Ending the constant searching

[Trinidiana]

HI Vince,

Thank you for the beautiful writing from Joan today, I only recently heard of her actually and it was really lovely but , before I get to some comments and thoughts I had, can I rant a bit?

I had a bad couple days, life partly, but just a feeling of downness, is that even a word downness, I don’t think so, frumpiness, irritation and such, lots of little things going wrong etc. Body issues, financial issues, all kinds of issues. My mind. Its so easy to get lost in the content of thoughts on a day to day basis.

So , I wanted to comment on some of the things in your blog, before we continue because I feel it may give you some insight into where my head(?) is at… my feelings and such!


Sooooooo……..I READ YOUR WHOLE BLOG! Even though I know you didn’t ask or even intend me to..


A lot of things when I mention them shortly, you probably might not even remember writing I am guessing!


But….. So going right back to your first post, you were aware of being able to observe the world from a perspective of objective perception you call it.


Me too, and just like you, seeking beckons !

I don’t get any physical sensations really except for a gnawing and nagging, I don’t even know where the feeling is in my body you said yours was in sternum , anyway I don’t think its important since everyone is different , but I related to the nagging and gnawing, no I presently relate to the nagging and gnawing!

You certainly understood as I do, that the mind is not the tool for the job , that it keeps you distracted

Although later on, after ’seeing”, I must say that there is a remarkable consistency in to what you say then and what you say now in terms of explaining conditioning and stories and truth and meaning and the like, but at this point, early on, much was different . You ‘believe’ things , like i do, but felt you hadn’t seen them.

You also said you were practicing total acceptance with ‘awareness of the acceptance and any habitual residual emotional reactions’.

Now, I KNOW that you would tell me, (since you actually have lol), no, don’t DO anything, just recognize when it happens. So at that point you identified somewhat with awareness and the real you, actually Joan talked a lot about that today in the writing you sent me, and this is what so many people get caught up in it seems, me including!

Your words I quote: “ I can understand this as a concept. Acceptance and belief are also present.
I also understand that my understanding and acceptance and belief are my minds trickery.
The understanding comes from realising
How to realise ? Knowing that it is beyond doing.
Take a step back!
How? Mentally? ( lol )”


My recognition exactly at this stage. THE DOING THAT CANT BE DONE Exactly ! I grok it, so why I am caught?

Also you write “ Omnipresent, omniscience, omnipotent – no problems, it fit's in with my desire to believe in magic.”

So, yes this is how I think I started in our conversation, identifying somewhere in ‘my mind’ with ‘consciousness’ and my ‘true self’.

When you spoke in September 2010 of your ‘current understanding’ , it was like I could have written it. And even when you realise it is all mental ha ha , as I do, it’s like, wow that me!
One huge difference is my moods, they have been pretty dark and dismal, unhappy, sad etc. You seem to have more humor. (Although if you met me as a stranger say, which now you aren’t obviously, you would think I am very happy and friendly person, and I do actually have a great sense of humor!) Just a little side story there.

You mentioned it and Ha ha “I grok the resistance that seeking is too” SEEKING IS RESISTANCE!


INSIGHT FOR ME: When you asked “WHO is (in this case impatient) “ and then said the obvious answer is

Your words: “This concept my mind calls me that occupies so much of my attention that I can only think about Seeing.
When I look for the I (that can only think about Seeing) I (that looks) only finds thoughts with an identity called I. So obviously I am still identified with an I of fictional nature.

What hit me is that you said you can only THINK ABOUT seeing, damn thats me , I think for tonight’s post, this is THE most important pointer, so much of my attention occupies this trying to ‘see’ but in reality, it is only thinking about seeing a lot of the time, mental constructs, trying to figure it out.



BY THE WAY, side note: Your haikus from even back in the earlier posts are very wise, very on point, wisdom filled , like here where you wrote :

“Impatience is rife
Why won't the covers depart
they're off, you fool. Look”


Moving along now still mentioning what resonates with me deeply. Vince, I hope I am not frustrating you by going through and randomly commenting and giving you my insights and resonances (ha ha I know I didn’t use that word properly there lol), but …. hey hey, you did send me to your blog, and I feel there are so so many similarities between you and me in this process (although clearly you can find humor more than me and seemed to have betters spirits for the most part lol)


Now Im reading…. Your grandsons birthday. Yes a portal, maybe this is why people are so entranced by babies, its not that they are ‘pure ‘as everyone says , its because they have no ‘I’ as you say. I see this a lot in animals too.

Anyway, your words:,

“Seeing him without a sense of i is certainly a portal.
Oh, how i yearn for the fresh view of the world each moment brings to him....
Certainly his innocence seems like home to me. How sad that the whole world doesn't operate from such a place. “


SEE VINCE, THATS SOOO EXACLY HOW I FEEL, LIKE SO SPOT ON FOR ME!

Anyway, it seems like at the end of September, something started to shift in you, your thoughts slowed down, these words were beautiful indeed ..

