Bobu's journey

[Bobu]

Hi Kay....ive been looking at thought and sensations for a while....never saw any of this stuff you 've pointed to...holy shit...this is the coolest thing....leave me in space as expirince...nothing more......xoxo....

[forgetmenot]

Hi Bobu!

What is the memory ‘made of’?
WHEN does the memory appear?

The memory is a thought......it appears pretty much when thoughts are present......even future reference is thought rooted in memory......interesting.!,,!!

So, what is the AE of ‘memory’? Is it not thoughts about thoughts? So other than pointing to the AE of thought, does the word/label ‘memory’ point to anything else other than more thought?

Try this trippy exercise!

Imagine that thoughts have stopped altogether. Now there are no stories appearing in the dream at all (if you concentrate attention on thought that might actually happen for a minute or two, but no biggie if it doesn't - just ignore them if they appear.) Ok, so all the labels and stories are now gone...

…now, what is reality like without stories…
Is there a body present?
Is there a room present?
Is there a phone or a computer present?
Are the sounds coming from people/things in the distance?
Did the past happen? Can the *idea* of a past even arise without a thought-story?

Do this one a few times today for as long as you can and see how much of the world seems to vanish when thought isn't spinning its yarns.

So why do so many things seem to disappear when there are no thoughts about them?

Then, look at a thought about the future.
What is the future thought ‘made of’?

Yep it's all this thought process constructing associations based in language....and pictures arising in present time in ae...like I'm seeing writing this.......

Isn’t language and thought one and the same thing?
 

WHEN does the future thought appear?

This is interesting....it appears in response to a thought the proceeds it...a question I'm not clear on this...but that what I see when I look

Okay, so I want you to think about what you are going to have for dinner TOMORROW night. When are those thoughts about “tomorrow” actually appearing?

What is the AE of morning, afternoon, night, today, tomorrow, next week, next year?
How is it known that there is a ‘today’ that will end and a ‘tomorrow’ begins?

Then let’s compare a thought about past and a thought about the future.
What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?
If there is difference, how that difference is known exactly?

It looks like it's all thought accompanied by more thoughts that claim reference points...i can't see a difference in them although I see sensation accompanying the references..plesent or other wise......more please!!

I want you to think of a short thought story that seemingly creates fear or excitement and I want you to become aware of the sensation that this thought story supposedly evokes.

Okay…now drop the whole story - go do something so that the sensations and thoughts are no longer prevalent and are forgotten. Then I want you to once again think of that same short story BUT this time I want you to LOOK very carefully to see if you can find an actual link that links the thought with the sensation to see if they actually go hand-in-hand.
Try this exercise several times. Let me know what you find.

Thank you Kay....love headed down under to you mate...those thoughts had picture of a sphere with picture of a Kay and a bobu on opposite sides sending and recieving....lolololol.....xoxo

Haha….thank you! :)

Love, Kay
xx

[forgetmenot]

Hi Kay....ive been looking at thought and sensations for a while....never saw any of this stuff you 've pointed to...holy shit...this is the coolest thing....leave me in space as expirince...nothing more......xoxo....

Brilliant! Give the "man" a lollypop! (lol lol lol)

Much love, Kay
xx

[forgetmenot]

There really isn't any need to continue as you have seen clearly that there is no separate self and seen beyond that. However, I would still like to take you through the last few exercises so that you have completed the whole circuit. Is that okay with you?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Hi Kay.......lets go

So, what is the AE of ‘memory’? Is it not thoughts about thoughts? So other than pointing to the AE of thought, does the word/label ‘memory’ point to anything else other than more thought?

Absolutely.....there s nothing else going on in the thought maker beside thought no matter what its labled.......even the term thought maker is thought about thought.......

…now, what is reality like without stories…
Is there a body present?
Is there a room present?
Is there a phone or a computer present?
Are the sounds coming from people/things in the distance?
Did the past happen? Can the *idea* of a past even arise without a thought-story?

I looked and no body can be found or seen ....that we've really covered well....
There's colours and I see they ain t defined In areas like originally seen...kind of glowing and fuzzy...unstable...no story...lol
Until I pop up a story there's nothing to type on......lolol...
There's no distance....... sound is heard.... no story no distance...
I'm am where ever I am....always.....
I'm looking at how I pop up a story in order to communicate when colours are an other person speaking....or I can gaze and they vanish back to colors....like a story about acid trips....

So why do so many things seem to disappear when there are no thoughts about them?

Things are defined by thought....3 dimensions are a thought....a habit if you will......with out the story there are no things...undulating colour......thats all.....

Isn’t language and thought one and the same thing?
 

