Help!

[graceabounds]

What is present when you look at this now:

What are you looking for at LU?
Help in discovering why I'm creating constant life-threatening health issues without apparent cause especially every time I get closer to the truth of the current illusion. Maybe it's what's meant to be or so contrived from my higher self that I'm too unconscious to know truly what's going on. It's quite a challenge. It feels like my illusionary ego is fighting with the truth and will kill me before it lets me see the truth and wake up in fear it will lose control over my mind identification.

What remains of all this?

[Porky]

What is present when you look at this now:
What are you looking for at LU?
Help in discovering why I'm creating constant life-threatening health issues without apparent cause especially every time I get closer to the truth of the current illusion. Maybe it's what's meant to be or so contrived from my higher self that I'm too unconscious to know truly what's going on. It's quite a challenge. It feels like my illusionary ego is fighting with the truth and will kill me before it lets me see the truth and wake up in fear it will lose control over my mind identification.

What remains of all this?

Not sure what remains. Certainly, more attention to thoughts and senses. Not sure whether I can say with complete honesty that I experience NO Self at all times. I do have experiences of heightened awareness where mind identification has stopped, and I do experience the moment!
It's too soon to tell whether I've completed this "illness cycle". I'd like to say that conceptually that has occurred.
I do believe we have made some really good progress. I do see things from a different perspective. An example would be the experience of the watcher.
Thanks for your continued help!
Porky

[graceabounds]

Not sure whether I can say with complete honesty that I experience NO Self at all times

The only time to know is now. And now. And now.
Check the felt experience. Sensation. Thought. Sound. Image. Check again.
Is the self present in any form other than thought about a self?

Does ‘the watcher’ still feel applicable or is it just… watching? :)

[Porky]

The only time to know is now. And now. And now.
Check the felt experience. Sensation. Thought. Sound. Image. Check again.

What I do notice is my attention! It's been a challenge to stay in the NOW!
When I see my thoughts arising and catch them, I say to myself, clouds floating by!
My Mantra has been...Keep Looking...Stay in the moment.

Is the self-present in any form other than thought about a self?

No, the self is not apparent except in thoughts. When I look in the mirror, I dont know what is staring back at me!
Can't put a label on it!

Does ‘the watcher’ still feel applicable or is it just… watching? :)

The watcher is still there, but just like the self, its only there when I think about it!

[graceabounds]

So, if there’s no self except as thought, and even “the watcher” is only a thought:
Is there actually anyone here to stay in the moment, or fall out of it, or get lost, or awaken?
Or is there just THIS experience, unowned, unpossessed, never belonging to a self or watcher?

Where’s the line between “your” attention and just attention moving, changing, landing here and there?
Does attention belong to someone?
Who, precisely, is keeping themselves in the moment?

Stay with this…
What’s left? Is there anyone left to awaken? Or just THIS, empty of owner?

Keep checking. Report back from what is found, not what is known.

What’s it like to not reference a watcher, even for a second?
What happens when you stop supporting the watcher-idea?
What changes in the body, in sensation, in perception?

[Porky]

So, if there’s no self except as thought, and even “the watcher” is only a thought:
Is there actually anyone here to stay in the moment, or fall out of it, or get lost, or awaken?

So, what you're saying is nothing exists! And I too conceptually see an illusion. What am I seeing when I look at a tree or a fish? And who or what is seeing this?
I ask you this question because it feels like we are going around in circles. I've told you what's exactly going on with me multiple times and you come back with the same questions. Pushing to get me to agree experientially that there is no self.
I've told you time and time again that it's a work in progress. Bullying me to see something that my being has said I don't know what that is in the mirror or anything I see doesn't seem to satisfy you! I can only move as fast as my consciousness will allow.

Where’s the line between “your” attention and just attention moving, changing, landing here and there?

There is no line

Does attention belong to someone?

Attention is just attention, and doesn't belong to anyone

Who, precisely, is keeping themselves in the moment?

I don't know

Stay with this…
What’s left? Is there anyone left to awaken? Or just THIS, empty of owner?

Some of the time it appears to be just this with no owner

What’s it like to not reference a watcher, even for a second?

The difference is then there is no watcher

What happens when you stop supporting the watcher-idea?

Then there is no watcher.

What changes in the body, in sensation, in perception?

nothing

[graceabounds]

Not nothing exists, No One exists.

There is no one to satisfy, certainly not me…

[Porky]

Not nothing exists, No One exists.

There is no one to satisfy, certainly not me

…

That's GREAT that you are at the level where No One exists.
My experience continues to see people as human beings
occupying this space we call Earth. People coming from
Fear or Love, the only emotions.

[graceabounds]

Ok, so which of the two are you experiencing right now?

Could there be anger as well?

Where is this feeling present in direct experience in the body?

[Porky]

Ok, so which of the two are you experiencing right now?

At this moment there is only one emotion going on....LOVE

Could there be anger as well?