‘The subtlety of the space between thoughts...
the fragility of the mindless place...
the narrowness of the portal to emptiness...
the fullness of the heart welcoming...
the inclusion of the gathering in of vital energy...
the collection of the focus of calmness...

the letting of 'what is' just be...

abide in peacefulness.’



So another line that resonated is this one ‘Emptiness can never be emptied of emptiness, nor can it be filled by emptiness. With that concept cancelled out, only the wordless thoughtless indescribable emptiness remains. Sailor Bob’

Reminded me of the shanti mantra which I love:
“Om poornamadah poornamidam poornaat poornamudachyate, Poornasya poornamaadaaya poornamevaavashishṣyate”
which translates loosely into That is complete, This is complete, From the completeness comes the completeness, If completeness is taken away from completeness, Only completeness remains

Except I know it as ‘fullness’, instead of ‘completeness’ which is the opposite of emptiness and there we go into these paradoxical concepts again, so beautiful.



And, then, on September 23rd, (my brother’s birthday coincidentally), you speak about not being realised, but… that you are no longer seeking. AHA Vince, you had shifted, you just didn’t know it, maybe…

You said,

“there are no more questions i need to ask.
Now it's just the interesting game of continuing to do what is in front of me while noticing the old habits of emotional reaction as they arise.
i am content to reside in the 'now' of events.
i may or may not get 'cooked' but it is out of my control. I am willing, i am hopeful, i am accepting of whatever eventuates. If nothing changes from where i currently am, then life is still very good.


So seeking dropped or was starting to drop, this is where maybe maybe maybe just maybe I am starting to get close to. But not yet. Its amazing how the answer is DO NOTHING. JUST STOP. This last quote of yours is where I feel I need to be.


You say and another resonance for me: “ Am i so preoccupied with 'the quest' that i miss the point of living in the now ?”

I see this ALL the time in me, avoidance of little things, sometimes simple things, like just now while writing this and getting frustrated with my 13 year old son who wanted me to go and see the lights he had put up for Christmas outside and I wanted to finish this, and the I realized that this is the opposite of living in the now and enjoying the moment so I did go with him and the moon was beautiful and the lights were beautiful and the weather was wonderful . What the hell, am I so seeking that I miss the wonder-fullness of life and my son and all the things that are so fleeting and beautiful?

And to end , for tonight, in your last September post, you said that even though your seeking had stopped, that you realised that desiring still continues but seeking through concepts had stopped, in other words, you were no longer looking for a new way to achieve ‘liberation’.

Yes I think maybe in that sense for me too, DESIRE is burning but I am not looking for liberation in any other way than this.



So Vince, In writing all this, I realise that I should stop after September, because this shouldn’t get too ridiculously long (which it already is) because other people are reading too and i have to be respectful of that. I realise I haven’t in this post even reached where you shifted and ‘crashed the gate’ so to speak, and maybe this is not the direction you want me to continue, but reading the blog , well, it is helping me so much in listening to what you went through, it IS a portal I think. So it is cathartic for me. But I should stop now. Once I do this for a couple more days I will comment on the post you sent me today , and if you have comments from what I sent tonight I will answer those first.

So if this direction Ok with you, can we continue like this , lol, am I the strangest person you have ever guided , hee hee?

Well sleep tight, or actually have a good morning and day.

Love Diana

[Trinidiana]

This is the mantra I love

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pdYvTxEcdo


The Upanishad says, "Purnam adah: that origin of all things is full; purnam idam: this entire creation that has come from that origin of all things is also full; purnat purnam udachyate: from that Full this Full has come; purnasya purnam adaya: having taken away this Full from that Full; purnam evavasisyate: the Full still remains unaffected."

Full moon is Purnnima , the moon was so beautiful tonight , and soon will be full, how amazing is it that you will view the same full moon as I do here, different time zones and different far off places on this Earth, but it unites us. yes I know its all stories and we cant really know this, but for right now, its a beautiful uniting story !

Good night!

[vinceschubert]

Tears of joy here Diana, if you re-read what you wrote, perhaps you will see what i do, and that is a shift. love love love

Oh, and don't be concerned that when seeking ends, that there will be something missing.

[Trinidiana]

Friday night, actually early Saturday morning:

Hi Vince and sorry i missed yesterday,

Your words to me were very touching, that there were tears of joy on your part very moving, also my insecurity immediately coming out that i don’t want to let you down and they are undeserved to some degree, i reread and not sure of the shift except for maybe a little more acceptance of the current moment, maybe?

This has been quite the week, some days better than others, yesterday was a more upbeat day ,i went for a long walk , felt connected, maybe it was your post that inspired me, i have noticed for several years the ups and downs from day to day, with no apparent rhyme or reason, been accepting them for the most part..

Today busy again , and i admit to getting very caught up in todays news , not sure how much you follow american politics, but big news on this end.

And even though i can see myself getting caught up in it, i still did and felt and feel the injustice of all that is going on, how do you deal with these types of things? Vince, all stories but ones that are actual ! Imagine in a tax bill that they are passing tonight no doubt in the dead of night without a single hearing or level anyone reading it, there is a clause which will allow drilling to be opened up to the Artic wildlife , I️ cannot help that these things get my blood boiling, i know they’re all stories VInce, but they affect this planet and humanity. And obviously my identity i guess or else i wouldn’t feel outrage, but I do..

