good place

[daisyrain]

1. Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?

The latter exercise seems just more "pure", wheres the I-sentences feel bloated and weighted down by redunancy.

2. What is here without labels?

How is it said without labels?
There is the seen, the heard.

3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?

(Is the "I am" prefix a label here?)
The "I am" label pushes something into the experience that seems unneccesarry and muddys it.

4. Did you notice any differences in the body?

Just reading the I-sentences made the body go tense. Relaxing occurred reading the other ones

[graceabounds]

Very good.

Bring up a thought about a character labeled "friend".
Then bring up a thought about a character labeled "stranger".
Compare these thoughts.
Is there a difference in these thoughts?
Is there a true difference or is it just different content?

Now, bring up a thought about a character labeled "friend".
After that, look at a thought about the character labeled "me”.
Is there a difference?
Is there anything special about thoughts with the content "me-character"?

[daisyrain]

I notice the body relaxing, thinking about a good friend.

And then there's a sensation of pressure throughout this experiment.
It's not quite a difference.
It seems like there is a body reaction, but its more that different parts of the body are highlighted / different body sensation become prominent.

Especially when thinking about "me" there is a lot going on throughout the jaw and chest area.


maybe it's more of a tension really.

[graceabounds]

What about these sensations says ‘me’?

What are the sensations trying to say? Ask, listen, and don’t turn to thought to answer. See if anything emerges… an image, a knowing, or nothing. Is there anything being protected by them in the chest or jaw area?

[daisyrain]

a great surge of energy or intensity came from the legs, later there was a feeling of "sinking". Following it lead to more sinking, thought thoughts clouded the experience to a degree I couldn't shut out.

[daisyrain]

Some days I'm hardly taking time for the exercises and I want to apologize for that and maybe say that openly.
Some days it seems like there are hardly any even just half hour spots left in the day after work, and usually those days I don't come back with great answers to this place.

[daisyrain]

There is a sincere effort to make room for practice every day, and carry practice into activity. I just felt it would be best to say this.

[daisyrain]

Ask, listen, and don’t turn to thought to answer. See if anything emerges

No real answer came, in a way there was nothing.
Still it's obvious there is something moving though the body, developing and changing.
Following it only the sound of breathing remained.

[daisyrain]

It's a bit beside what you have ordered me to do directly, but I'd like to communicate shifts in my life.
Last few days living in my head became unbearable. The question if I'm willing to live with what I don't know came back. There was acceptance.
Living the moment in experience seems like living without live, but it's also just a thought. I couldn't describe much going on right now without paradox.
Listening to the gap between thoughts happens more ongoing, it needs to be noticed, but it's preexisting.

[graceabounds]

Perfect. You’re reporting from direct experience, not about concepts, but about what is happening. Paradox is what you get when you try to put what’s happening into words. Let it be unresolved… :)

Listening to the gap between thoughts happens more ongoing, it needs to be noticed, but it's preexisting.

Good. Now, was the gap ever created, or was the effort to fill it with meaning, story, self, always added after?

Is it necessary to “know” anything to be present?

And, is there someone who needs to “make room for practice”?… is that even possible?

[daisyrain]

And, is there someone who needs to “make room for practice”?… is that even possible?

Thought: "I'm not there yet / not good enough at that yet; I can't answer it"

Wanted to write that down as it came immediately.

What am I without that thought?

"I don't have an answer to that"

What am I without that thought?

[daisyrain]

Now, was the gap ever created, or was the effort to fill it with meaning, story, self, always added after?

No, it's just noticed. It doesn't go with thoughts.
It's also like listening to the gap is not started, but it already happens, it's just noticed?

It's more like everything else is created. Some things I have words for that fit, like "structures".
Those things seem created.
When I try to tell you about what remains without thought, how do I tell you about that?

It seems like all created things are thoughts.
Who is creating them?
"I am creating them" thought. structure.
What is the creating?
huh....
many answers, no answer, cannot be answered

Is it necessary to “know” anything to be present?

thankfully not

[graceabounds]

When I try to tell you about what remains without thought, how do I tell you about that?

Who wants to tell? Look there…

What is communicated without any doing, any ownership?

[daisyrain]

Who wants to tell? Look there…

Watching (I) thoughts, as they arise.

"All I get is I thoughts" -> Warm fuzzy sensation, bit tension in that.

Inquiery is here.

[graceabounds]

Sit with eyes closed for about 15 minutes.

Paying attention only to the pure sensations, without relying on thoughts or mental images:
Can it be known how tall the body is?
Does the body have a weight or volume?
In the actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?

Is there a boundary between the body and the clothing?
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?
Is there an inside or an outside?
If there is an inside - the inside of what exactly?
If there is an outside - the outside of what exactly?

What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Look very carefully, especially with the last question.

Take your time, don’t rush. You can look several times during the day while doing other things (like washing hands, showering, having a short break from work, walking, etc) before replying.