Psychological freedom

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BreathLess
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Re: Psychological freedom

Postby BreathLess » Wed Aug 03, 2022 2:39 pm

Hi Luchana,👋
he is within this endless and free space,and he abides there calmly not being disturbed by any boundaries.And his existence is of no importance of the whole space which ,in fact, the writer is identical to and with.No bothering.No conflicts.
Q.Is there a "he" and the wholeness?
Yes,a clarification is needed here.More precisely,it is felt as if there is a small He in the beginning who is turning into wholeness ,who is fully absorbed by wholeness,and then only wholeness is remaining all around.
Q.Who is there to abide IN wholeness?
Wholeness is all there is,Wholeness witnesses ITself.
Q.Are there two things? You and wholeness and you somehow have the ability to abide IN wholeness?
Right now,as the writer is looking to the world around,there is only wholeness which somehow magically allows to everything around come and go within IT.
Q.Also let's have a look at these ones:
Can you say with 100% certainty that there is no such thing as a chooser?
Yes.It is being watched now that the next thought,sound,sensation,smell,emotion simply comes out of nothingness or wholeness all on their own.And no one or no thing has a chance to choose what will happen next.
Q.Is it completely clear that there is no I/me choosing or deciding?
Yes,It is experienced completely in this way.
Q.Is it totally clear that there is no such thing as choice or free will?
Yes,however strange and counterintuitive it may sound.🙃🙃
Q.If not, please write some examples when it seems to be otherwise.
I can't think of such examples.🤔


Thank you very much for your time and diligence!🙏🙏🙏

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Luchana
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Re: Psychological freedom

Postby Luchana » Thu Aug 04, 2022 7:51 am

Hi Peter.

Nice ones :-)

Now look here:

Is it possible to see something like a self which isn't being "fabricated" by thoughts?

Is there a separate entity controling life?

Are there any doubts?


Much love,
Luchana
If you wonder what it’s like living nonduality in everyday life?
https://awakeningawakened.com/2022/10/2 ... onduality/

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BreathLess
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Joined: Tue May 31, 2022 12:06 pm

Re: Psychological freedom

Postby BreathLess » Thu Aug 04, 2022 12:21 pm

Hi Luchana,
Q.Now look here:
Is it possible to see something like a self which isn't being "fabricated" by thoughts?

By watching right now ,one who is watching can't identify any stable object that is arising.All comes and goes unceasingly.Including the self or any else 'thing' that may seem like a center of this immediate experience.If and when somehow a self or any else that is felt as a center,appears ,once noticed,glimpsed, it itself disappears in the same very instance .Precisely as any other thought that comes and goes.Though the writer is attempting, no 'I' could be found apart from incoming thoughts.
Q.Is there a separate entity controlling life?

It appears for the looker right now here, that all there is are just emerging thoughts,sensations,images,sounds.And however credible the feeling for authencity of this 'I' might appear to be, again,when it is looked straightforward,it proves to be simply a thought like every other,emerging out of wholeness only to disappear in a split second back there.So,no.No separate,stable,independent,everpresent entity controlling life could be found by direct watching.
Q.Are there any doubts?

Yes,doubts are present when the writer is involved in the havoc of daily life.When is forgotten to be looked directly at what and how is appearing at the very moment of its arising.
However, even when this is happening, shortly a deep background comprehension is appearing reminding and alarming that what is apparently happening shouldn't ,can't be quite true,no way.And soon, in up to several minutes even when entangling in thoughts is more serious,the direct watching mode is turning on back, and any doubts are no more.And so,to the next block.This resembles of a building of a new skill.In the beginning ,it seems hopelessly tough.Then,it gets little bit easier.And,as more attempts are being done ,the "direct watching mode" gets more and more common.Till it gets the default mode.

Thank you very much for your time and diligence!🙏🖐👍

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Luchana
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Re: Psychological freedom

Postby Luchana » Sat Aug 06, 2022 8:18 am

Hi Peter.
By watching right now ,one who is watching can't identify any stable object that is arising.All comes and goes unceasingly.Including the self or any else 'thing' that may seem like a center of this immediate experience.If and when somehow a self or any else that is felt as a center,appears ,once noticed,glimpsed, it itself disappears in the same very instance .Precisely as any other thought that comes and goes.Though the writer is attempting, no 'I' could be found apart from incoming thoughts.
Nice one:-)
It appears for the looker right now here, that all there is are just emerging thoughts,sensations,images,sounds.And however credible the feeling for authencity of this 'I' might appear to be, again,when it is looked straightforward,it proves to be simply a thought like every other,emerging out of wholeness only to disappear in a split second back there.So,no.No separate,stable,independent,everpresent entity controlling life could be found by direct watching.
All right :-)
I'm curious what happend in the midst of a everyday life? When you are NOT looking rather living the everyday life?