Repressed emotions of anger exists. Just not this moment.

Where is this feeling present in direct experience in the body?

In direct experience, anger can be felt in the stomach or the head.
Love emanates from the heart.

[graceabounds]

Ok. Bring attention to the exact area in/around the heart where love is felt. Without the word “love,” describe only sensation: temperature, edges, pressure, vibration, pulsing. When a label appears, ignore it and go subtler.

Does the sensation itself announce “love,” or is “love” a thought about it?

Do the same later with the stomach and head if/when anger appears.

[Porky]

Hi Becca,

Ok. Bring attention to the exact area in/around the heart where love is felt. Without the word “love,” describe only sensation: temperature, edges, pressure, vibration, pulsing. When a label appears, ignore it and go subtler.

When I feel loving, my heart feels warm and it's as if I can sense an energy, like a ray of sunshine or light emitting from that area of the body.
If its anger it always feels hot.
If I ignore the label and go subtler than the feelings disappear

Does the sensation itself announce “love,” or is “love” a thought about it?

Love appears as a sensation emanating from the heart. Yes, love is a thought

Do the same later with the stomach and head if/when anger appears.

Anger is also a thought with sensations emanating from the head or stomach.

FYI.... I am leaving tonight for a weeklong vacation. I do not know what my access will be to the internet or my emails.
Please understand it may take me longer to respond. Thank You,
Porky

[graceabounds]

Great.

If I ignore the label and go subtler than the feelings disappear

Good. Exactly. So now go slower. And even subtler…

Bring attention again to the exact center of sensation in the heart. Don’t name it or think about it, Just stay there.
Is there temperature?
Is there movement?
Is there shape?
Is there any boundary?
Or is there just… space?

Now go even finer. What is it before the warmth?
What is it before even “energy”?
Can you detect the moment thought labels it?

And when the sensation vanishes or becomes unfindable again, continue to stay right there…
That vanishing… what is that?
Is it emptiness? Numbness? Stillness?

Or is that where the story ends and you think something is missing?

That “nothing” is not a void or like some kind of absence. It’s just not a thing. You’re encountering the end of the map.

Does there need to be a sensation in the heart at all for presence to be what it is?

Do the sensations prove anything about you? Or are they just flickers arising in a story-less space?

What happens to the feeling of a self when you are locked into pure sensation like this?


Enjoy your trip, and thanks for the heads up.
:)

[Porky]

Hi Becca,

Bring attention again to the exact center of sensation in the heart. Don’t name it or think about it, Just stay there.
Is there temperature?
Is there movement?
Is there shape?
Is there any boundary?
Or is there just… space?

Physically I can sense my heart beating. Subtly, it's as if there is no heart there. Then if I think about it the heart begins to emanate light.
No Temperatures, no movement, no boundary. I can imagine only space where my heart should be.

Now go even finer. What is it before the warmth?
What is it before even “energy”?
Can you detect the moment thought labels it?

There is nothing before the warmth.
There is nothing before energy, just emptiness
Yes, I can detect the moment thought labels it.

And when the sensation vanishes or becomes unfindable again, continue to stay right there…
That vanishing… what is that?

I don't know what that vanishing is, just a sensation of emptiness

Is it emptiness? Numbness? Stillness?

That emptiness is both numbness and stillness

Or is that where the story ends and you think something is missing?

No I don't feel like something is missing, because if I think about it the sensations returns.

Does there need to be a sensation in the heart at all for presence to be what it is?

No.

Do the sensations prove anything about you? Or are they just flickers arising in a story-less space?

The sensations don't prove anything. Actually, my ego is working hard to attach itself to those flickering moments instead of realizing it's just a story. It's easy to periodically experience no thoughts, but to stay in that space remains challenging.

What happens to the feeling of a self when you are locked into pure sensation like this?

When I'm locked into pure sensation in the moment that's all there is! There is no feeling of self at that time.

FYI... Sorry it took this long to get back to you, I had no access to reply to your questions,

Thanks for your understanding. Porky

[graceabounds]

Very good looking.

When you’re fully with the heart’s sensation, without label or story, the self vanishes. :)

Actually, my ego is working hard to attach itself to those flickering moments instead of realizing it's just a story. It's easy to periodically experience no thoughts, but to stay in that space remains challenging.

This is very good. The key here is in that gap, in the noticing of the attachment after the fact. The aim here is not to eliminate thought, that is not possible, but to see it is all story. All of it. A story of I.

What is actually here, before the “I” forms to have an experience? Where’s the center of all this?

Stay totally with the “space” where the heart seemed to be. Don’t wait for any special state, just keep noticing the moment the sense of self creeps back in.
Who is it that notices?
Look right in that gap… is there any real experiencer, or just experience?

Does the “you” who wants to stay in that space exist in any form except as a thought or tension?

Does it even make sense to say “there is no self”?

Or is there just… whatever is, before anything gets named, labeled or said about it?