The Gate

Hi Kay,

What is the memory ‘made of’?

It is made out of an image

WHEN does the memory appear?

It appears 'Now', when else could it appear ?

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘memory’ thought?

There is no difference between a 'general' thought & a 'memory' thought.

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘memory’ thought refers to something that has happened?

It cannot be known that a 'memory' thought is referring to something that has happened.


Then, look at a thought about the future.

What is the future thought ‘made of’?

The 'future' thought is made out of the same stuff as a memory or general thought, no difference. The only description that points to a memory, general or future thought is itself another thought

WHEN does the future thought appear?

It appears 'now', there is nowhere else it could ever appear

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘future’ thought?

No differnece can be found

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘future’ thought refers to something that will happen?

It could not be known that a future thought is refering to something that will happen, all thoughts are 'known' now, the notion they are pointing to a futute event is another arising thought


Then let’s compare a thought about past and a thought about the future.

What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?

There is no difference, as there is no past or no future, there is only this moment, all thoughts are known in this moment, some point to the AE of this moment, others point to 'illusion' and call it a 'past' & a 'future'. There is no evidence to suggest a 'past' ever happened, only thought/story pointing to it.

If there is difference, how that difference is known exactly?

No difference whatsoever, just thoughts arising in the 'Now'

Hope this helps
Love Mark

Hey Mark,

What is the memory ‘made of’?

It is made out of an image

‘Mental images’ and 'visual images' appear, however what points to those images and then refers those images to a past?

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘memory’ thought?

There is no difference between a 'general' thought & a 'memory' thought.

Exactly, they are simply the AE of thought.

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘memory’ thought refers to something that has happened?

It cannot be known that a 'memory' thought is referring to something that has happened.

It is only an appearing thought that refers to thoughts/images and says they are something that has happened. So it is known via thought only.

If thought appears saying you ate an ice-cream yesterday….where is ‘yesterday’ in actual experience. When is that thought and images of eating an ice-cream actually appearing?

Then, look at a thought about the future.
What is the future thought ‘made of’?

The 'future' thought is made out of the same stuff as a memory or general thought, no difference. The only description that points to a memory, general or future thought is itself another thought

Yes, so a future thought, like a past thought are all simply thought as is a thought that points to something in the present time.

There is no time. There is only the ‘herenow’.
What does ‘here and now’ actually point to? Does it point to a location and time or does it point to experience (THIS) that is always here now and is the ‘herenow’?

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘future’ thought refers to something that will happen?

It could not be known that a future thought is refering to something that will happen, all thoughts are 'known' now, the notion they are pointing to a futute event is another arising thought

Yup :)

Then let’s compare a thought about past and a thought about the future.
What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?

There is no difference, as there is no past or no future, there is only this moment, all thoughts are known in this moment, some point to the AE of this moment, others point to 'illusion' and call it a 'past' & a 'future'. There is no evidence to suggest a 'past' ever happened, only thought/story pointing to it.

Lovely, yes.

Love, Kay

Hi kay,

‘Mental images’ and 'visual images' appear, however what points to those images and then refers those images to a past?

Thought points to mental & visual images and create a story around them. Example, a image of a body (Mark) walking in the forest arises in the "here & Now', then another thought points to the image 'I went walking last Monday, it was nice, it was sunny etc', but there is no last Monday, it is a story of a past arising in the now that didn't happen.

If thought appears saying you ate an ice-cream yesterday….where is ‘yesterday’ in actual experience. When is that thought and images of eating an ice-cream actually appearing?

There is no 'yesterday' in actual experience, or anywhere for that matter, all there is is an arising thought in the 'here & now', a story about an ice cream being eaten in something called a yesterday. The thought of the ice cream and the story of it being eaten yesterday arise in experience/this, here & now !! Nothing can ever be experienced outside of the now.

There is no time. There is only the ‘here now’.

What does ‘here and now’ actually point to? Does it point to a location and time or does it point to experience (THIS) that is always here now and is the ‘herenow’?

The words 'Here and Now' are labels, that thought uses to point to direct experience/this !! There is no location or time in the "here & Now', a location is a place created by thought in the placeless 'here & now', also time is a thought, a story about a past or a future, all just thoughts telling more stories.