Yes the same thing with a story saying this is words.....

Okay, so I want you to think about what you are going to have for dinner TOMORROW night. When are those thoughts about “tomorrow” actually appearing?

There is no tomorrow,......its always now in ae.........thoughts come in handy finding the bathroom.....lololol....

What is the AE of morning, afternoon, night, today, tomorrow, next week, next year?
How is it known that there is a ‘today’ that will end and a ‘tomorrow’ begins?

Thoughts seem to have a habitual quality...no stories and time is gone......perception is changeable....according to where attention is directed.....were looking is directed............

Okay…now drop the whole story - go do something so that the sensations and thoughts are no longer prevalent and are forgotten. Then I want you to once again think of that same short story BUT this time I want you to LOOK very carefully to see if you can find an actual link that links the thought with the sensation to see if they actually go hand-in-hand.
Try this exercise several times. Let me know what you find.

Ok... right off I see the sensations aren't the same.......so there's not a hard link....like masturbating..its never the same twice....ill do this more as the day goes by.....not masturbating just doing what you pointed at...lolololol...this is a fucking blast.....thank you dear Kay...ill be back after observing this more closely.....bobu

[forgetmenot]

Hello Bobu,

I'm looking at how I pop up a story in order to communicate when colours are an other person speaking....or I can gaze and they vanish back to colors....like a story about acid trips....

How is it known that “another person speaking” is the verbalisation of thought? If you look with AE…what is the AE of ‘verbalised thought/words’?

So why do so many things seem to disappear when there are no thoughts about them?

Things are defined by thought....3 dimensions are a thought....a habit if you will......with out the story there are no things...undulating colour......thats all.....

Yes…nice! ‘Things’ ie colour ,sound, smell, taste, thought ,sensation arise and subside just as waves of the ocean arise and subside.

Ok... right off I see the sensations aren't the same.......so there's not a hard link....like masturbating..its never the same twice....ill do this more as the day goes by.....not masturbating just doing what you pointed at...lolololol...this is a fucking blast.....thank you dear Kay...ill be back after observing this more closely.....

Yes…let me know if there is a correlation between thought and sensation and let me know what points to there being a correlation.

Let’s take that even further. Do labels actually have a one-to-one correlation with reality:

When you look at the word label ‘GREEN’, what is the actual experience?
Is the colour red experienced, or is the colour green experienced as the label suggests?
Do the labels have a one-to-one correlation with ‘reality’?
Or do the labels suggest something else other than what is here and now (red colour)?
Is green-ness inherent attributes of the experience of the colour red, or is green just a word label on the experience of the colour red?

If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’, is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?
Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no effect whatsoever on ‘reality’?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Hi Kay.....

Yes…let me know if there is a correlation between thought and sensation and let me know what points to there being a correlation.

Look at thought and looking at sensation ..i see a thought can bring sensation to awareness but if it's done 2 times the sensation is not identical it changes.......just as sensation bring thoughts in awareness.....and I see how clusters of thoughts appear and disappear as do sensation that seem realatred...

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When you look at the word label ‘GREEN’, what is the actual experience? Is the colour red experienced, or is the colour green experienced as the label suggests? Do the labels have a one-to-one correlation with ‘reality’? Or do the labels suggest something else other than what is here and now (red colour)? Is green-ness inherent attributes of the experience of the colour red, or is green just a word label on the experience of the colour red?

No there's no greenness in red....

If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’, is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?
Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no effect whatsoever on ‘reality’?

No red is still red..and in AE the lable has no effect.....

Advertising comes to mind....where labels are applied to pictures that have zero to do with the lable...

Thank you so much for your guidence...Kay this relationship profits me in a big way...xoxo....bobu

[forgetmenot]

G’day Bobu,

Yes…let me know if there is a correlation between thought and sensation and let me know what points to there being a correlation.

Look at thought and looking at sensation ..i see a thought can bring sensation to awareness but if it's done 2 times the sensation is not identical it changes.......just as sensation bring thoughts in awareness.....and I see how clusters of thoughts appear and disappear as do sensation that seem realatred...

Great noticing to how sensations morph. If you sit with a sensation and just observe it...it morphs many times.


And how is it known that “a thought can bring a sensation to awareness” or that a “sensation brings thoughts in awareness”? Because a thought said so? That points to cause and effect which points to time, that one thing follows another. If thoughts didn’t exist at all, would you still not be aware of a sensation when it appeared, or when a smell appeared etc? Do you need thought to tell you that a thought has appeared? Isn’t that thought a thought that you are already aware of without a thought telling you to be aware of it?

