How to stop been "me"?

[Topazio]

insecurity T No sensation
inferiority T No sensation
defenseless T, the same
fear T No sensation
Anger T nothing
I do not care about "anything" T None
this is not real anyways T----nothing----
When I LOOK at those words I have no sensation

How is this possible, Dora? Are you dead?

When I try to do the exercise from "memory" I only get "more thoughts"; When I Look, then I feel "nothing". I do not think I am dead; maybe I am not "seeing it"; I also notice that when I LOOK in "real time" to d.E., it is easier for me to register body sensations; yet "from memory" when I LOOK at "thought" I get "more" thought.

With love and respect,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

When I try to do the exercise from "memory" I only get "more thoughts"; When I Look, then I feel "nothing". I do not think I am dead; maybe I am not "seeing it"; I also notice that when I LOOK in "real time" to d.E., it is easier for me to register body sensations;

This sounds like resistance to look into perceived uncomfortable sensations. Is it?

yet "from memory" when I LOOK at "thought" I get "more" thought.

Yes, when you look at thoughts you will only see more thoughts. I am simply asking you to look at your real time, actual experience (seeing, hearing, smelling, tasting, touching/feeling) to see what is really happening when labels such as ‘insecurity’ are used (and yes, we will most likely have to utilize memory to some extent for these exercises).

Thoughts "protect me from" Reality
When I said "protect me" I meant " ego"

What is this 'ego' that thoughts protect? I am interested in how 'ego’ is experienced in real time for you (not what you have read or heard from others). Where is it located? Does it have a shape or form? Can you smell, taste, or touch “ego”? Can you take a picture of “ego” and send it to me so I can see what “ego” looks like?

Much Love,
Linda

[Topazio]

Thoughts "protect me from" Reality
When I said "protect me" I meant " ego"

What is this 'ego' that thoughts protect? I am interested in how 'ego’ is experienced in real time for you (not what you have read or heard from others). Where is it located? Does it have a shape or form? Can you smell, taste, or touch “ego”? Can you take a picture of “ego” and send it to me so I can see what “ego” looks like?

Ego is a thought that I "know" since I can remember; ego has no location, shape or form. I cannot smell, taste, or touch "ego". "Ego thought" protects itself...ego does not exist, I understand or something "understands" that; I do not know and I cannot located "that" or "something" , yet I have a certainty about it.

Love,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

Ego is a thought

Yes, Beautiful!

Ego thought" protects itself...

Can a thought protect another thought? If so, how?
Can a thought think?

I understand or something "understands" that; I do not know and I cannot located "that" or "something" , yet I have a certainty about it.

Sure, you are certain that a thought arises. But what evidence can you produce of an ‘ego’ posing as a thought to support your certainty? Let’s have some fun and do an exercise :-).

1. Write out a list of at least 3 thoughts that you consider to be ‘ego’ thoughts. Please also include what sensations arise, in real time, as you write the list (in other words, how did you FEEL while writing this list)?

2. Write out a second list of at least 3 thoughts that you do NOT consider to be ‘ego’ thoughts. Also include what sensations come up for you while writing this list (how did you FEEL while writing this list?)

Send me your lists so we can explore these thoughts and sensations together.

Hug,
Linda

[Topazio]

Hi Linda,

Ego thought" protects itself...

Can a thought protect another thought? If so, how?
Can a thought think?

No,I was wrong; a thought cannot think.

I understand or something "understands" that; I do not know and I cannot located "that" or "something" , yet I have a certainty about it.

Sure, you are certain that a thought arises. But what evidence can you produce of an ‘ego’ posing as a thought to support your certainty? Let’s have some fun and do an exercise :-).

1. Write out a list of at least 3 thoughts that you consider to be ‘ego’ thoughts. Please also include what sensations arise, in real time, as you write the list (in other words, how did you FEEL while writing this list)?

1- "You do need to have a well paid profession"; soon as this thought arise I feel that this is not true.
2- "You have to be this or that"
2- "Life is not cowards"
All this thoughts lack of truth and make me feel upset,again "upset" is a thought; I cannot register taste,visual, touch or any bodily sensation or d.E.