Anyway, a few more things i wanted to comment on from your blog: this is October now..

your words 'The doing is happening, the seeing of the doing is happening, the believing (that it is me) is happening, the wanting to be witnessing this from Oneness is happening. '

I feel this too

Also your words:

'i must still have a 'story' or belief running to experience this limited perception...
Part of that story is no doubt "i must still have a 'story' or belief running..."
Another part of that story is that i don't want to have a story running.
i can see most of the story, which is also part of the story.'

I feel this too! Damn, this is exactly how i feel VInce, you said it so much better than i could. BIG TIME RESONANCE HERE!

And continuing.... 'The story doesn't need killing, it doesn't even need seeing. 
Just allowing it with a full appreciation of this everlasting NOW... , except part of the story is that i keep forgetting that and keep getting sucked back into the content of thinking. At least that is how it has been in the past (my memory thoughts)'

So , yes, I️ relate because I keep getting sucked back into the content of thinking, like today, and the million and one things on my mind, and i think that when i notice a story, i feel like i should resist it because it is a story and not real yet as you say here, it is part of the now. But i keep forgetting!

Another thing that hit me is this one, it was part of a quote you wrote from someone called Annette Nibley:

'But let it unfold in its own time. You can’t force the disintegration of belief in the person. It all starts with the inquiry – am I really this person? The recognition that you are not a person is slight at first, and then cascades by reinforcement through your experience.
Pretty soon the recognition is greater, but still experienced as a conceptual understanding that you are not a person. But before long, there is nothing left to have an experience – you’ve stopped feeding it, and it died'

I think this is what you have been telling me, that this process can’t be forced and the more i recognize little glimpses of this, it will eventually be like a snowball effect, hopefully this is happening at some level. I think so.

I actually have been asking myself things when it pops up, like not forced, just appears, so i guess it’s not really me asking, just the inquiry happening, like is there a me or I, a doer etc, and, though it can’t be found, the sense of existence with a me flair is strong, one part of me almost cries out in defense, that there are so many things i cannot see or understand that are real?! magnetism, air,molecules etc, I️ could look and not see yet they are real, couldn’t it somehow be the age with the self, that it’s an invisible essence that can’t be found (I’m just being a devils advocate here ) ,so the conceptual understanding is there , yet there are doubts. One thing that keeps coming up for me is trust, just simply to trust life...

Finally,
I can see in your later October posts how you basically started to surrender, to do nothing, to accept what IS , to give up the search, not by trying, but just organically and naturally. At least that’s my story of your story lol


OK, it’s very late, will continue tomorrow!

thanks VInce for your patience and love with me
Diana

[vinceschubert]

Good evening Diana, it's probably better that i don't comment on what is happening for you at the moment. (you are getting to a critical point)
Ha, i can't help it...

a little more acceptance of the current moment,

it's really nice that you put it in a positive way. What i saw was a lessening of resistance. (and a greater flow of gratitude for life-ing)
..anyway, keep reading and commenting. my heart is reaching out to you.

love

vince

[Trinidiana]

Hi Vince,
Happy Sunday,
Just wanted to let you know that i am halfway through a post to you but had to delay for a bit as i had to drive to Tallahassee (4 hour drive) today for my son's college orientation tomorrow, so i will post as soon as i possibly can!
thank you so much for your sweet well wishes and wonderful energy you send my way, i am missing you comments though :(
Take care
Love
Diana

[Trinidiana]

Hi Vince, ok i really should go to sleep, its 100 am
I forgot to tell you of a little synchronicity , when you sent the post by Joan, i started to rack my brain to remind myself o f a non dual teacher , a lady, middle aged that i thought was so wonderful and i used to listen to her a year ago and for the life of me it was a blank ! So i said to myself, well , it will come to me if it’s supposed to and i let it go.

Well in your blog you quoted her and it hit me , that’s WH i was trying to remember Jan Frazier, so it came thr9ugh you !

Anyway, i just went onto her websit and look at her latest blog post how beautiful and fitting


https://janfrazierteachings.com/the-dis ... #more-8289

[vinceschubert]

Hi Diana, Yes, that was a wonderful read. (i love reading stuff that i agree with) It is a great summary of being awake.
Waiting for you're finished post..

love

vince

[vinceschubert]

Where are you Diana. Let's keep the momentum going...

love

v

[Trinidiana]

I know VInce, sorry , you WILL HEAR from me later , i am concerned about momentum too, i was just away for the last couple days , settling back today and this is on my list of important things to do!
Take care
Diana

[Trinidiana]

Ok VInce this is me tonight ,Wednesday 7 december , I️ was going to continue where i left off, which is below what i am writing now, I️ was going to continue, but felt at this moment it wouldn’t be genuine. So , i don’t know, it’s almost VInce like, I️ feel any progress i have made has just gone out of the the door in the last few days, and, I️ realise that saying this is a story and also that what i am complaining about which i won’t get into, suffice it to say that the last few days have been frustrating, and i know that’s a story too... so that’s where i am at, i was in a black mood today, it was another one of those everything could have gone wrong days, anyway! I could go on but i won’t, but i realise that the thoughts of all these stories and such take me over, I️ wish i could say otherwise VInce, but it’s the truth! The I , me , is trapped in the story, even when i can see so much and recognize things in myself and others, it’s like, i am still soooooo trapped!