Is there any difference?


Yes,doubts are present when the writer is involved in the havoc of daily life.When is forgotten to be looked directly at what and how is appearing at the very moment of its arising.
However, even when this is happening, shortly a deep background comprehension is appearing reminding and alarming that what is apparently happening shouldn't ,can't be quite true,no way.And soon, in up to several minutes even when entangling in thoughts is more serious,the direct watching mode is turning on back, and any doubts are no more.And so,to the next block.This resembles of a building of a new skill.In the beginning ,it seems hopelessly tough.Then,it gets little bit easier.And,as more attempts are being done ,the "direct watching mode" gets more and more common.Till it gets the default mode.
Yea, it may take a liitle time and in the begining "looking" feels dificult, but keep looking. Looking is the key :-)

Can you say with a big fat yes that the illusion of a separate self is seen through?
And how does it feel? Strange, normal, neither or both?


Usually at this time of exploration we give few more questions and I am sharing the replies with the other fellow guides. But this is not an exam or something like that. It is just a checking if I missed something to cover in our thread.

Are you ready for these questions?

Much love,
Luchana
If you wonder what it’s like living nonduality in everyday life?
https://awakeningawakened.com/2022/10/2 ... onduality/

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BreathLess
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Re: Psychological freedom

Postby BreathLess » Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:48 pm

Hi Luchana,
Q
.I'm curious what happend in the midst of a everyday life? When you are NOT looking rather living the everyday life?
Is there any difference?
It is noticed a pattern in Direct 🎯 Looking🔎 interruptions.
Direct 🎯 Looking🔎
tend to switch off in the following situations:
When one is tired,At the time when one moves on from one task to another ,at the time between two tasks,When something surprising and unexpected has happened,the list is not exhaustive, just an existed pattern is indicated.
Life itself is one and the same
whether the writer manages to look directly or forgets to do it.
However,the
writer's experience is completely different in the former and the latter scenarios.

Q.
Can you say with a big fat yes that the illusion of a separate self is seen through?
Yes,there is a recurring and consistent experience obtained through direct looking that any I,Me,A Center of experience,is simply an illusory mental construct, and such thing as a separate self doesn't exist.

Q.
And how does it feel? Strange, normal, neither or both?
Everitime when the lack of self is experienced it  is a stunning😯😯,breathtaking🫁 an event!
However,once experienced a huge relief of overtrowing of this self dictatorship's burden arises as well.
So,the feeling is either strange and normal.
Q.
Usually at this time of exploration we give few more questions and I am sharing the replies with the other fellow guides. But this is not an exam or something like that. It is just a checking if I missed something to cover in our thread.
Are you ready for these questions?
Yes,you are welcome!🙏 🤗 

Thank you very much for your time and diligence!🙏🖐👍

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Luchana
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Re: Psychological freedom

Postby Luchana » Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:14 am

Hi Peter,

thank you for your replies.
Yes,you are welcome!🙏 🤗

all right :-)

Here are the questions. Take a look and reply with honesty the way you see things right now, fresh, fresh. Do not rely on a memory of a previos seeing.


1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Share in your own words what the illusion of separate self is and how it shows up in experience.

3) How does it feel to see this?

What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?

5a. Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work?
Give examples from your own recent experiences to how things happen and how things work.
5b. What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

6) Anything to add?

As I said these are just in order for other fellow guides to see if I've missed something in our tread, it's not an exam :-)

Take your time, do not rush.