2. Write out a second list of at least 3 thoughts that you do NOT consider to be ‘ego’ thoughts. Also include what sensations come up for you while writing this list (how did you FEEL while writing this list?)

I cannot find a thought that is not "ego"; it is in every thought; and I feel tired and stucked in thoughts about it;
all is "thought" and "I" "who does not exist" , "lives" in a world of thoughts.

Hug and Love,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

All this thoughts lack of truth

Well seen, Sweetheart!

Make me feel upset,again "upset" is a thought

Yes, ‘upset’ is a thought but the felt sensations that get labeled ‘upset’ are real. This is why we are trying to switch the focus from thoughts to what is actually experienced. The next time you notice feeling ‘upset’, maybe you might be interested in noticing what sensations are being experienced?

I cannot find a thought that is not "ego"; it is in every thought

What if the exact opposite is true? Isn’t it more true to say that an ‘ego’ cannot be found that is not a thought? A thought is in every ‘ego’ statement.”?

all is "thought" and "I" "who does not exist" , "lives" in a world of thoughts.

Beautifully seen!

I feel tired and stucked in thoughts about it;

Excellent, Dora. Love the honesty here. Is there a problem with thoughts? Is there a belief that thoughts, or some thoughts, should not be happening?

I would like to invite you to keep a notebook and pen with you today, and as you go throughout your day notice thoughts that arise. As you do this, maybe you can simply be curious about them, watching them without any need to judge, stop or change them. Just observe them like a scientist would observe a cell within the body to see how the cell functions. If this is something that interests you then I purpose that you focus on the following two things:

1. Notice how thoughts occur on their own, without a controller. Just like the heart beats, blood pumps, food digests, breathing happens all on its own without any interference from an entity called ‘Dora’ ‘I’ ‘me’ 'ego'.

2. Notice the possibility of every thought that arises, is doing so for the sole purpose of protecting the body. If you notice any thoughts that are difficult to see how they may be attempting to protect the body, write them down and send them to me so we can get the high powered microscope out to see what is happening ;-).

Looking forward to hearing a report back from you on your observations.

Warmly,
Linda

[Topazio]

Yes, ‘upset’ is a thought but the felt sensations that get labeled ‘upset’ are real. This is why we are trying to switch the focus from thoughts to what is actually experienced. The next time you notice feeling ‘upset’, maybe you might be interested in noticing what sensations are being experienced?

Is has been proposed a long trip outside and far from the country and I noticed feelings of upsetness...I feel waves of sensations....in the body; planning for this trip is happening, yet I am not really involved. I feel heaviness upon my body....my throat clogs someway like I am going to start crying; watery eyes; afraid of having this long trip with this person brought this sensations. "Who" is NOT involved? If thoughts are there and they can come and go as they please, WHO is not happy with trip???? If LIFE happens no matter what, why RESISTANCE occur?, and then PAIN? Pain sensations:
chest heaviness, tears rolling on face, contractions of the chest, some type of momentary chest oppression.

What if the exact opposite is true? Isn’t it more true to say that an ‘ego’ cannot be found that is not a thought? A thought is in every ‘ego’ statement.”?

Yes, Ego cannot be found and a thought is in every 'ego' statement. I feel as I am in a laberint and I passed already many times from the same passages.

[Topazio]

I would like to invite you to keep a notebook and pen with you today, and as you go throughout your day notice thoughts that arise. As you do this, maybe you can simply be curious about them, watching them without any need to judge, stop or change them. Just observe them like a scientist would observe a cell within the body to see how the cell functions. If this is something that interests you then I purpose that you focus on the following two things:

1. Notice how thoughts occur on their own, without a controller. Just like the heart beats, blood pumps, food digests, breathing happens all on its own without any interference from an entity called ‘Dora’ ‘I’ ‘me’ 'ego'.

2. Notice the possibility of every thought that arises, is doing so for the sole purpose of protecting the body. If you notice any thoughts that are difficult to see how they may be attempting to protect the body, write them down and send them to me so we can get the high powered microscope out to see what is happening ;-).