This is where I️ had got to before , for what it’s worth... i think it’s rather negative .. and you’re so rooting for me, which i love, so i feel disappointed in myself sending you this tonight, but i pledged not to let the night go thorough without sending you something, so here it is...

This next part i wrote before.....

So , In reading your blog, You say you felt you were on the outside of the gateless gate. Hmmm, not sure if i feel that at all, I️ don’t know where I️ am at, not that it matters ,but i don’t!

And you knew that a shift in understanding had happened, I️ liked the title of one of your posts 'i haven’t been asleep but i haven’t woken up either'

My insight - has a shift occurred or is it all in my mental seeing? Is resistance less? Is it?

Something of this body/mind yes to life, but there’s a lot of no’s i feel there too!

But then, I️ think maybe this is ok too, as it is put in this beautiful quote you put up by someone called Peter Majason :

“You must either accept your acceptance
Or lack of acceptance
Or
Accept your non-acceptance of your
Acceptance or lack of acceptance
Or not."

EXACTLY

One thing that i noticed happens more, and you touch upon it in your post ...


'Mostly i come here with no idea',

is that in day to day life , with some things, just like you say, i have no idea what will appear, for example, the typing, if i have a phone conversation, going with the flow and noticing how it all works out, events during the day etc.

So even though it’s not with everything and there is still anxiety, i am amazed at the process of 'non planning ' .

You said that you had resonated with reading that emotions are the physical components of thoughts, i feel that too. I also think of it almost as a separation between feeling, which is just the raw reaction to something , a thought and then the emotion is the part when the I captures it.

For example, say i see something that is upsetting, the thought will naturally give rise to a feeling of maybe dismay, fear, grief, sadness, fill in the blank, that’s real, but then when the story of i and trying to explain it and on and on happens that gives rise to the emotions which lodge in the body and lead to so much more. So maybe the feelings are not a problem , they just are, but the emotions are in the sense that they cause suffering and stories!n

I know this is 'old' now but I️ had written it so leaving it....So how can i apply this to waking up this morning to knowing what happened in the Senate last night, the selling of souls and principals for money going on in the American government right now, that will affect generations. The idea that in a TAX bill you could even have a clause to allow drilling of the precious Artic with all its beautiful wildlife.

Ok, so this happened, its actual, ( well at least in this dream world it is ), so my thoughts on it produce a feeling, of dismay and dread and anger.

Can i just stop there, and not go into the seething and gnawing and story possibilities that my mind wants to take me and on and on?

Can i have less resistance, it is what is, it’s happened, can i trust there’s a bigger picture, i think there’s a bigger picture. I just don’t know it. Can i stay calm?

Moving along with your blog, you felt a definite shift , subtle but definite and you said it was a shift in thinking/feeling.

You say 'i have lived with the belief that those enlightened beings definitely know that it has happened for them.
i don't know'

Ok VInce, these were your words, I️ could have written this too, i feel like i don’t know and i should. Not that i expect a sonic boom

At this point of time, there is definitely not a slowing down of thoughts .i recognize them more as thoughts but no slowing down yet, almost a speeding up .

Sometimes i love and accept the ordinariness , many times there is resistance, i know this is key.

You say 'So how could i ever again believe I is more than a concept ? Still, there is a sense of possessiveness present.'

Yes me too.

So, one thing that i realise in reading you and so many others, is the relaxing aspect. I recognize the importance. I am Not relaxaed no matter what thoughts arise, they catch me, a lot.

How do i unclench my fist?

So, on November 14th, when you speak about your current situation, i realise that you are saying exactly what Joan was saying in that writing you sent to me and also what Tony Parsons and all the other non dual teachers say...... nothing exciting, just beautiful ordinariness.

A continual awareness that VInce was all made up and that THIS meaning what is happening NOW is all there is. Sounds, sights, feelings, not so much thoughts on the future or past since they are not needed. Stillness... your life had certainly shifted. Very beautiful, everything just Happens and being lost in the doing just happens too. Just being reactive. Responding to present circumstances as they occur.

Love this haiku
'Happiness just is,
when I don't chase it away.
Oh how wonder-full'

So speaking of the relaxation, you quote someone who says


"...Or is it best to entirely relax all semblance of control, and let life live you?"

But you can’t do relaxing because then it wouldn’t be relaxing would it?

And you say that it can’t be any other way than letting life live you, whether relaxed or uptight. But that relaxed or uptight has an effect on how life lives you. And then you rightly ask, which is so relevant for me right now, since choice is an illusion how can relaxation predominate over stress.

