The Gate

Hi Nuss

I'm absolutely not rushing you but thought I'd check in with you anyway. How is it going?

Sometimes it really takes some time to explore these things properly. But also it can be a temptation to think about things a lot, as if the mind must find answers. Never feel that you shouldn't communicate until you have something important to say. I know you're being thorough and that it takes as long as it takes but feel free to write more often, if that would help?

Jon

Hey Jon,

I'm so sorry it took a while for me to get back to you. Usually it is because I'm very thorough with your questions, however this time it was simply due to how busy work was this past week (or perhaps how much I "allowed" it to be). We are at the beginning of a new school year where I teach and there was much "to be done" after each school day was over. Early mornings, late nights, and meals crammed into windows of planning and preparing. This weekend I have been able to take some time to sit with the questions you asked. I will try and send more frequent responses, even if I don't feel I have anything important to say, as you mentioned in your most recent message.

Intellectual understanding and identification with the idea "I don't exist" or "there's no me" can be a roadblock to "seeing" no self as an actuality. Does this make sense?

Yes it does. It sounds very familiar. It sounds like something I was/am experiencing, most definitely early in our conversation.

"What is it that is getting caught up / messed up?"

"What is it that has things to do?"

Notice what it's like to ask these variations.

I gave some time to these questions Friday night and this morning. After taking a few moments to relax and tune in, I felt into them. Both times they were both followed with a feeling of "emptiness" or "nothingness". What is it that has things to do? Nothing, no one.

Other than that, the habit of inquisitiveness has led to a frequent observance of how the self/illusion of self asserts itself, which is quite often!

Thank you for your patience!

With gratitude,
Nuss

Hi Nuss

. Early mornings, late nights, and meals crammed into windows of planning and preparing. This weekend I have been able to take some time to sit with the questions you asked. I will try and send more frequent responses, even if I don't feel I have anything important to say, as you mentioned in your most recent message.

I know just how much is expected from teachers. It's very hard work. Yes, the start of the school year! Quite demanding.

Don't be under any kind of pressure. We will take as long as it takes. Feel free to post whenever you like. More frequent responses sometimes help a kind of flow to develop that can help the inquiry but equally, you need some time to explore the questions and I completely understand about how busy you have been. Things have been hectic here too for the past month.

Just an idea but have you ever tried noticing the flow of thoughts, how one thought seems to occupy attention at a time? Then follows another, and others after that? Each thought seems to vanish as it is replaced by the next.

See if it is possible to notice any kind of space or gap where the current thought has waned but the next one hasn't yet appeared? If that seems possible remain aware of the space or gap . What happens?

Love

Jon

Hello Jon,

I very much appreciate your understanding.

Just an idea but have you ever tried noticing the flow of thoughts, how one thought seems to occupy attention at a time? Then follows another, and others after that? Each thought seems to vanish as it is replaced by the next.

See if it is possible to notice any kind of space or gap where the current thought has waned but the next one hasn't yet appeared? If that seems possible remain aware of the space or gap . What happens?

I will spend more time observing this question, however here is what was noticed after sitting with it for a little bit this evening:

A thought would be going in the mind. Then "awareness of the thought" happened, followed by various "I" thoughts such as:

• I like/don't like this idea

• I got lost again

• I should be meditating/focusing

• the next thing "I" will do is

• I am going to "stop thinking" about this

Of course these are also considered thoughts I guess? Perhaps there is a gap before this.

I'll share more developments as they come.

Thank you,
Nuss

Hello Nuss,

. A thought would be going in the mind. Then "awareness of the thought" happened, followed by various "I" thoughts such as:
I like/don't like this idea
I got lost again
I should be meditating/focusing
the next thing "I" will do is
I am going to "stop thinking" about this

It can be interesting to see if there is even a tiny gap between the end of one thought and the appearance of the next.

But this shouldn't become a matter of someone needing to focus very hard or 'perfectly' . (That attempt can be a strain and can be counterproductive).

It's interesting that you've written down the contents of several thoughts that did appear. It's almost as if there's someone commentating.


Love

Jon

Hello Jon,

It's interesting that you've written down the contents of several thoughts that did appear. It's almost as if there's someone commentating.

Yes, absolutely. There are often commentating thoughts happening. This is also a place where the illusion of "I" is held. Constantly evaluating, planning, thinking, assessing, correcting, etc.

It can be interesting to see if there is even a tiny gap between the end of one thought and the appearance of the next.

But this shouldn't become a matter of someone needing to focus very hard or 'perfectly' . (That attempt can be a strain and can be counterproductive).