So, once again bring to mind just a thought that seems to create ‘fear’… and allow the sensations to appear fully. Now replace the thought with “blahblahblah.” Look at experience, with thought only saying “blahblahblah.” Did the sensation disappear immediately when you replaced the ‘fearful’ thought with “blahblahblah”? If the thought evoked the sensation, then wouldn’t the sensation leave as soon as the thought was replaced? Did you need a thought to tell you that a sensation had appeared? Did the ‘blahblahblah’ thought tell you that a sensation had appeared?

This method is a good way to see what virtual layers thought has added to actual experience. If thought says: “I am hearing a sound,” replace the thought with “blahblahblah.” Look at experience, with thought only saying “blahblahblah.” Is there a person hearing, without the thought saying so? If no, then you know that the thought has added “virtual layers.” It’s fantasy, and it isn’t confirmed as actual experience, because what it was saying didn’t remain when the thought was replaced with “blahblahblah.




Thought says that the yellow, orange and green areas are you, and thought also calls these colours your body. Thought also says that the other colours are objects, and the light brown areas are animals that have their own consciousness.
Thought also says that there is something behind the door. How is it known that there is something behind the door?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Hi kay...i didn't get an email...i just checked and found your reply....im on it ..be back later...

[Bobu]

Hi Kay...im back....

thought also says that there is something behind the door. How is it known that there is something behind the door?

Ok I'll address what you wrote first......after a sensation comes up and I change the thought to bla bla bla...the sensation doesn't go away....it lingers...some times for quite awhile.......and I see how the thoughts add a virtual reality to expirience without doubt.....without thought sensation and hearing and seeing and tasting would continue....i hadn't successfully dumped thinking to notice this but I did see that no matter what I'm thinking I still smell and taste things...although there's a dilution in the AE due to the thoughts....yes this thought chain pulls time into the expirience....and as one thought streams to more thoughts there does seem to be cause and effect....with bla bla....the streaming ends......

Ok when the picture is looked at, thought arises to compile a story of what's going on here....the umbrella and blue spots bring a story of rain...the story says the dog wants to go out.....but nothing is known.....it appears to be...but thoughts don't know stuff they simply bring stories to awearness.......yes yes yes fantasy is what I see as reality......geeeeez...

I'm looking at this.....its really wierd....i live in the story...not in AE.....

Thanks Kay......wow......xoxo....bobu.....what to do?

[forgetmenot]

Hello Bobu,

Hi kay...i didn't get an email...i just checked and found your reply....im on it ..be back later...

Yes, I am not receiving emails either. The website was upgraded the other day and since then I have not been getting emails. I have asked the techies to check it out. I am checking the forum now, on a daily basis to check for responses.

Ok I'll address what you wrote first......after a sensation comes up and I change the thought to bla bla bla...the sensation doesn't go away....it lingers...some times for quite awhile.......and I see how the thoughts add a virtual reality to expirience without doubt.....without thought sensation and hearing and seeing and tasting would continue....i hadn't successfully dumped thinking to notice this but I did see that no matter what I'm thinking I still smell and taste things...although there's a dilution in the AE due to the thoughts....yes this thought chain pulls time into the expirience....and as one thought streams to more thoughts there does seem to be cause and effect....with bla bla....the streaming ends......

So, do thoughts create sensations and do sensations created thoughts or are the thoughts and the sensation just appearing ‘simultaneously’ and another thought says that they go hand-in-hand...that one caused the other?

thought also says that there is something behind the door. How is it known that there is something behind the door?

Ok when the picture is looked at, thought arises to compile a story of what's going on here....the umbrella and blue spots bring a story of rain...the story says the dog wants to go out.....but nothing is known.....it appears to be...but thoughts don't know stuff they simply bring stories to awearness.......yes yes yes fantasy is what I see as reality......geeeeez...

You didn’t answer the question. Can you answer it for me please…how is it known that there is something behind the door?

Where is this "I" that sees fantasy as reality? When you watch a movie, are you not aware of everything that is appearing/happening, but are you actually in the movie itself?

I'm looking at this.....its really wierd....i live in the story...not in AE.....

Really? Where exactly is this “I” that lives in a story? Describe this “I” to me in precise detail please.

If you lived in a story you would not be aware of the story. Is a movie character aware? Is a movie character aware of thought, sound, smell, taste, sensation, colour? Does a movie character know they are in a movie living a story? In a movie, people walk and talk and seem to be aware of their environment. but are characters in a movie aware of anything? Seeing as a movie character consists of nothing more than colours and sound, could that character even be said to exist? A movie character may say "I think this" or "I saw that", but do movie characters actually think and are they aware of anything?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Hi Kay. !