Sorry to end it like this VInce, back to Wednesday and i am sorry this is so disjointed, but i am uptight and as you say this has an effect on now life lives me big time. I wish it weren’t so but it is

Sorry that maybe progress seems to have stalled, sure this wasn’t the list you were expecting from me tonight.

Lots of love, and thanks always for your time which i never take for granted
Diana

[vinceschubert]

Good evening Diana, Sooo good to hear from you.
After reading your post, i just want to give you a long quiet hug.


Everything is as it should be (my story)
The trapped-ness, the black mood, the disappointment, They're all good.
They are part of a movement.
Waking up is more about removing layers than finding something new. Many of those layers peel away with the emergence of negative stuff.

I️ feel any progress i have made has just gone out of the the door in the last few days

This is a little bit tricky, so don't try to understand it (yet), but this (awakening thing) is not a progressive thing.
Oh, and what you have seen (realized - made real) cannot be unseen.
Sure, the 'old' can come along and overwhelm it for a while, but what has been seen will take the lead at some point.

the last few days have been frustrating, and i know that’s a story too...

No, the frustration isn't a story. It is real, palpable emotion. Stress.
Certainly the cause of it was story. (Shoulds and What ifs)
Here is one that i have learned. Opinion. The moment you have an opinion, you are being judgemental. This is always the start of suffering.
So recognizing that an opinion is coming on, is a trigger to celebrate.

Is resistance less?

Resistance ebbs and wanes. ..but the wanes ebb less and less, and the ebbs are often new (old) stuff coming up. i saw a wane before, now i see an ebb.

i pledged not to let the night go thorough without sending you something,

Good..

i am amazed at the process of 'non planning ' .

Ha, yes. This is a big one. It is the delusion that control exists, that encourages the mind to think that planning is necessary.
Planning does happen when it is necessary, but planning to plan is definitely not necessary. Life manages (life-ing happens) very well without our interference.

knowing what happened in the Senate last night,

Yes, i know. i had the thought yesterday that our government is like kids at kindergarten. (primitive was the word i used) ..and just as we see kids doing stupid things that put them in harms way, as much as we want to help them, we are unable to do anything but watch (or turn away)
At this point, it helps to focus on our breathing and become aware of the sensation being experienced.

so my thoughts on it produce a feeling, of dismay and dread and anger.

Breathe deeply and feel the compassion. (they know not what they do)

Can i stay calm?

Don't repress. It's ok to be angry. ..if that happens. (then realizing the pointlessness of it and the damage it does to you might happen too)

i feel like i don’t know and i should.

Oh, it was ok for me not the know, but you should ?

.i recognize them more as thoughts but no slowing down yet, almost a speeding up .

You are still invested in them. Be patient. Oh, and stop looking for signs of progress. Just focus on what is NOW.

How do i unclench my fist?

You don't. IT starts with being aware the it is clenched. Then with the recognition that is it clenched, you laugh. Celebrate the recognition. Then you become aware how the laugh changed what you were feeling in the body. ..at this point your fist is an open palm facing the sky.

So, on November 14th,

Could you see from my writings the exact moment of waking up ? (it had happened by this date)

Sorry to end it like this VInce, back to Wednesday and i am sorry this is so disjointed,

Stop with the sorry. i have loved talking to you again.


love and hugs

vince

[Trinidiana]

Hi Vince, its so very good to hear from you too, and thank you for your hug in thought form, virtual hugs can be quite effective too when the intention behind them is real lol!

Hmmm, that got me to thinking , thoughts can have content that are really powerful can they not? (At the end of this all i really want to discuss intentions with you. )….I’m in a much better mood today, perhaps it’s the effect of your hug. Did you see the full moon the other night, i thought of you in Australia seeing the moon though it would obviously have not been at the same time as here, hee hee!

Continuing with my thinking of thoughts and stories, whilst much of the stories of thoughts are garbage and useless and cause suffering and some are just silly, some are boring , some can be fun and playful and harmless and some , like your hug, can be powerful! Do you agree?

So I’m sitting here on my little deck, it’s a gloomy coolish day for Florida , taking in the sights, noticing nature. Story steps in , ‘would be nice to have some rain wouldn’t it, so dry, plants and trees and animals will be happy’, so this is a pretty harmless non suffering kind of story I would say.

Next, sensations arise, I Feel very achy and had a bad nights sleep, much tension in neck and aches and pains, super tired, soooo....a story could go like this, ‘Jeez, why all these aches and pains, I’m not THAT old, must be ‘my’ adrenal fatigue setting in, and inflammation, will this lead to something more, why is this happening for so long’, and on and on i could spin it, so, I think this story is a pretty useless and dreary and anxiety filled one . I catch it, yay celebrate, )still haven’t got the laughing thing down packed) And the story is gone until it returns.

