Looking for a guide.

[Esmeralda]

Sorry, hit submit too soon.:)

Love
Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

Clear seeing. Sometimes, I'm not sure whether I am actually seeing this for what it is, or if I am just parroting what I have read. It's like I 'understand' that thoughts are real, content is not, but can I actually *see* this? I don't know.

Clear seeing? Clear seeing is the MOMENT when it is seen that the ‘I’ cannot be found only as a thought. This moment can be just a split of a second, sometimes it can last for a few minutes or even hours, but eventually it goes away, until it comes back again, then being lost, seeing, being lost, seeing…. So it is NOT a CONSTANT STATE!!!

If you expect a constant seeing of this you’ll get only disappointment.

Rather look, what is the ‘thing’ that wants clear seeing? Where is it exactly?

Are you ready to question this expectation?

I would know somehow that I have seen through the illusion? Ok, I have had moments of seeing - any time I have done the exercises or even just looked throughout the day, the I can't be found and it has also been seen (sometimes) that things happen without a doer.

Yes, exactly, this is what I’m talking about. (see above)

And maybe there are still lots of expectations in the way of seeing it

There is nothing in a way of seeing it! Nothing! There is only an expectation what is nothing more than a thought arising here and now. This thought (mental concept) is compared of the current seeing, with a conclusion, “this is not it!”.

But is this really the case?
Can a thought ‘know’ how seeing should look like or feel like?
Can a thought ‘know’ anything about what is prior to thoughts?

I have read so many posts on this forum (and in the GG book too) where people really *see*; they know they are through and they start laughing because they can see that this was always the way. I think I am waiting for that laugh, for a moment of just *knowing* that this is it, this is really it.

Ohh dear, it doesn’t matter what others write or say. People can use words in a way that it seems that they’ve found some treasures. But these are just words written.

Rather look, what is the ‘thing’ that is doing this comparing?
Is there a ‘thing’ at all, or comparing thoughts just arise?

Vivien: Is there anything missing in this moment?

Esme: That is the funny thing, because despite everything I wrote above, no - nothing is missing in this moment

:))) Can you see how thoughts (expectations) are lying?
If nothing is missing in this moment, then what is missing?

there is only this moment.

If there is only this moment then how could seeing be in a ‘future’?
Is there seeing right now? Is there a ‘you’ here, right now?
Can seeing happen ‘outside’ of this moment?

Love, Vivien

[Esmeralda]

Dear Vivien,

Rather look, what is the ‘thing’ that wants clear seeing? Where is it exactly?

I can't find a thing that wants clear seeing. But there is definitely wanting :))

Are you ready to question this expectation?

Yes, I am ready.

But is this really the case?

No it can't be the case, because thought can't determine this.

Can a thought ‘know’ how seeing should look like or feel like?

No. I'm beginning to think that thought can't know anything. Hah, that sounds very contradictory! :)

Can a thought ‘know’ anything about what is prior to thoughts?

No.

Rather look, what is the ‘thing’ that is doing this comparing?

I can't find the thing. It seems so simple. I don't know why I complicate this.

Is there a ‘thing’ at all, or comparing thoughts just arise?

There is no thing that is making comparing happen. Comparing thoughts just arise, no different from any other thoughts arising. When I write this, I can see how little those (or any) thoughts really matter, since they just arise and then disappear. I wish I'd take them less seriously when they arise!

Can you see how thoughts (expectations) are lying?

Yes.

If nothing is missing in this moment, then what is missing?

Nothing is missing.

If there is only this moment then how could seeing be in a ‘future’?

It can't.

Is there seeing right now? Is there a ‘you’ here, right now?

Yes, there is looking and there is seeing. I can't find a me here, right now.

Can seeing happen ‘outside’ of this moment?

No. There is nothing outside of this moment.

Love, Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

Vivien: Are you ready to question this expectation?

Esme: Yes, I am ready.

Then do it every time when comparing and doubting thought come up. Ask: “Is this really a case?”

I can't find the thing. It seems so simple. I don't know why I complicate this.

Complication or rather say thoughts about complication just happens. And that’s all.

There is no thing that is making comparing happen. Comparing thoughts just arise, no different from any other thoughts arising. When I write this, I can see how little those (or any) thoughts really matter, since they just arise and then disappear.

Yes, exactly.

I wish I'd take them less seriously when they arise!

Oh this is another expectation! Wanting things to be different as they are in the moment.
Sometimes thoughts are taken seriously, other times are not.
Taking seriously is the result of X years of conditioning. So they won’t go away in an instant.

Are you ready for the final questions?

After answering them I’ll share them with other guides. They may or may not have further questions. When it is confirmed that seeing through the illusion happened then this thread ends, but our conversation can go on if you like. Furthermore you’ll be invited to several FB groups where you can talk many others who have seen through the self too. So further investigation and deepening can happen there.

