2023 8:51 pm

We were meant to connect this way, right? :-)
Perhaps a question is the answer: Could things have turned out any other way?
No. That actually was my point. ;-)

Will have some fun with your exercise today. Thank you!
With gratitude,

Katty

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Wed Dec 20, 2023 11:30 pm

Hi Henri,

My dad is nearing his last days and the holidays are upon us - I may not be able to post for awhile but please know that is not due to lack of interest. I will for sure be back by the start of the year, and hopefully sooner.

Thank you for all of your support so far. It is greatly appreciated.

Happy holidays to you and yours!

Best,

Katty
With gratitude,

Katty

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Bluejay
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby Bluejay » Thu Dec 21, 2023 8:49 am

Okay, no problem!
Happy holidays to you and yours!
You too 🎅🏻

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Thu Jan 04, 2024 12:15 am

Hi Henri,

I trust you had a good holiday season and Happy New Year to you! I made it through the holiday - my Dad did pass away, but it was peaceful and my Mom is coping fairly well. We are now just working on getting her finances situated and things like that so that she will be all set for the coming year.

I've continued to work on my awarenesses. I did some work on past-future and really clarified for myself that the only place they exist is in my mind. While I haven't let go of the idea that "that happened" even tho I can't prove it, I can very much see that to experience the past is sketchy - as it's thoughts and partial images and incomplete. I can think of the day my late husband passed away (quite vivid), but I can see more clearly how lots of detail is missing and it's a collage of thoughts, images, and emotion memories. The future is less clear and must more clearly just imaginary (solely mental) because of the thought that it hasn't happened yet. That thought is what makes the past and future memory/imagining different.

I am more aware of when I'm here (in the present) versus there (past, future, lost in thought about something that is not time related) and more able to shift out of thought and in to the ever-changing infinite present moment. I did part of a 4-day awakening retreat and it was a good way to continue to deepen my experience with guided meditations and talks. I'm finding more peace because I can sit with myself and the moment and dispatch the mental chatter more easily.

I realize that my biggest challenge is most likely in letting go of (the illusion of) control. I am easing in to that, but in the retreat the leader asked the question about "what are you still struggling with that keeps you stuck" and that came clearly to mind. Letting go of the idea that my thinking, planning, and acting result in things I want. I have been playing with a "letting go of control one day at a time" strategy but I haven't been mindful enough of that to really "see" anything that has impacted me yet.

I'm looking forward to our continued dialog. I hope you're finding something rich to write about!

Best,

Katty
With gratitude,

Katty

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Bluejay
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby Bluejay » Thu Jan 04, 2024 9:44 am

Hello!
I realize that my biggest challenge is most likely in letting go of (the illusion of) control. I am easing in to that, but in the retreat the leader asked the question about "what are you still struggling with that keeps you stuck" and that came clearly to mind. Letting go of the idea that my thinking, planning, and acting result in things I want. I have been playing with a "letting go of control one day at a time" strategy but I haven't been mindful enough of that to really "see" anything that has impacted me yet.
Can you let go of something you never had?

What exactly is it that you are in control of? Let's explore that :)

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Thu Jan 04, 2024 7:57 pm

Somehow, I should have known that'd be your response. Intellectually, I get it. Emotionally it's less easy. I will continue to work in my experience. I happened upon this note (presumably from the retreat) just now. Ha. The universe helping me.
Didn’t come from anywhere, not going anywhere. Control requires a past and a future.
With gratitude,

Katty

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Bluejay
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby Bluejay » Thu Jan 04, 2024 8:03 pm

Somehow, I should have known that'd be your response. Intellectually, I get it. Emotionally it's less easy. I will continue to work in my experience. I happened upon this note (presumably from the retreat) just now. Ha. The universe helping me.
Yes, so let me know what you are in control of and we can unpack.

Be precise when you're looking. If you're vague, there's no real findings, kind of like going on an archaeological dig and swiping randomly at things instead of focusing on where the bones are. :)

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Thu Jan 04, 2024 8:10 pm

Good pointer. I think that's where I've been stuck. In vague concepts, rather than really specific things. Even now, trying to find something specific I can control is hard. So thanks, feels like I am on the right track. Happy Thursday! Hope you have a wonderful rest of the evening!
With gratitude,

Katty

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Bluejay
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby Bluejay » Thu Jan 04, 2024 8:12 pm

Maybe take a notepad with you during the day, or just use your phone to write down what you think or feel like you control during the day, then let me know what you found.

Have a good one!

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Thu Jan 04, 2024 8:55 pm

Will do. I can see a fatal flaw in everything already that I have looked at that I could control (or at least influence). Really the idea of influencing things is where I'm stuck.

For example, I see our handyman on the property, I can control him to say "hello" if I say "hello" to him because of the social agreement of greetings. However, I of course don't actually control whether or not he says hello, but it does influence him to do that. But even if that is true, the fatal flaw comes back to me, and whether or not there is an "I" that is in control of or deciding to say "Hello" in the first place.

Everything I control/influence originates with an idea/action from me. So then if I don't really control me, then I don't control anything else.

I will keep at it, but I wanted to make a note of that.
With gratitude,

Katty

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Bluejay
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby Bluejay » Thu Jan 04, 2024 9:04 pm

For example, I see our handyman on the property, I can control him to say "hello" if I say "hello" to him because of the social agreement of greetings. However, I of course don't actually control whether or not he says hello, but it does influence him to do that. But even if that is true, the fatal flaw comes back to me, and whether or not there is an "I" that is in control of or deciding to say "Hello" in the first place.

Everything I control/influence originates with an idea/action from me. So then if I don't really control me, then I don't control anything else.
So it comes back to whether or not you can make thoughts happen. Can you predict the next thought?

And when you say 'you' control, what exactly are you referring to? Again, be precise. Is it a sensation? A thought that labels a sensation? What is there?

Almost always the illusion of control stays alive because we miss the first step. For example, saying that I can influence thoughts because I can say 'Now I'll think of a tree', but we miss predicting the thought that predicts.

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BlueRacoon
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Re: Having moments of liberation - wanting more!

Postby BlueRacoon » Thu Jan 04, 2024 9:08 pm

Almost always the illusion of control stays alive because we miss the first step. For example, saying that I can influence thoughts because I can say 'Now I'll think of a tree', but we miss predicting the thought that predicts.
I'm seeing that trap! I'll keep at it to prove it to my emotional self through experience. :-)
With gratitude,

Katty


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