Here’s another example, this one i think is a fun one, comes from pure playful curiosity . You may like it, we humans like stories. So, noticing has happened that all the wild turkeys around here are acting very strange, well the males are to be more precise. The other day i was driving in my yard and stopped to take a pic because there were twenty turkeys gathered on my lawn, i and immediately two big males strutted up to the car and poked their heads in the window, strange i thought. The day before , my mum had said she had seen on the news that turkeys are being aggressive to people. Not sure where it was the news said , I didn’t take it on, but then the thought popped in my mind as those turkeys stuck their head in my car, i wonder if they are being aggressive. So i tell my son about this, and he tells me that yes apparently people have been taking pics and talking about it because the turkeys keep coming up to cars and people. And sure enough, i am driving a couple days later and i see them and stop the car and sure enough the males strut up. Also i was taking a walk and two started to follow me and sped up so i sped up . Then the girl who comes to clean for me once a week said they were aggressive to her. And yesterday they chased me and my younger son, we laughed and ran inside. FASCINATING indeed. So while walking later, i see this lady that i know loves animals and she even feeds the turkeys and ask her ‘what’s up with the turkeys?’, we joke and come up with the story that they must be pissed about thanksgiving, enough is enough , killing all their people lol. She says that in twenty nine years she has been living in this neighborhood and never ever have the turkeys done this and that one yesterday actually chased her and jumped on her leg. And she says, it gets more intriguing, apparently turkeys everywhere , well at least New York she says have been aggressive. Strange behavior.

So, I hope my turkey story has not bored you, here are some more stories that came to mind about their behaviour besides them being pissed about thanksgiving, it’s a mating thing, though usually they don’t mate in fall, but if the males are fluffing up their feathers and hanging out with the girls, what else could it be, but still, why aggressive, don’t think they are aggressive in spring. Maybe the whole thing is because of weather patterns and climate change, the lady told me that when it was cooler years ago, after thanksgiving you didn’t even see turkeys till spring, now they are everywhere. So maybe it’s the weather, but then, what about New York? So maybe it’s urbanization and they’re getting cocky, ha i know the real story, it must be Donald Trump, everything has gone haywire since the orange monster became POTUS, the worse hurricanes, the worse fires, hell so obviously even the turkeys have picked up on his bullying nasty vibes and they are changing into crazy aggressive turkeys!! Ha ha humor is good, so why have i gone on about this, maybe because i am trying to say that I am more aware of the stories and some can be just fun and natural curiosity which is still a story ( i think i will do me a little research on the turkey phenomena when have time) .

Ok, back to being a little more serious and to our inquiry together, the point is still that the stories we tell ourselves, even if none are true, do affect our lives, don’t they? Some do anyway and some can be powerful .

Everything is as it should be (my story)
The trapped-ness, the black mood, the disappointment, They're all good.
They are part of a movement.
Waking up is more about removing layers than finding something new. Many of those layers peel away with the emergence of negative stuff.

I do think so (my story too] your’e right about the removal of layers, i totally get that, makes me think of Shrek when donkey was talking about onions and layers , hee hee, apparently i am in a funny mood this morning, thats a better story than black mood, no, no better just is what it is TODAYm so if it’s black mood that’s ok too. Feel a softening. And thats what you’re telling me here.

This is a little bit tricky, so don't try to understand it (yet), but this (awakening thing) is not a progressive thing.
Oh, and what you have seen (realized - made real) cannot be unseen.
Sure, the 'old' can come along and overwhelm it for a while, but what has been seen will take the lead at some point.

Actually, I️ do understand this, even when i wrote it, i knew it wasn’t about progress and anything linear, just didn’t know how else to express it, i totally get it’s not progressive, yet we still need momentum in our conversation. Paradox again, and that’s cool.

No, the frustration isn't a story. It is real, palpable emotion. Stress.
Certainly the cause of it was story. (Shoulds and What ifs)
Here is one that i have learned. Opinion. The moment you have an opinion, you are being judgemental. This is always the start of suffering.
So recognizing that an opinion is coming on, is a trigger to celebrate

Yes i know that too about the feeling, the feelings and emotions are real, the rest stories. It’s in the noticing of them that they might tend to stop before they become stories, right? And not that I should TRY to, but just simply notice, and if it happens, then CELEBRATE. ) i think i am really getting your celebration pointer. It’s kinda brilliant! )

About the opinion thing, Lord then most of us humans would end up shutting up totally if we could stitch off opinions, just kidding, but so much of mind is opinions, judgements. We do it all the time, most pointless, but what about discernment and appreciation of beauty, I’m thinking you would say of course discernment which involves a judgement is useful, like not walking down a lonely road at night alone, and appreciation of beauty is not really an opinion, its a feeling, or is it, one persons beauty is another's ugliness, know that tilts the correct quote but you get what i mean, “I remember now “Beauty is in the eye of the beholder”

So, opinions are the start of stories which lead to suffering. Another trigger to celebrate upon recognition.

Resistance ebbs and wanes. ..but the wanes ebb less and less, and the ebbs are often new (old) stuff coming up. i saw a wane before, now i see an ebb.