Looking forward to hearing a report back from you on your observations.

1- Thoughts came and go and I have no control over them; and they get the credit for the pain I feel.

2-They come to protect the body; health, diets, image thoughts happening constantly....as the trip to this foreign country, I have had thoughts about (body) safety (Is the country political-social safe to visit?) Is this person I go with familiar enough to shear this 2 weeks?
I feel like a leave floating on an ocean with no plan; and YET something inside me has a "bunch of stories " and plans and trips to foreigner countries to go when "I" do not want to go!!!!....WHO is that!?

Love,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

Is has been proposed a long trip outside and far from the country and I noticed feelings of upsetness...I feel waves of sensations....in the body; planning for this trip is happening, yet I am not really involved. I feel heaviness upon my body....my throat clogs someway like I am going to start crying; watery eyes; afraid of having this long trip with this person brought this sensations. "Who" is NOT involved? If thoughts are there and they can come and go as they please, WHO is not happy with trip???? If LIFE happens no matter what, why RESISTANCE occur?, and then PAIN? Pain sensations: chest heaviness, tears rolling on face, contractions of the chest, some type of momentary chest oppression.

Wonderful that you shared this experience of ‘upsetness’. It might be interesting if you go through this paragraph and separate out in one column the real time, felt sensations indicated in the paragraph, and in the second column list out the thoughts. When you have done that please send me your lists, with responses to the following questions:
1. Is it noticed how each thought is attempting to protect the body based on the sensations being experienced?

2. If it is truly seen that thoughts arise to protect the body, is there any reason why ALL thoughts could not be embraced and welcomed in the same manner a friend or family member would be welcomed when they arrive to provide protection?

"Who" is NOT involved?

That is correct. “Who” is NOT involved.
Is it possible that life is simply living itself? Could it be possible that every sensation felt, every thought arising, every leaf blowing, every stream flowing, every storm rumbling, every bee stinging, every baby crying, and every flower blooming is life unfolding PERFECTLY? Or is something imperfect? What sensations come up when you read this?

WHO is not happy with trip????
and plans and trips to foreigner countries to go when "I" do not want to go!!!!....WHO is that!?

YOU tell me who or what is it that is not happy with the trip, and who or what does not want to go? Look and see!

If LIFE happens no matter what, why RESISTANCE occur? And the PAIN?

What exactly is being resisted and who or what is ‘resisting’ happening to? Is this pain really about not being in a pleasant state (like happiness or joy)? Is it the desire to fix something, to make this experience ‘better’? Could this be let go of, and can the WHOLE of life's experience be cherished without judgment, all resistances noticed and engaged with to see what it is trying to tell you?

I feel like a leave floating on an ocean with no plan; and YET something inside me has a "bunch of stories "

Sweetheart, is there something wrong with floating like a leaf on an ocean while a “bunch of stories” arise? Is there an expectation that floating like a leaf on the ocean should not include a “bunch of stories”?

I feel as I am in a laberint and I passed already many times from the same passages.

Hehe. I know exactly what you are saying. The labyrinth took a life time to build so passing through the same passages over and over again is quite normal, and perfect exactly as it unfolds, No?

With Love,
Linda

[Topazio]

Is has been proposed a long trip outside and far from the country and I noticed feelings of upsetness...I feel waves of sensations....in the body; planning for this trip is happening, yet I am not really involved. I feel heaviness upon my body....my throat clogs someway like I am going to start crying; watery eyes; afraid of having this long trip with this person brought this sensations. "Who" is NOT involved? If thoughts are there and they can come and go as they please, WHO is not happy with trip???? If LIFE happens no matter what, why RESISTANCE occur?, and then PAIN? Pain sensations: chest heaviness, tears rolling on face, contractions of the chest, some type of momentary chest oppression.

sensations:
throat clogs
watery eyes
tears rolling face
pain
chest heaviness
contractions of the chest
chest oppression
body
thoughts:
not happy
involved
trip
afraid of
resistance
going to start crying
upsetness

Wonderful that you shared this experience of ‘upsetness’. It might be interesting if you go through this paragraph and separate out in one column the real time, felt sensations indicated in the paragraph, and in the second column list out the thoughts. When you have done that please send me your lists, with responses to the following questions:
1. Is it noticed how each thought is attempting to protect the body based on the sensations being experienced?

