I sure would like to wake up, Hello.

[Sailor]

1. Really look at body actions during the day. When you are walking, is a you controlling every action? How much is done automatically, and what's done as a part of brain processing, and where the I thought comes in. How is a decision made. Look at that.

It seems everything the body does\is is automatic. "I" is not involved. Decisions are just a function of appropriate behaivor given the circumstances, Steming mostly from previous learned behaivor.

2. Do animals have little selfs controlling them?

No.

3. Awareness is. Do we need to cut it off from the rest and keep a small part inside our heads? What for? Can you feel it is separate from life if you don't think about separation

No.

[Moonlight]

So, what do you mean when you say "I'm just here." Where/what are you? Right now, from direct experience, tell me, where and what are you?

[Sailor]

So, what do you mean when you say "I'm just here." Where/what are you? Right now, from direct experience, tell me, where and what are you?

I am conciousness in a body "looking\experiancing". Focus is mainly visual. I am an experiance.
Where seems still to be in my head.

[Sailor]

Hi,
I was surfing the net and found this critics posting.
I am sensing that these kind of thoughts are standing in the way for me. I still want to continue
as I believe "No self" is either true or not, proven by tangible experiance.


"As for ‘Liberation Unleashed’, this is a persuasion cult. We will persuade you that you are awakened, and you will believe it. Job done. We will publish the dialogue. It will look like we have got results. We will not publish your subsequent confusion, rather we will immortalise your hypnotised gaze into the Void and imagine we have accomplished something. In time, it will start to seem lame and we will drift away, the dregs of yet another false alarm left around on the web to confuse newcomers."

[Sailor]

What led me to this site was this experiance is what is described in "The ten bulls" and Zen in the art of archery.
Also The Buddist Koans. One thought that is bothering is this a self delusion. This doubting is just like all of the other
ways to throw a monkey wrench into change. It's like my ego knows itself so well that any possible weakness is known and used to maintain its status. It feels very much fear based. It still seems to me that the experiance is the proof of the pudding and I don't want to act from a basis of fear. In fact one of the main motives I have in the first place is dropping fears(s) altogether.
So anyway now it looks like the fear is that in loosing "ME". "I'LL" die as well.

[Sailor]

Wow how did I miss that one? The sense of "ME, MIKE" is literally terrified of being murdered. "ME" has been perfectly camoflaged as "I AM", the real me, "THE ONE "who does in fact exist. When it's all just a thought.

[Sailor]

All is still here, in fact nothing has changed but seeing the "Mike" is really just a mental concept.
All else seems very normal. Have body, eyes, experiance but why label anything?
Acutally "MIKE" seems to still be lurking around. I recognize fears and tension wanting attention and reinforcement.
Mike is\was really afraid for it's life.

[Moonlight]

Brilliant, Mike.

Let the fear in. Let it close, welcome it. After all, all it's doing is it's job of protection. respect it for that. Now, dear Mike, look behind the fear. What/who is it trying to protect? Is there anything there?

Look deeply now, you're so close.

[Sailor]

Protection dosen't seem to be the fears motive. More like a bad occurence is conceptualized\imagined and then reacted to with fear based feelings. More a kind of panic than thoughtful. And the driving force\energy of it all is a belief that is all possible.
And all of it a mental construct. It seems the question is not who\what is it protecting, as it is who\what is having the experiancing. Will look and see.

[Sailor]

Who experiances fear?
Who becomes over run?
Who is powerless?
Its all a mind game.

[Moonlight]

Great investigating! Something to point out, if I haven't done earlier is, that the "sense" of a self remains. But we see that it doesn't point to anything real.

Could you please answer the following questions?

1. Can you please tell me if you exist, in any shape or form?

2. What is the self and what is its purpose?

Please write in detail, as much as you want.

[Sailor]

Can you tell me if you exist in any shape or form?

I do experiance thought, sights sound feeling emotions. At times it is very crowded with transitory "things" here. Things that come and go.Yet when i look for who is having experiance I only find a quiet awareness.
All the experiances, thoughts, feeling, concepts are just passing thru parading in front of an awareness.

What is the self and what is its purpose?

An owning of experiances thoughts feeling ect. To exist, to be.

[Sailor]

Do I exist in any way shape or form?

It seems that I can objectify any person place or thing except except "ME".

[Moonlight]

If mike is nothing but an illusionary construct made up of thoughts, then how can Mike be experiencing anything? Can a thought experience? Can a thought think?

I know you then go on to say that all you find is a quiet awareness. But which of the two is it?

Look, Mike. Is experiencing happening? Is "I am experiencing" another thought, or reality?

Please write in more detail.

Thanks and love!

[Sailor]

If mike is nothing but an illusionary construct made up of thoughts, then how can Mike be experiencing anything? Can a thought experience? Can a thought think?

No a thought does not think or experiance.

I know you then go on to say that all you find is a quiet awareness. But which of the two is it?

I seem to be going back and forth.

Look, Mike. Is experiencing happening? Is "I am experiencing" another thought, or reality?

Experiance is happening, "I" am experiancing just slips right in there quietly. Yes it does appear that " I am experiancing" is a thought and experiencing is, well, an experiance.
One is seen\experianced and the other is a mind\image thought. But then what is the difference?

Awareness is here and "I" effortlessly claim personal ownership by naming and labeling.
So then I do exist, as an experiance of experiance.
Thanks

Please write in more detail.

Thanks and love!