Hope this helps
Love Mark

Hi Mark,

Lovely responses, I have no further questions with regards to memory.

Okay....let's have a look at where we are at. :) Can you answer the following questions with simple and quick answers. Please answer what's true for you right now, rather than any sort of 'ideal' answer.

Has it been clearly seen that there is no separate individual (“I/me”), and never has been?
Has it been clearly seen that there has never been a separate individual that could control or own life or anything?
Is there any chooser or decider of any kind?
Is there a separate individual/entity of any kind whatsoever that could be responsible for anything at all?
Is there a thinker of thought?
Has there ever been a separate self doing anything?
Is there a self in the body somewhere? Does it have a certain location, or feelings associated with it, or any other attributes?
Is there a self that is inside the body, perceiving a world that is outside?
Do you notice a difference now, to when you first started this exploration, and if so what are those differences?
Is there any confusion at all or anything you would like to address?

Love, Kay

Hi Kay,

Has it been clearly seen that there is no separate individual (“I/me”), and never has been?

Yes, there are no seperate individuals anywhere. This body that was thought to be me is just another appearance (colour) in the here & now

Has it been clearly seen that there has never been a separate individual that could control or own life or anything?

Yes, nothing is separate from what is arising in experience/this, no one 'controlling' anything

Is there any chooser or decider of any kind?

No, there are thoughts that point to a 'chooser', a separate self, but this is more story

Is there a separate individual/entity of any kind whatsoever that could be responsible for anything at all?

No separate entities to be responsible for anything, just life 'lifing'

Is there a thinker of thought?

No thinker of thought can be found. Only a 'knowing' of thought, some thoughts point to Actual Experience, some point to other thoughts and some create fictitious stories

Has there ever been a separate self doing anything?

It was always assumed that 'I' was controlling thoughts and the body but now on inspection and looking there was never a 'Me', only arising thoughts that have no rhyme or reason on their content

Is there a self in the body somewhere? Does it have a certain location, or feelings associated with it, or any other attributes?

There is no 'self' in the body, the body is 'known' as another appearance in the here & now

Is there a self that is inside the body, perceiving a world that is outside?

Again, no self in the body, or out the body for that matter, in fact there is no body, just colour & a story. Also there is no inside or outside of anything, just 'this' arising

Do you notice a difference now, to when you first started this exploration, and if so what are those differences?

Yes there is a difference, there is no longer a seriousness to protect this body and ego from other 'people', what is realised is there is no one here to protect (just thoughts saying there is) and there are no others to take seriously, just life 'lifing', it feels like a burden has been lifted

Is there any confusion at all or anything you would like to address?

No confusion, most of the looking through the thread was hampered by discerning language incorrectly on my part here, For example 'Experience' 'This' & 'Knowing' all point to the same thing as was shown to me just recently, it made things allot clearer, apart from that all the exercises have been 'seen'

Hope this helps
Love Mark

Hey Mark,

Okay, so since everything seems clear, here are the final questions. Please answer them with some detail and provide examples where asked.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

Love, Kay

Hi Kay,
Here goes :)


Okay, so since everything seems clear, here are the final questions. Please answer them with some detail and provide examples where asked.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

No, there isn't a 'serarate self' anywhere. Never has been, never will.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

The illusion of a separate self is a collection of thoughts that point to Actual Experience and create a story of a 'Me'. Example, In AE there is an experiencing that 'thought' lables colour, sound, sensation, etc, then further lables the sound, colour, sensation as a body, a 'Me' a 'Mark' who is walking (sensation) around work (colour), hearing (sound) people talking, working etc, none of this is happening, it is just thought modulating the "hear & now' into a story of a separate 'Mark'. It starts when a story of a 'Mark' is created from a young age probably by parents and older siblings, a conditioning, Example, well done Mark, good boy Mark, No that's wrong, that's bad etc all imprinting on a young boy he is separate and he exists as a seperate person who makes his own decisions and fate by his thinking and actions.
It has been seen here that this 'separate self' is a grand illusion, held together by misguided thought, thought pointing to AE and labeling it and creating stories around it.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?