I love this . Reminds me somewhat of something I guess I once read, that you could be on a downward spiral but still going up , if the overall direction is up, within one spiral there will be a time when you’re up an another you’re down. The wave you mention I like this too, each wane and ebb has both right, I dont think I am explaining this well at all, lol, anyway, so I think today I am more on a wane again. Life really is all ups and downs and surfing it does help, just accepting and riding them. Thinking of these wave like motions, life is never going to flatline is it? It’s always motion !

Don't repress. It's ok to be angry. ..if that happens. (then realizing the pointlessness of it and the damage it does to you might happen too)

Yes , breathing always helps, and reminding myself that anger over things I cannot control does me no good, your’e so right!

You are still invested in them. Be patient. Oh, and stop looking for signs of progress. Just focus on what is NOW.

Its true, I obviously am still invested in them….

You don't. IT starts with being aware the it is clenched. Then with the recognition that is it clenched, you laugh. Celebrate the recognition. Then you become aware how the laugh changed what you were feeling in the body. ..at this point your fist is an open palm facing the sky.

Another beautiful classic Vince wisdom. I love it, I know its true that theres nothing I can “do”, I know the seeking is useless and what is seeking will never find anything , yet it(seeking) is still there strongly, so taking your advice, for now, all I can do is just to recognize it, thats all that can be done. Then relaxing will naturally happen, in its own time.

Could you see from my writings the exact moment of waking up ? (it had happened by this date)

I think that there was no one exact moment for you, that it was gradual, an uncovering of layers too. The ‘process’ if one call call it that started years back with the seeking, the active seeking. Then, just like where I am now, you realise that the scratching is keeping your trapped, can you stop the itching , can you stop the scratching.

I ask myself this too, and this I feel too when you say “How hard is it to accept that what i am IS what i am seeking, once i no longer seek?”

Then you say (October 27th), “Oh, i see, without the seeking i am what i now seek to be...
The itch will vanish when i stop scratching it…”

I feel this was the unfolding for you, the beginning of stopping the scratching. So this day was important.

Yes, I think so, because then you write the very next day (October 28th), that you had an epiphany and it was that , (and these are my words not yours), that you realised that what you were searching for you already had, the only difference was your state of mind, you were not content because you kept searching for something else, instead of fully accepting the present.

Then the next day after you talked to someone called Eric what hit you was ‘trust’, trusting the process and relying less on mind and analytics, just recognizing without analyzing. Which is what you are tying to guide me to do . TRUSTING LIFE!



Although later on you naturally had doubts and such (there are those ebbs and wanes again), you said on that day you were breathing deeper and more relaxed.

You ask “Has a point been reached,
where the ride to awareness
has reached no return ?”

I think it was for you, these three days . So, It seems like you were cooked by the end of October, however, its a never ending process, ONIONS, LAyERS, RIGHT? EBBS AND FLOWS< WAXES AD WANES!!!

I love your beautifully worded November 1st post .

You recognize that something has happened you and say so , and say Ego is starting to purr. I love that so much Vince, I hope my roaring ego has started to purr too. I think it has Vince, somewhat. Purring is softer than roaring, less tense.

And I will end with this from your post because I want it to be be a reminder and a pointer for myself NOW.

“There is no need to DO anything.
Understanding and willingness to be open, earnestness, is all that is required.
We are mainly allowing habit to die.
Intention is the motive force.”

And you know what is cool, what you realized then is the EXACT advice you’re giving me now after all thee years, you are pretty unwavering on this.

Thank you Vince from the bottom of my heart.
Love Diana

[vinceschubert]

Good evening Diana,

And you know what is cool, what you realized then is the EXACT advice you’re giving me now

What is even cooler, is that i have no formula or plan when i guide. i simply respond to what you write. It is all spontaneous.

thoughts can have content that are really powerful can they not?

Yes. Absolutely.
To put it into context, what is there besides thought, or actually the response to thoughts ?

some can be fun and playful and harmless and some , like your hug, can be powerful! Do you agree?

Yes. Does this mean that we need to discriminate between different kind of thoughts ?

so this is a pretty harmless non suffering kind of story I would say.

The story has no power. It is just words. Some people might get pretty depressed with such a story.
You, being aware that it is a story, are not automatically sucked into it's content.

And the story is gone until it returns.

Good stuff. If it returns, it may be heralding that there is usefulness in it. Being relaxed about it, opens possibilities.

apparently turkeys everywhere , well at least New York she says have been aggressive. Strange behavior.

Strange (unusual) behavior, is a description. Aggressive is a story. An interpretation.
It may not be aggressiveness, it may be curiosity. i don't know, but can you see how aggression is overlaid (on the behavior) by the observer ?

I hope my turkey story has not bored you,

Ha, no. It presented an opportunity.

the point is still that the stories we tell ourselves, even if none are true, do affect our lives, don’t they?

"True" is irrelevant. Our lives (experiencing) are (almost) totally the result of stories.

Feel a softening.

Beautiful. The softening begets malleability and flexibility.

but so much of mind is opinions, judgements.