Still sitting with this one. A formal "sit down" on this question did not happen this weekend. I'm hoping for this on either Monday or Tuesday.

Talk to you soon,
Nuss

Hi Nuss.

. There are often commentating thoughts happening.

Yes

. This is also a place where the illusion of "I" is held. Constantly evaluating, planning, thinking, assessing, correcting, etc.

Well, Is it actually a place situated in space, as such? It's worth exploring where thoughts are going on.. For example, imagine a famous politicians face. Now become aware of "where" that face is situated? Is it in the head? , Is it outside the head? If it is located in space, where, exactly, is it? Is there any limit to the size of that face?


Ok it will be interesting to find out how it goes with noticing any gap between thoughts.

Love

Jon

Hello Jon,

See if it is possible to notice any kind of space or gap where the current thought has waned but the next one hasn't yet appeared? If that seems possible remain aware of the space or gap . What happens?

The only other thing I have noticed has been...nothing? There will be a gap between the thought and thoughts which arise about that thought (ones mentioned in my previous post) where it seems there is nothing. Perhaps it is some type of sensory experience-sound, sight, sensation, etc in that moment, solidifying the end of the thought. Often times these gaps are very brief as the judgmental thoughts about the previous thought are quick to arise.

Well, Is it actually a place situated in space, as such? It's worth exploring where thoughts are going on.. For example, imagine a famous politicians face. Now become aware of "where" that face is situated? Is it in the head? , Is it outside the head? If it is located in space, where, exactly, is it? Is there any limit to the size of that face?

No, it is not located in a space. Spatially it feels as if thoughts are coming from "inside my head." The "voice inside my head" is something that rings a bell. When imagining someone's face (or anything visual), the initial response would be "in my head." However, when picturing the image, my attention is temporarily taken off of what is seen through my eyes. Similarly to if my eyes were on the road while driving, then looked down at my phone to read a message, then back on the road again. If I had to pinpoint a "location" of the image, it would probably be in front of the eyes I suppose.

Take care,
Nuss

Hello Nuss

. No, it is not located in a space. Spatially it feels as if thoughts are coming from "inside my head."

If this is a feeling how is it felt? Take a look at it

. The "voice inside my head" is something that rings a bell.

If it is said that a voice is inside your head, how does it ring a bell?

If "ring a bell" is a metaphor, what is meant? What process is being described?

When imagining someone's face (or anything visual), the initial response would be "in my head." However, when picturing the image, my attention is temporarily taken off of what is seen through my eyes

Yes. Thanks for doing the exercise. Attention is taken off what is seen. Imagining Spiderman swinging between buildings..is that a visual impression that is located inside a head ?

If not, where is it happening?

Is anything seen "through" eyes, as if these were portholes?

Or is the actual experience of seeing very direct, without awareness of "eyes" at all

With love

Jon

Hello Nuss

How are you?

I'm wondering if there's anything I asked that is causing confusion or difficulty in replying?

I do understand that you like to take the inquiry seriously and sometimes don't feel that you have much to say or report and I understand that your work is also demanding of time and attention.

But those aside, tell me if there's something that I've asked or raised that doesn't compute at all or is even unwelcome?

Remember, I'm here to try to help and in a friendly sort of way. I'm absolutely not here at the other end judging you. But I can only be of use if I have something to go on.

Let me know if the inquiry frustrates or bores you or creates doubts or anxiety? . Any of these could stand in the way of anyone's enthusiasm and are part of the sometimes messy business of self-inquiry, before things become quite clear. And clarity is much much closer than is often assumed.

Love

Jon

Hello Jon,

My apologies, last week was another incredibly busy week/weekend. It felt as if I was floating around from one whirlpool to the next. It was another time where "I" felt "caught up," similar to a time in the Summer where I mentioned feeling the self asserting itself and not noticing things for their true nature. Going back to sit with: "what is it that is getting caught up?" It's hard to let go of the agenda/duties of what be done by "me."

If it is said that a voice is inside your head, how does it ring a bell?
If "ring a bell" is a metaphor, what is meant? What process is being described?

What is meant by this is really just a thought triggering another thought. Nothing is actually "heard," just thoughts about sounds that have been heard/thought of in the past. A thought triggers another, which trigger previous/familiar thought streams.

Thoughts commenting on various things have established a sense of "I," however these thoughts have no definite space, location, or individuality. They are transient and cannot be controlled. I will dig deeper into who/what is evaluating, commenting on, and judging what is occurring.

