The Gate

Not bored at all, Marcus.

That's great. I was a Course in Miracles student for 25 years. One of the best things in it says this world was created when we forgot to laugh.

So.

Looking at your very clear responses to the Cup Exercise, obviously, the point is that "self" is just like that cup.

Go back through the questions, thinking of "self." All you *can* do is think about it, since there's nothing there for any of the 5 senses to perceive!

Loving,

Yes I got it

I can´t grasp the "self" unless I use thought.

In this case there is no mental image of a "self", just a subtle sensation as I said a couple of messages before.

And for sure at the light of real look (as you said) there isn´t an experience of a "self" whatsoever


I would say when the mind stops there is no "self", BUT even when thoughts are happening they can´t confirm there is a "self" once you see they are just thoughts, right?


I just wonder how this can be so simple.

All true.

It IS simple. Enjoy the mystery of it!

So. it sounds like "subtle" means it is only in thinking. It is made up. It is only stories = subtle.

Can you find an inherent self anywhere, outside of thought?

Can thought experience thought? Can thought experience anything? (Thought is so very overrated - by thought)

For a moment take note of exactly what is being experienced in this moment:

Notice all sound, all sensation, all smell, all taste, all colour.

Notice how you're making absolutely no efffort to be aware of them.

And notice that you're not making them happen.
​You're not conducting the orchestra of experience that you're aware of.

​And notice that thought is exactly the same as the rest of experience. ​You're effortlessly aware of it, but you're not orchestrating it. You're not even orchestrating the yhoughts which say that you're able to orchestrate thoughts.

What is noticed?

Loving,

Hi Stacy,

Can you find an inherent self anywhere, outside of thought?

Nope.

Can thought experience thought? Can thought experience anything? (Thought is so very overrated - by thought)

Never "thought" about that but..no, thought can´t experience anything, it just define and classify things
Think I begin to understand the difference between thought and real experience

What is noticed?

Yes,just is. When you really look it´s like the experience become kind of raw, pure.

Good morning!

it´s like the experience become kind of raw, pure.

Yes, exactly!

How does it FEEL to SEE this Actual Direct Experience without the overlay of fictitious stories?

Here's another way to look at Actual Experience:

Nature Exercise

Go out into nature and spend some time watching the movement of the whole. See how clouds move, trees swing, leaves wiggle, grass moves, insects, birds - all move all the time.

(If you live in a city. you can practice there, too.)

Then move focus to sensations and see how they too are in constant motion, thoughts come and go, sounds, colours, sensations come and go.

Notice that everything is part of one movement.

Then close your eyes and see if there is a line between you and out there, between you and life itself. If yes, where is the boundary?

Is there an inside and an outside of "Life?"

Is there something which is not included in the movement of the whole?

Is there a witness that is watching life happening from a distance?

Is witnessing part of the one movement, too?

Is there anything which is not just happening?

Go out, come back and tell me what you found.


Loving,

How does it FEEL to SEE this Actual Direct Experience without the overlay of fictitious stories?

To be honest feels like a weight is taken away from my shoulders, it´s more soft and peaceful with no thought interpretations actually.


I´ll do the exercises and reply tomorrow morning ok?


See u.

Stacy,

Could I reply this exercise for you on monday?


Please let me know

Hi

I suppose. I do find it odd that you put off replying to the pointers in a lot of your replies.

What's up?

Much love,

What's up?

Nothing, the weekend is been very busy and I´d like to do the exercise with more time but I can do now

If yes, where is the boundary?

Is there an inside and an outside of "Life?"

Is there something which is not included in the movement of the whole?

Is there a witness that is watching life happening from a distance?

Is witnessing part of the one movement, too?

Is there anything which is not just happening?

Go out, come back and tell me what you found.

No, there is no boundary.

Actually without the thought interpretation, there is no separation, no inside and outside.

Everything is included, there is no witness.

Everything is happening in a more soft and peaceful way withoug the thought interference, as I said before.


That´s what I found.

Sounds good. I'm not clear what you needed more time for. Thanks.

You seem to see that there's no self or are you just thinking it?

Can you say that it is clear that there is no self, never has been? Is this your direct experience?

If so, what is left to seek?