Yes, but it's not about not having opinions. (you can no more do that than not have thoughts) It is about noticing them and finding humor when they happen.

but what about discernment and appreciation of beauty,

They are opinions too, but with a positive outcome. Although it might also be considered that there is a flipside to this. If the opinion is about lack of beauty...
Is it possible to find the beauty in ugliness ?

appreciation of beauty is not really an opinion,

Oh, ok. You're right. Appreciation is not opinion, but what is beautiful is.

life is never going to flatline is it? It’s always motion !

Absolutely. Impermanence is the one characteristic that seems common to everything.

all I can do is just to recognize it, thats all that can be done. Then relaxing will naturally happen, in its own time.

Yes. (lovely)

I think that there was no one exact moment for you,

Yes, and i think that is likely for you too.

I hope my roaring ego has started to purr too. I think it has

i think it has too. Although that doesn't mean that a roar won't happen.


..a haiku for you.
Now that you see that
Intention is the motive force,
Pleasantly relax.

love

vince

[Trinidiana]

What is even cooler, is that i have no formula or plan when i guide. i simply respond to what you write. It is all spontaneous

I agree, it is so amazing isn’t it, so so cool! Letting something that is not vince flow through?

Does this mean that we need to discriminate between different kind of thoughts ?

No need to discriminate at all, but noticing that they’re just different, and have different effects. But discriminate would be an opinion and a judgement.

Strange (unusual) behavior, is a description. Aggressive is a story. An interpretation.
It may not be aggressiveness, it may be curiosity. i don't know, but can you see how aggression is overlaid (on the behavior) by the observer ?

Totally agree, for example, a striped fish is a description and a dangerous striped fish would be the story. It’s all relative anyway. Yes I see how aggression is the label overlaid and is so dependent on what the labeler feels and likes etc. To the turkeys the behavior is not aggressive, probably very natural and intelligent. Interpretations are just opinions, just stories.

Although it might also be considered that there is a flipside to this. If the opinion is about lack of beauty...
Is it possible to find the beauty in ugliness

Yes , it is totally possible, even death can be beautiful, and certainly creatures that the world has stereotyped as ugly and scary , like tarantulas eg, also cadavers if youre into dissections could be construed as beautiful and amazing! And blood, ha ha I️ could go on and on!! Did you ever see the movie American Beauty with the famous part where the teenaged boy is looking at a paper bag (not traditionally something would call beautiful) blowing down the road. Its filmed very beautifully and gracefully. And he says something like ‘There’s so much beauty in the world that sometimes I just cant take it’. Ahhh, we are back to the extraordinary ordinariness and the wonder-fullness Vince! :)

Ha Ha yes I am sure many roars of ego will happen, I remember in your blog where you spoke about getting really angry at your wife and having a strong reaction to some perceived judgement of yourself. But, I wonder if part of that though is being more unfiltered and willing to express feelings and opposed to block them which could freak people out, ha ha, but then they’re gone, over, and done with. I️ read somewhere once that in the wild, when an animal goes through trauma that they process it pretty soon and quickly by violently shaking and shivering then its done , over. They are actually using this shaking method in some human therapies to deal with trauma, forcibly brought on but apparently therapeutic! Darn, I just realised that my dog when he was about 6 months old was attacked by an alligator in the pond by my house and after we brought him in, he started violently shaking...

Here’s another cool animal story for you on this point, nothing to do with LU, but still wanted to share.

Some years ago, my brother was in either Tobago or Grenada for a fishing competition where they catch those big game fish like marlin, tuna, swordfish etc and release them. Anyway, he hooked something that seemed to be HUGE , and as the boat moved, these wild dolphins kept following them and would not leave their boat. Now, in the Caribbean, there is an understanding from fisherman (a story), that dolphins won’t take a bait on a line like the big fish, (guess it’s because they are smart(er) ).....anyway my brother got a feeling inside that it could and might be a dolphin, but no one agreed with him because ‘everyone’ knows that dolphins won’t get caught on a line, then a lot of time went by and the wild dolphins still followed their boat, my brother got more and more uneasy and also he made no headway on getting the ‘fish’ up. He kept feeling worse and worse about the situation when suddenly the ‘fish’ that was in fact a dolphin surfaced, just for a couple seconds, and he clearly and immediately saw that shark like dorsal fin that dolphins have. In a second he knew he was right about it being a dolphin and NOT a game fish and immediately he cut the line to free the creature. The strangest thing happened at that point, all around the boat for as far as the eye could see the water started to shake and cause all these bubbles and waves and disturbances, like a hot tub water. It was obviously (description) the pod of dolphins surrounding them in some sort of reaction to the freed dolphin (that they never abandoned) and then... they they suddenly just like left and it was over. (Getting goosebumps just writing this). I always wondered if that reaction of shaking was them all getting rid of the trauma because of what I had read previous about animals shaking, or maybe it was pure joy, whatever it was , there’s some cool story there. Ha Ha, nature is so amazing. I digress again, turkeys, now dolphins. Some stories are tragic (interpretation) and others are beautiful and inspiring (also interpretation), stories make the world go round don’t they!

Thank you for the haiku, a question about intention being the motive force, should the intention be simply to wake up?

Love
Diana