, do thoughts create sensations and do sensations created thoughts or are the thoughts and the sensation just appearing ‘simultaneously’ and another thought says that they go hand-in-hand...that one caused the other?

They come up and there s no hard connection I could point to and say ...there it is...they show up at the same moment or close to the same moment...its a thought that says they are connected....

You didn’t answer the question. Can you answer it for me please…how is it known that there is something behind the door?

It's not known at all. There's no door its a drawing.......

Where is this "I" that sees fantasy as reality? When you watch a movie, are you not aware of everything that is appearing/happening, but are you actually in the movie itself?

I can't find an i...there s thought that says it....no seperate thing that says it...just another thought.....no..... looking at the movie ...story...fantasy...whats looking is awareness...no matter what's being seen.......

really? Where exactly is this “I” that lives in a story? Describe this “I” to me in precise detail please.

describing what cant be found is rough...... looking doesent locate an I that can be describe...thought is there for sure....

Characters aren't conscious.... they just look that way....but are colors and sounds that thought tells a story about....

Later Kay....xoxo....this was cool....thank you bunches mate....bobu

[forgetmenot]

Hi Bobu,

Do thoughts create sensations and do sensations created thoughts or are the thoughts and the sensation just appearing ‘simultaneously’ and another thought says that they go hand-in-hand...that one caused the other?

They come up and there s no hard connection I could point to and say ...there it is...they show up at the same moment or close to the same moment...its a thought that says they are connected....

Yes! :) So this is good to see everytime a thought appears that SEEMS to create a sensation. Have a look to see if you can actually find a link between the thought and the sensation and look to see if you can find a body that is feeling the sensation.

It's not known at all. There's no door its a drawing.......

Sitting in your loungeroom now and there is a closed door…how is it known that there is something behind the door?

Where is this "I" that sees fantasy as reality? When you watch a movie, are you not aware of everything that is appearing/happening, but are you actually in the movie itself?

I can't find an i...there s thought that says it....no seperate thing that says it...just another thought.....no..... looking at the movie ...story...fantasy...whats looking is awareness...no matter what's being seen.......

Can you describe this 'awareness' that is looking? Is there a ‘seeing’ AND a ‘seen’? Is there a movie screen AND the movie?

A map shows how a country is seemingly divided into states and territories. Is the map made of those divisions? Or are those divisions simply the map being the map? The division are the map, but the map is not a division. Can you see this?

Look at this doodle. It looks like there are a lot of things…right?






Life seems to be a gigantic soup of experience that is grouped, categorised and labelled as things. There seems to be a ‘me’ that is ‘here’ that is experiencing things that are ‘out there’. And all those things ‘out there’ are all individual separate things.

None of it is separated except through thought because all of the images present are just one big canvas. Sounds overlap and intrude on each other, and there is a thought that says “I can separate bird song from car horns. Look! See? I've just named them!” But what is actually appearing is sound, with perhaps an image of a bird and an image of a car, and thoughts ABOUT sound appearing as a bird and car!

And thought appears saying “I can separate a cat from a book. See, I’ve just named them!” But what is actually appearing is colour and thoughts ABOUT colour appearing as shapes/images labelled ‘cat’ and ‘book’.

‘Things’ seemingly appear and there are never not things, but have a LOOK to see what is actually appearing.

What separates things? What makes up the borders? Can we pluck a thing out of the scenery in front of us? If not, is it truly separate or is it thought about variation in observed qualities which makes it so?

The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

Love, Kay
xx

[forgetmenot]

PS...do you remember doing this exercise?>

Do you have any choice, whatsoever, about what you're aware of?

If you think that you do, think about this:
If thoughts say, "I can change what I'm aware of by closing my eyes", and suddenly eyes seem to close, and you are aware of only colour black.

Did you REALLY have any choice about being aware of all of that?
Did you have any choice about being aware of the thoughts, or the apparent closing of eyes, or the colour black?
Could you have chosen not to have thoughts about closing eyes?
Could you have chosen for the colour to be green instead?
If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?
And if you can’t choose what you are aware of, is there a ‘doer’?

Love, Kay
xx

[Bobu]

Hi Kay....

Sitting in your loungeroom now and there is a closed door…how is it known that there is something behind the door?

A thought says there's something....nothing else...

Can you describe this 'awareness' that is looking? Is there a ‘seeing’ AND a ‘seen’? Is there a movie screen AND the movie?

A map shows how a country is seemingly divided into states and territories. Is the map made of those divisions? Or are those divisions simply the map being the map? The division are the map, but the map is not a division. Can you see this?

Yes I see this....

The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

It's one thing...screen and movie....