Yes, no doubts about it.

2. If it is truly seen that thoughts arise to protect the body, is there any reason why ALL thoughts could not be embraced and welcomed in the same manner a friend or family member would be welcomed when they arrive to provide protection?

Yes, they should be welcomed equally.

"Who" is NOT involved?
That is correct. “Who” is NOT involved.
Is it possible that life is simply living itself? Could it be possible that every sensation felt, every thought arising, every leaf blowing, every stream flowing, every storm rumbling, every bee stinging, every baby crying, and every flower blooming is life unfolding PERFECTLY? Or is something imperfect? What sensations come up when you read this?

WHO is a thought; LIFE is unfolding...PERFECTLY as it is! Perfection is everywhere! I feel full of energy when I read it...warming sensations.

WHO is not happy with the trip????
and plans and trips to foreign countries to go when "I" do not want to go!!!!....WHO is that!?
YOU tell me who or what is it that is not happy with the trip, and who or what does not want to go? Look and see!

"Not happy with the trip" is a thought. Thought come and go...that is all!

If LIFE happens no matter what, why RESISTANCE occur? And the PAIN?

Resistance is another though....pain in that sentence it is also a thought since was expressing an idea instead of "physical pain".

What exactly is being resisted and who or what is ‘resisting’ happening to? Is this pain really about not being in a pleasant state (like happiness or joy)? Is it the desire to fix something, to make this experience ‘better’? Could this be let go of, and can the WHOLE of life's experience be cherished without judgment, all resistances noticed and engaged with to see what it is trying to tell you?

Just thoughts, stories about pain yet not physical pain, so more thought! I do not know what resistance is trying to tell me.

I feel like a leaf floating on an ocean with no plan; and YET something inside me has a "bunch of stories "

Sweetheart, is there something wrong with floating like a leaf on an ocean while a “bunch of stories” arise? Is there an expectation that floating like a leaf on the ocean should not include a “bunch of stories”?

[/quote]

That is true! Nothing is wrong with what IS.

Today I was in a public place and someone disagreed about giving what I thought was rightful....and I registered what I felt: I felt that I was been slowly absorbed into a tornado, and all the people's eyes were on me....and then I thought : are they really looking at me? To my surprise, nobody cares! I will call that "one more experience"...experiences happening everywhere....no "experiencer"....then, if is no "I" , nor "Dora", or "experiencer"...and I KNOW that!!!! , why I am still not seeing everything as a whole?

With Love,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

Wonderful stuff!

WHO is a thought; LIFE is unfolding...PERFECTLY as it is! Perfection is everywhere! I feel full of energy when I read it...warming sensations.

Happy tears over here reading this. Beautiful!

Just thoughts, stories about pain yet not physical pain, so more thought! I do not know what resistance is trying to tell me.

So, maybe the next time resistance is felt, if you are curious about it, you might consider doing the same exercise discussed a few days ago. Specifically, instead of trying to push resistance away, maybe you would be interested in welcoming it like you would a puppy, baby, or treasured friend to see what it has come to tell you? Allow it to stay as long as it stays. Notice the resistance and any thought stories that arise. Then focus on the feeling itself, noticing the bodily sensations along with their location, apparent shape and any movement. Allow the resistance to stay as long as it stays without fighting it. Then ask the resistance what it has come to show you. Give it time to respond, noticing any images or other explanations that arise. If nothing comes up, that is fine, thank the resistance and allow the sensations to stay as long as they want and leave when they want. This can be done any time resistance shows up. Feel free to share discoveries if, and when, you look into resistance in this manner.

I will call that "one more experience"...experiences happening everywhere....no "experiencer"....then, if is no "I" , nor "Dora", or "experiencer"...and I KNOW that!!!! , why I am still not seeing everything as a whole?