Please report from the past few days.
There has been a sense of a 'freer' 'Me' if that makes sense. Like the old 'Mark' has fallen away. There has been a 'noticing' in work the last few days that 'people' seem different, a hidden 'knowing' they are on automatic, there is no one in them bodies making them move, like they can't be taking seriously anymore, or this supposedely body of mine. Thought is saying "we have to get this done in work today' blah blah but there is a deeper understanding 'I' am not thinking these thoughts anymore, there is no "me', only as a thought, there is just a watching of them. Also there was allot of fear and anxiety (more lables) in and around speaking in work, this has fallen away, or the feeling is no longer believed as being 'mine', it's just a feeling that is observed, no big deal.

Before this was started there was a identification with the 'body' and all it's thoughts and feelings as being 'mine' and 'I' am creating all this, all this anxiety and fear is coming from 'Me' and my wrong thinking, blah blah now allot of the time it's just observed as a detatched unfolding of what is going on, like a toing and froing between a 'Me' and a 'No Me'

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

living with Anxiety & Fear all the time and finding LU on youtube. A questioning of is it true ? Is this 'Me' really an illusion ? A desire to 'see' if this "me' is an illusion then so must the Anxiety & Fear be.

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.

Decision, a 'decider' who controls this body and makes it move to get up out of bed, to drive to work, to function throughout the day was always thought to be controlled by a "Me', like 'I' was doing everything. What has been seen here is that there is and never was a 'Me' deciding anything, it is all thoughts pointing to Actual Experience and creating a story, "i did that' 'that was the right thing to do' etc but upon looking to find this "me' nothing was there but thought.

Also with 'Intention', another story of a "Mark' intending to do this or that, just more thoughts, Example of this, I intend to do my best when welding this pipe in work is a story of a Mark trying his best, having an intention, but life is going on anyway, the pipe will be welded and Mark never done any of it, it's just what is going on in the 'here & now' with no controller intending any of it.

Free will is another thought pointing to a separate Mark who believes he is making choices and decisions based on a 'him' doing it. Where can a 'Mark' be found to have 'Free will' to choose anything ? He isn't there, only in a thought/story about a 'Mark'

Choice & control is not happening anywhere, by anyone. Choice implies a 'chooser', a separate part of the whole, the unfolding of the now is happening by itself, the notion of 'choice' is a thought pointing to a separate self who made a choice to do this or that. there is no one or no thing to choose or control anything. Life is 'lifing' by itself. The whole illusion of a chooser and controller is a construction of thought, nothing else.

b) What makes things happen? How does it work?

Nothing makes things happen !! They arise and fall spontaneously with no one or no thing doing any of it. A 'maker' of things happening implies a separate 'doer' of things, when nothing is serarate from the whole. It works by being what it is, the unfolding of the 'Now'

c) What are you responsible for?

No 'Me' to be responsible for anything, how can a 'active process' be accountable when no one or thing is driving the behaviour ? It would be like a river being responsible for the path it takes. there is no one driving the river, it just flows, same here, this body just acts, with no actor here doing any of it

d) Give examples from experience.

The body (Mark) went to work yesterday, worked all day, drove home an cut another driver up coming off the mororway. Where is the 'I' that made the decision to cut across the guy and force him to brake ? This was going to happen no matter what. No 'Mark' (who is just a story) responsible for anything

6) Anything to add?

A Big Heartfelt Thank-you to Kay for clear & concise pointing over and over again.

Love Mark

Hey Mark,

Great responses....thank-you! Okay, next step is for me to get other guides to look at the thread to make sure I have covered everything and that everything is clear. There may or may not be further questions and it may take a few days for me to get back to you. In the meantime....happy looking :)

Love, Kay

Hi Kay,
Ok that's great, hope to hear back soon and thanks.

Love Mark

Hello Mark,

Congratulations, and welcome to LU! You have journeyed through the Gateless Gate, which was no journey at all! :)
There are no further questions for you. It has been such a pleasure to walk with you and point the way. Thank you for being so open and willing to LOOK!

Keep an eye out for an email notification from the forum about a PM (private message) inviting you to join our Aftercare group on Facebook. The PM also details other resources available to you. Your name will change from green to blue, which indicates that you have had the realisation of there being no separate self.

You can contact me at any time if you have any questions etc, via the forums PM system, or via Facebook if you decide to join our groups there.

Love, Kay