Much love,

Luchana
If you wonder what it’s like living nonduality in everyday life?
https://awakeningawakened.com/2022/10/2 ... onduality/

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BreathLess
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Joined: Tue May 31, 2022 12:06 pm

Re: Psychological freedom

Postby BreathLess » Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:02 pm

Hi Luchana!
Q.Here are the questions. Take a look and reply with honesty the way you see things right now, fresh, fresh. Do not rely on a memory of a previous seeing.
1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?
It is looked directly right now and what is seen is that there is no 'Self', 'Me', 'I', from where, and through which a looker, watcher, cognizer, manager, doer to look, watch, comprehend, decide, or in brief, to make life happen and flow. There are plenty of appearances around, sights, sounds, sensations, smells, even thoughts and feelings that arise and dissolve in an endless continuity out of an inexplicable nothingness, wholeness and back there. However, can't be identified, found, or pointed out at a particular, certain place, certain a point somewhere within this space around, where I, Self, Me, a centre, sit smoking a pipe and drinking a cappuccino. Nor an entity can be identified that itself decides, controls, supervises and orchestrates such a glorious play of continuously arising and subsiding appearances.
Astonishingly, all of life is happening utterly on its own.
2) Share in your own words what the illusion of a separate self is and how it shows up in experience.
Hahaha, this seems to be the easiest question, because the whole 'my' life proves to be under the merciless authority of a ceaseless delusion of I, Me, Self, and under the persistent and convincing feeling of me and the rest of the world distinctly separated. As a matter of experience, this delusion is felt much as a continuous struggle for these separated Me, I, Self to survive in a life and death battle against all and everything, which is felt to be "over there"" ,"outside" of I, Me, Self.
The result, predictably, is bloody fights of these illusory "I, Me, Self", against ''the rest of the world'', which is as well a construct as ephemeral as the Self. And these bloody fights never come to an end. These incessant struggles for I, Me, Self to take over, to defeat the "others'', leads the one who comes out to be their arena, to no other than anxiety, agitation, feeling of loneliness, separation, name it. What is more, even when I, Me, Self 'part' manages somehow to defeat its enemy, and achieve aparrently its innermost desires, oh, what a surprise, in the same very moment of a grandiose triumph, another battle is beginning,but this time, say, out of fear that this joy obtained with so much struggle may be lost. Although the whole suffering and hardships so far, there is no satisfaction as Mick Jagger said in a song, no nirvana, no lifelong pleasure, and beach and umbrella and gin tonic with a cigar.
3)How does it feel to see this?
When one sees clearly ,even in an instance,the absence of Self, or I, or Myself, or Me, or a Center, even in an eyeblink, what is felt is an enormous astonishment.
If there is something inexpressible, indescribable, it is it.
You are like, how is it possible, man? It can't be true!
Such freedom and relief arise out of dropping off all that is considered as an unbearable burden of existence in which all of us, countless Sisyphuses are life sentenced!
And finally, there is salvation!
It sounds like an evangelist pastor ranting, obviously, however, the event of seeing is so unthinkable, unexpected, that one should resort to religious lexicon and poetry to even slightly touch its nature.
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?

Before this dialogue, one considered himself as inevitably doomed to live in a constant battle against whoever and whatever were faced, and what's more, even without being able to notice being in this dreamlike existence.
At this stage of the dialogue, however, one is aware that since "one" does not exist, there is no central entity, I, Me, Self, to begin with. And much less an entity involved in any arguments or fights.
Before this dialogue, one was watching through the eyes of a solidified, petrified subject, Me, I, who inevitably divides the world of my things, my views, my beliefs, my possessions, and others things, set of beliefs, innermost values.
For the time being, when a direct looking is done, what is seen, is beyond the logic of, say, normal, ordinary seeing, a kind that a subject exercises to the objects around.
The realization, on the ground of direct experience, rather as a mere comprehension of a concept, a thought, a set of words, that 'there is no I, Me, Center', unlocks an experience that is not merely on another level. It is in another realm, so to say, however misleading this frame might seem.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?
The first one came a long time ago, and it was simply a deep desire to somehow alleviate ceaseless everyday stress and psychological pain.
Honestly, I can't say or remember precisely what a particular bit of experience made the seeing the world through or rather beyond ''subject-to-objects" perspective.
However, the memory of this first seeing, though it lasted in an eyeblink, remains strikingly vivid.