Great that you brought this up. Let’s take a look and do some exploring :-)

Pick an object around you, any object. Maybe this computer screen. Take a fresh look at it, like a newborn baby would. Let’s call it ‘observed’ and you, the ‘observer’.

1. Can you find boundaries between the observer and the observed? If so, where and what are they?
2. Is the space between the screen and you observed or observer?
3. Look at the hands. Are they observed or observer?
4. Look at the end of your nose. Is it observer or observed?
5. Where is the observer? Can you see/hear/touch/feel/smell it?
6. When a thought says ‘Dora’ is looking at the screen’, what is going on, in actual experience?

Make sure you answer all the questions, and only scan what is given in direct experience to see what comes up.

Big Hug,
Linda

[Topazio]

So, maybe the next time resistance is felt, if you are curious about it, you might consider doing the same exercise discussed a few days ago. Specifically, instead of trying to push resistance away, maybe you would be interested in welcoming it like you would a puppy, baby, or treasured friend to see what it has come to tell you? Allow it to stay as long as it stays. Notice the resistance and any thought stories that arise. Then focus on the feeling itself, noticing the bodily sensations along with their location, apparent shape and any movement. Allow the resistance to stay as long as it stays without fighting it. Then ask the resistance what it has come to show you. Give it time to respond, noticing any images or other explanations that arise. If nothing comes up, that is fine, thank the resistance and allow the sensations to stay as long as they want and leave when they want. This can be done any time resistance shows up. Feel free to share discoveries if, and when, you look into resistance in this manner.

Resistance came in the form of thoughts arriving, anger thoughts, I felt head spinning sensation, slightly blurry vision, embarrassment feelings about others watching as worm on face, urgency to run ( not physically....), more thoughts coming in hoards and then "something remember "to LOOK"....slowly all troughs become harmless as "children playing"

Pick an object around you, any object. Maybe this computer screen. Take a fresh look at it, like a newborn baby would. Let’s call it ‘observed’ and you, the ‘observer’.

1. Can you find boundaries between the observer and the observed? If so, where and what are they?
2. Is the space between the screen and you observed or observer?
3. Look at the hands. Are they observed or observer?
4. Look at the end of your nose. Is it observer or observed?
5. Where is the observer? Can you see/hear/touch/feel/smell it?
6. When a thought says ‘Dora’ is looking at the screen’, what is going on, in actual experience?

Make sure you answer all the questions, and only scan what is given in direct experience to see what comes up.

1- I can find boundaries around the screen and where I rest my hands to write.
2- space between is observed
3- hands are observed
4- I can not see , hear, touch, feel or smell the observer
5- It is not "location" for the observer
6- when a thought says "Dora is looking at the screen" I feel that "something" is looking at the screen but I cannot locate it....screen is seeing, laptop is seeing... eyes closed in search...nothing is there yet "something" is watching.

Big Hug,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

Thank you for sharing the experience with resistance. We will come back to it shortly but let's stay with the exercises for right now.

I can find boundaries around the screen and where I rest my hands to write.
hands are observed

Okay, that is what you have been told and believe to be true, but is that REALLY what is being experienced? Give it another go and this time don’t refer to thoughts (beliefs, teachings, deductions, theories, assumptions) but LOOK at what is REALLY happening.

1. Where exactly does the observer and observed separate?
2. What is the boundary of the observed?
3. What is the boundary of the observer?
4. Are there three separate things: observer, observing and observed? Or is there just observing?

space between is observed

It certainly seems so when you refer to thoughts but does real time, actual experience support this? Take another look and tell me what is REALLY experienced.

Consider when watching a tv show, how human forms may be seen on the screen along with buildings, trees, the sky, and maybe water. They all appear to have distance (space) between them but when the tv is turned off all that is there is a flat screen. Is there any difference in actual experience? Take a hard look.

I can not see , hear, touch, feel or smell the observer. It is not "location" for the observer

Since it cannot be seen, heard, touched, felt, or smelled, then what is ‘observer’? Is it just another thought like ‘Dora’ ‘I’ ‘me’, or is it something else?

nothing is there yet "something" is watching.

