Awakent

[Abner]

Hi, Ve
So, I sat for 1/2 hr. and it became obvious to me,
for the first time, that all thoughts come
automatically...without a me "doing" them.
Thats good but
this brings up a whole new "can of worms".
Why do these thoughts seem to be about me?
Some attacking, some not attacking. Many constant repeats...some for many years, concerning things that relate to me and upset me about my history, or a song
that I heard on UTUBE yesterday, that keeps repeating in my head. What is that about?
If these thoughts come from the unknown
why arent they about unknown things like:
what do hamburgers taste like on Mars?
Things that dont concern me.or just nonsenceicle
thoughts.
Why are they repeatitive thoughts about me?
Thoughts that I can relate to.
Be well...Ab

[Verananda]

Hi Abner,

thanks,

so first please answer all the questions from the exercise (and in general) one by one.
Can you do that for the exercise?
It helps me to get focused on what is seen and what needs some more clarity .....

And ... how is it when this whole journey is not about getting new answers and wisdom but loosing all answers that thought to be true? How does it feel to just don't know?


Love Ve

[Abner]

Hi, Ve
I have no idea where thoughts are comming
from.
I dont do anything to make a particular thought
or thoughts appear.
I cant do anything to make a thought appear at any particular moment.
I can not predict my next thought.
I can not select from a range of thoughts
there is no range and the thoughts come
randomly.
I can not choose my thoughts, thus I cant
prevent: fearful, painful, or negative thoughts.
I cant choose any thought, let alone any kind
of thought.
I cant prevent a thought from appearing.
Good night...sleep well...Ab

[Verananda]

Hi Abner

great,

first: good night :-)

I have some more hours to work, living in europe!

Here is one exercise for your next "normal" meditation session:

You wrote some earlier:

I believe that in meditation I can clear my mind and stop thinking.

Please look deeply into what is happening.
Can you find whatever decides to clear mind and stop thinking?
Who or what decides?
Who or what controlles?
What happens when mediation ends?
Who decides it is finished?
Who invites thoughts to come back?

Tell me what you find!

Love Ve

[Abner]

Hi, Ve
I love Europe. I lived in Amsterdam, for about a year. I have been to most countries in Europe.
Back to business:

I want to be honest, so I will tell you how I feel about meditation, knowing it is not what you feel or how you see things or how I would like to see things
It "appears" to me that (in meditation only) there is an I that decides and controls the clogging
of the mechanism, by focusing on my breathn
thereby blocking thoughts from entering.
When meditation ends...the thoughts come rushing in. I dont know who decides when its finished...I know its just random thoughts.
No one invites thoughts to come back.
They just come back by themselves.

I just want to tell you that, aside from thoughts,
walking, talking, keeping appointments, instructing, etc. ..I feel like the doer.
I know (intellectualy) that walking happens.
talking happens...but I still fell like the doer.
Just want you to know where Im at
Be well...Ab

[Verananda]

ok, one question for my clarification:
are you practicing meditation regulary
or was it just a hypothesis what you wrote about meditation and clearing the mind?

[Abner]

I dont meditate as a religion...its an on and off thing for me. Sometimes I mediate..but not
always.

[Verananda]

... and it is your experience that you can clear your mind and stop thinking in meditation?

[Abner]

For short periods..yes. I focus on
inhailing & exhailing.

[Abner]

At least I feel that is what I am doing.

[Verananda]

It "appears" to me that (in meditation only) there is an I that decides and controls

ok, so then next time when you do meditation,
LOOK for this I
realy do it, don't think about it or tell me what you belief
I'm interested in your fresh and new experience:

What exactly is the experience of this "I"?

Love Ve

[Abner]

OK...but its not a hypothesis!

[Abner]

Hi, Ve
I find that when I meditate
( both now & last night ) the I thought has some
thoughts. They include the thought that
" I have no thoughts", "inhale in & exhale out" and some other random
thoughts...but the thoughts "appear" to have
greatly slowed down. It now appears that I
have "quieted" the mind. The thoughts are not
comming in rapid fire. Only a few seem to get in.
When you see a good movie, all thoughts involve the movie. You dont appear to have attack thoughts or for that matter any thoughts about yourself.
Be well...Ab

[Abner]

Just to clear things up. I suggest that meditation and watching a good movie, have something in common.

[Abner]

Just to clear things up. I suggest that meditation and watching a good movie, have something in common.