Attention is taken off what is seen. Imagining Spiderman swinging between buildings..is that a visual impression that is located inside a head ?
If not, where is it happening?
Is anything seen "through" eyes, as if these were portholes?
Or is the actual experience of seeing very direct, without awareness of "eyes" at all

The location of these visualizations cannot be pinpointed. Eyes are not needed for these visualizations-they can happen with eyes opened or closed. Seeing does not require awareness of eyes. Seeing happens, and what is seen is what is seen. It is also important to note that when these visualizing thoughts happen (and are strong enough), it creates a lack of awareness of what is seen.

Any of these could stand in the way of anyone's enthusiasm and are part of the sometimes messy business of self-inquiry, before things become quite clear. And clarity is much much closer than is often assumed.

There is an increasing anxiety, wondering of when the self will be "seen through." You told be to try to drop the thoughts/intentions of "getting rid of the self" as opposed to simply realizing that it was never there to begin with, however when anxious thoughts arise, they carry a drive to "get rid of the self." This is also amplified by the difference in time available to live life more slowly, to sit on the cushion and go for walks, allowing for self inquiry and inquisitiveness to arise. Perhaps there is too much emotional investment in the outcome? For example, more interest in the final outcome or "end-goal" as opposed to seeking truth, to see things the way that they are.

This does perhaps provide an opportunity to see further into the illusion of self due to the increase in anxious feelings, as if they are exposing other areas of self-identification.

This has been said before, but I continue to thank you for your patience and persistence, Jon!

Talk to you soon,
Nuss

Hi Nuss

. This has been said before, but I continue to thank you for your patience and persistence, Jon!

Well, I really appreciate that. Thank you very much.

Thanks for your various clarifications about seeing and visualising. Let's now focus on the last parts of your reply:

. There is an increasing anxiety, wondering of when the self will be "seen through." You told be to try to drop the thoughts/intentions of "getting rid of the self" as opposed to simply realizing that it was never there to begin with, however when anxious thoughts arise, they carry a drive to "get rid of the self." This is also amplified by the difference in time available to live life more slowly, to sit on the cushion and go for walks, allowing for self inquiry and inquisitiveness to arise.

Strange as it may seem it is good to notice this anxiety, which you have recognised in any case.

I can suggest another thing to try. Rather than reasoning that there never was a self, try relaxing a little and then asking the question "could I allow anxious thoughts (about self) to just be, without trying to change them?".

If the answer is "no" then don't worry but go on to ask "could this anxiety be dropped or released"? See what happens.

If the answer to letting anxious feelings just be is "yes" then also move to the next question, which is, could it simply be released?Allowed to drop or fall away? If it's a "yes" then ask if the anxiety would like to drop away or relax right now? Wait to see if there is a relaxation.

It doesn't matter if this doesn't seem to work at first. It's possible to run through the sequence of questions several times over a period of days. Always start with asking if the feeling could be accepted right now, just as it is, without needing to change it and move on to the further questions about allowing the anxiety to fall away..

See how this goes and let know?

With love

Jon

Hello Nuss

Here is an amendment to the wording of the exercise suggested. (Wording sometimes needs to be precise)..

Where I suggested that you start by asking:

"could I allow anxious thoughts (about self) to just be, without trying to change them?".

That does imply a "self" , simply by the wording.

Ask instead:

"Could anxious thoughts be allowed; accepted as appearing? Could they just be?"

In all other respects the exercise is the same.


Love

Jon

Hello Nuss

Here is an amendment to the wording of the exercise suggested. (Wording sometimes needs to be precise)..

Where I suggested that you start by asking:

"could I allow anxious thoughts (about self) to just be, without trying to change them?".

That does imply a "self" , simply by the wording.

Ask instead:

"Could anxious thoughts be allowed; accepted as appearing? Could they just be?"

In all other respects the exercise is the same.


Love

Jon

Hey Jon,

I wanted to check in about the questions you sent.

Could anxious thoughts be allowed; accepted as appearing? Could they just be?

If the answer to letting anxious feelings just be is "yes" then also move to the next question, which is, could it simply be released? Allowed to drop or fall away? If it's a "yes" then ask if the anxiety would like to drop away or relax right now? Wait to see if there is a relaxation.

It was difficult to sit with the anxious thoughts instead of trying to "act on them." However, this approach is seeming to be helpful. It will be useful to apply this concept to other areas in my life where anxiety sets in, particularly when it comes to "getting things done." For example, this weekend was the first weekend since the beginning of September where I had no teaching events to attend. I had a completely free weekend. Although it was relaxing, there was this underlying stress to "accomplish things."

I am starting to sit with the anxiety and allow it to be as it is. It has not necessarily dropped or relaxed as of yet, but I will continue to sit with it and report back again soon.

With gratitude,
Nuss