I would prefer to see one quoted question, then an answer, another quoted question, then an answer.

I read these on my cell phone & that makes it much easier. That will be required when & if you answer the traditional "final questions," out of courtesy to other guides who will read that.

Loving,

You seem to see that there's no self or are you just thinking it?

All the exercises you ask me to do helped me to see that there is no self. How can we Know for sure?

Can you say that it is clear that there is no self, never has been? Is this your direct experience?

I'm Not sure if I can affirm this is my experience 100% of the time. I think these exercises is a way to see this, I feel that if I keep looking and relying on DE is the way.

If so, what is left to seek?

Nothing to seek, I feel that just keep real looking without effort or that energy of something is missing.

Hu,

Are you saying it feels like something us still missing? It may take time to relax into seeing no self more of the time. Sometimes years.

No self is just a beginning. Next we tend to rearrange our lives in a way that's more consistent with what we now see. That can take a while.

You asked

how can we know?

We have some traditional "final questions." Let me know when you're ready to try those.



Loving,

Are you saying it feels like something us still missing?

I feel the less you seek (like something is missing) more you relax in the Direct Experience.

No self is just a beginning. Next we tend to rearrange our lives in a way that's more consistent with what we now see. That can take a while.

Can you talk a little bit about that, how that happened in your own experience. If this is allowed, of course.

Let me know when you're ready to try those.

Send me the "final questions".

Hi,

how that happened in your own experience. If this is allowed, of course.

Sure. Of course, your changes will be completely yours & different. The risk here us that you'll expect yours to look like mine.

I saw in April 2007 via a different set of pointers at a weekend workshop. For the next several years, I moved several times, drove several different cars, mostly loaned or given to me.i worked temp jobs & failed several times to set up my own business.

Each time I moved, for example, I knew it felt true to do so. But nothing was stable for about 7 years. There were further adjustments. I'm not even sure things are settled now, although I'm now married & have a job that supports me to volunteer here. Through all the changes, there is clarity & a sense of following what's true.

So. Let's see how this goes. It may show things that need clarification.

Here are the questions:

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) Describe decision & give examples from experience.

Describe intention & give examples from experience.

Describe free will & give examples from experience.

Describe choice & give examples from experience.

Describe control & give examples from experience.

What makes things happen? How does it work?

What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?


Loving,

The risk here us that you'll expect yours to look like mine

Don´t worry about that.

Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

Maybe this would sound very basic but: thought says there is a self. When I look through the exercise, actually when I look in my own experience, without the filter of thought, there is no self at all.

Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

I feel that starts from childhood, is something you learn, a kind of way to operate in the world that you are taught to.
It feels like something you don´t need to force to happen, it feels like is a program already installed on you.

How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

It´s kind of weird at the beginning cause is something you are not used to even question, this sense of self. One thing I found interesting is the fact that is so simple to look and how quick is to see the fact that there is no self

What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look

I´m not sure, I think the example you gave about santa claus and with the self is similar, just a thought you are taught and believed. The fact that you was fooled by a lie.

Describe decision & give examples from experience.

Well, I see that decision happen naturally and the thought is the only thing that proclaim autorship of that. the same happens for free will, choice and control.

What makes things happen? How does it work?

Again, when you are not relying on thought, you just see things happening, experiences, sounds, images even thoughts arising.

What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

If I rely on what "my mind say" I feel responsible and the things are heavier. There is a kind of softness and peacefulness when you rely on DE. That´s what I feel and see from my own experience.

Anything to add

I don´t feel I have to FIGHT this idea of no self cause it doesn´t exist anyway. It´s just an idea, born from thought, right? I feel that what I need to do is to see the self for what it is, that it´s not real, it´s something created, a kind of persona. When you see self for what it is, it´s lose power over you, so to speak.

For example, if you are looking for a job and the interviewer asks: who are you?
You don´t answer: Hey, I´m pure consciousness, there is no boundaries lol. You answer is: I´m Marcus, I have this background experience etc. In some way you use this persona to function in the world.

At some point of our conversation you said some quote from a friend of yours that I agree 100%. Something like:

There is no self but if you cross the street in front of a bus you die lol.

I also believe in this balance and our conversations helped me to reinforce this.

In resume, don´t take your(self) too seriously.