Let’s look closely: what is there behind the word 'something'? Is ‘something’ really watching anything? or is ‘something’ a sort of 'aliveness' or an 'energy' or an 'experiencing' that are then THOUGHT to be ‘something’ separate that is watching? What is ACTUALLY seen to be happening in real time, HERE, THIS, experience?

Give these questions the attention they deserve. Don’t answer from what you THINK the right answers are…but rather LOOK, in real time, actual experience and report back what you HONESTLY see.

Much love,
Linda

[Topazio]

"I can find boundaries around the screen and where I rest my hands to write.
hands are observed"

Okay, that is what you have been told and believe to be true, but is that REALLY what is being experienced? Give it another go and this time don’t refer to thoughts (beliefs, teachings, deductions, theories, assumptions) but LOOK at what is REALLY happening.

1. Where exactly does the observer and observed separate?
2. What is the boundary of the observed?
3. What is the boundary of the observer?
4. Are there three separate things: observer, observing and observed? Or is there just observing?

1-There is no separation between observer and observed.
2- There is no boundary.
3- I cannot precise a boundary.
4- There is just observing.

"space between is observed"

It certainly seems so when you refer to thoughts but does real time, actual experience support this? Take another look and tell me what is REALLY experienced.
Consider when watching a tv show, how human forms may be seen on the screen along with buildings, trees, the sky, and maybe water. They all appear to have distance (space) between them but when the tv is turned off all that is there is a flat screen. Is there any difference in actual experience? Take a hard look.

When in actual experience I touch a human arm I feel three dimensions and I can feel the "volume", texture and size; in d.E I can touch, feel and smell and arm; it also has color. I do not understand the comparison con two dimension T.V/ images.

"I can not see , hear, touch, feel or smell the observer. It is not "location" for the observer"

Since it cannot be seen, heard, touched, felt, or smelled, then what is ‘observer’? Is it just another thought like ‘Dora’ ‘I’ ‘me’, or is it something else?

The observer is a thought, also.

"nothing is there yet "something" is watching."

Let’s look closely: what is there behind the word 'something'? Is ‘something’ really watching anything? or is ‘something’ a sort of 'aliveness' or an 'energy' or an 'experiencing' that are then THOUGHT to be ‘something’ separate that is watching? What is ACTUALLY seen to be happening in real time, HERE, THIS, experience?

Give these questions the attention they deserve. Don’t answer from what you THINK the right answers are…but rather LOOK, in real time, actual experience and report back what you HONESTLY see.

"Something" is a thought; nothing is "watching"; it is not observed none observed; it is ENERGY flowing, it is life living "me". This experience is what IS and is just happening.... not I, Dora, ego, or mind....nothing and everything, yet not known "significance".
Love,
Dora

[LindaR]

Hi Dora,

4- There is just observing.

Well seen! Bravo!!

The observer is a thought, also.

Yes!

When in actual experience I touch a human arm I feel three dimensions and I can feel the "volume", texture and size; in d.E I can touch, feel and smell and arm; it also has color. I do not understand the comparison con two dimension T.V/ images.

Thoughts say that there is an ‘arm’ with three dimensions, volume, and size but is this REALLY what is being experienced? Let’s investigate it a bit further, shall we?

With eyes closed and sitting still, touch the ‘arm’. Notice the felt sensation of touching the arm. With only the input from the sensation of touch (before thoughts, memory, or mental images):
1. Can it be known that there is an arm?
2. Can three dimensions be found?
3. Can size be known?
4. Can volume be known?
5. Can location be known?

Now, with eyes still closed, using the sensation of smell (before thoughts, memory, or mental images):,
1. can an ‘arm’ be found?
2. Can three dimensions be found?
3. Can size be known?
4. Can volume be known?
5. Can location be known?

Next, open the eyes and look. Is anything other than the sensation of apparent color being seen? Can it be seen how thoughts, in the form of memory and images, arise creating a story about an ‘arm’ based on the different shades of apparent color and felt sensations?

Loving this exploration with you, Sweetheart!

Hug,
Linda