5a. Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work?
Give examples from your own recent experiences to how things happen and how things work.
-Decision
It is felt that a decision to prefer a banana flavoured ice cream to a vanilla one, somehow arises and then the very act of choice fulfills itself, completely on its own, and on top of it, comes out of nothing.
-Intention
The Intention to start and go on texting here for hours on end here ,instead of wasting time on something far more exciting like,say, taking out the trash :):), comes completely uninvited and somehow in random, and simply is happening. At least as a matter of direct experience,the arising of Intentions and decisions closely following them,are felt as though they come out of emptiness, nothingness or gods of non-duality know where from.
-Free will
It is experienced that things just happen. If, for example, I try to list three big European cities, the first three that come are Warsaw, London and Athens. And based on this, it may be claimed that this is a free will kind of choice because I am deliberately choose precisely these three beautiful cities amongst many others.
However, both decisions here,the first one ,amongst what popular things to choose,cities or states or continents,or meals, or pop groups and so on, and the second one ,which particular three cities to pick up, are arising utterly unpredictably and all on their own in and kind of ramdomly!And certainly, no I,Me,Self is involved in this choice.
-Actions
The moves of body parts, arm, hand, feet, abdomen, breathing, happen all on their own, no choice whatsoever, neither from the part of the one who is looking nor from any other.
When it is seen directly, it proves that both a decision for an act, say, moving a foot, and the very act itself originates....out of nothingness. When an attempt to understand is done where exactly this particular move comes from, a dead end is faced, which dead end, as a matter of experience, is felt as a mere nothingness, emptiness, bleakness.
5b. What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences of how this works.
By realizing the severe limitations of exercising free will as a "subject" toward various objects, the writer here eventually come to the realisation to trust in this empty endlessness, in this glassy wholeness,in this glorious space, from where whole life is felt to emanate.And for the time being, this act of trust leads to an existence which seems to be 'responsible' to the rest of world.
Since the personal direct experience of an absence of a subject who is in control not only of thoughts and feelings but in actions, as well, to hold myself accountable for thoughts, feeling and even actions that are arising seems as a pointless and futile approach.
Though, as far as the writer can, he will keep holding himself responsible for all aspects of existence.
From the perspective of the writer here, the lucky minority of individuals that has the chance to see through the illusion of subject-object perspective, even only for a split second, based on this seeing, probably will live by being much more aware and responsible toward the world.
6) Anything to add?
I don't think so.Too much was said. :(
Nevertheless,if a question is remaining overlooked,please let me know to elaborate on it.

And again,thanks a million for the patience and diligence! 🙏 🤗🙏 🤗🙏 🤗

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Luchana
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Re: Psychological freedom

Postby Luchana » Tue Aug 09, 2022 6:05 am

Hi Peter,

thank you for your replies. I can't stop smiling while reading :-)
I'm going to share them with the other felow guides and they may or may not have more questions.
This may take a little time. I will come back to you as soon as it is possible.

Much love,
Luchana
If you wonder what it’s like living nonduality in everyday life?
https://awakeningawakened.com/2022/10/2 ... onduality/

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Luchana
Posts: 1984
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:23 pm

Re: Psychological freedom

Postby Luchana » Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:52 am

Hi Peter,

Sorry for.the dely in reply, I was having some.dificulties logging in.

the other guides have no other questions for you, which means that you crushed the gate, but as you already know there is no gate and no one to crush it :-)

Keep an eye for a message from the admin and at one moment your name will turns into blue. There are a lot of options for further investigation here in the forom in FB group if you decide to join those.
Also there are online meetings - we are having one each Thursday and you are most welcome to join. I will add your e-mails in the mailing list and you will recieve notifications for all meetings and events.


It's been a great joy to explore the concept of a separate self with you and thank you for your oppeness and wilingness to look.

Here is my fb profile - you can add me as a friend so we can be in touch.
https://www.facebook.com/luchana.uzunova/


Sending much love,

Luchana
If you wonder what it’s like living nonduality in everyday life?
https://awakeningawakened.com/2022/10/2 ... onduality/

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BreathLess
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue May 31, 2022 12:06 pm

Re: Psychological freedom

Postby BreathLess » Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:39 am

Hi Luchana!
You were so kind to spend precious hours of your time helping me stumbling ,falling down,scrapping knees and standing up again,so as to eventually glimpse clearly,even only for a moment,that I,Me,Self is simply a believable looking hallucination.
I cannot tell you what that meant to me after years of struggling with such unslovable a paradox. Not only did the lack of a center was noticed ,if only for a split second,but it happens more and more regularly and even amidst people,places and events that before were considered overly stressful, and practically was unthinkable for the writer to keep sanity in such a surroundings.

Again,thanks a million!🙏🙏🙏👋👋👋


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