Love, Vivien

[Esmeralda]

Dear Vivien,

Are you ready for the final questions?

Yes.

Love, Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

So here are the six questions. Please answer as clearly as possible and with as much detail as needed. Don’t forget to add everyday examples from your experience for question 5.


1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

Love, Vivien

[Esmeralda]

Dear Vivien,

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

All that I can say with 100% certainty is that I cannot find a separate self, me or I anywhere, or in any shape or form. And because I can't find it now, that also mean that I never would have been able to find one, had I looked.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

The illusion of a separate self starts in early childhood, when we are conditioned to take ownership of emotions and sensations, traits and characteristics and cognitive functions like thoughts and memories. For me, the belief was of a self that was destructible, that was at the mercy of other people, outer circumstances, thoughts, feelings, emotions and sensations. The self was something that needed protection, as well as the defender and protector, the experiencer and the thing in charge; the self was who was living this life.
How do I see it now?
Well.....I just can't find an owner of those things anymore. I look for this entity described above - which was so real for so long - and I can't find it. So how I see it now is that there are thoughts, feelings, sensations and emotions, traits and characteristics but they belong to nothing or nobody. There is no findable thing that is living this life.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

It doesn't feel like anything really, to see this. It just feels normal (for lack of a better word), that this is how it is now. There isn't any difference other than upon looking, no self or me can be found. The past few days have been like any days; there is no more or less peace or stillness, opening up to or deepening into anything. I mention these because it was all part of my expectations, that once no-self is seen, the rest will follow. Before I started this dialogue, I experienced a lot of anxiety, insomnia and tiredness. In the past few days, I have experienced a lot of anxiety, insomnia and tiredness. Can I see that these things just happen, not to a me, self or I? Well, perhaps not upon arising, but upon looking, yes. :)

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

I don't know really. There was a moment when I was driving the car the other week and there was a very strange feeling of 'dislodging' (sorry, can't describe it any better with words) and a sudden realisation that there is nobody, no-thing, no one driving the car. After that, it became much easier to look.

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

Decision, intention, free will, choice, control and responsibility are labels. What makes things happen? I have no idea. I can sit here and use thoughts to command my foot to move but nothing happens. So it isn't thoughts. And then, out of nowhere, the right hand reaches out for the cup on the table. And that just happens. There is nobody or nothing in control - if there was, free will would choose only positive thoughts and emotions for example. I'm not responsible for anything, because things just happen and there is no I to stop, shape or control them. But again, I don't know how they happen, they just do. All I can say from my own experience is that there is a never ending arising of thoughts, emotions and sensations, of breathing, blinking, physical movements, etc but I don't know how it happens.

6) Anything to add?

No. I still don't think I'm through the gate, but then again - what do I know?? :D

Love, Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

Thank you for answering the question. One of the guides asks:

I still don't think I'm through the gate, but then again - what do I know??

What ‘I’ could go through the gate?

What if “I still don’t think I’m through the gate” is just an arising thought appearing?

Love, Vivien

[Esmeralda]

Dear Vivien,

What ‘I’ could go through the gate?

There is no I that could go through the gate.

What if “I still don’t think I’m through the gate” is just an arising thought appearing?

Ha ha, yes! It is - like all other thoughts.

Love, Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

Another guide asks:

What doubts having seen through the self?

Love, Vivien

[Vivien]

Let me rephrase the previous question using different wording (so please miss the previous one):

Who doubts having seen through the self?

[Esmeralda]

Dear Vivien,

Who doubts having seen through the self?

I have spent all day looking for the doubter who doubts. I can't find anything. But there is doubt, and even though you have clarified he topic of expectations so well, there is still the expectation that if the self had been seen through, there would somehow be a knowing of this. And so I keep looking for this knowing but can't find it, and then there's the assumption that it hasn't happened....

Love Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

I have spent all day looking for the doubter who doubts. I can't find anything. But there is doubt,

What doubt made of?

Is there any difference between the thought “here is a cup” or “if the self had been seen through, there would somehow be a knowing of this”?

What is knowing? Is it a feeling? Is it a sensation? Is it a thought? What is it? What is it made of?

An arising thought is real only as an arising thought, but never it’s content (what it’s about). Can you see this?

But there is doubt, and even though you have clarified he topic of expectations so well, there is still the expectation

What is expectation? What is an expectation made of?
When there is an expectation, how does expectation appear, in which form (feeling, sensation, thought)?

And so I keep looking for this knowing but can't find it

Again, what is knowing? What is it made of? Is it an object that can be found?

and then there's the assumption that it hasn't happened...

.
Yes, an ASSUMPTION! Just as the ‘me’ is an assumption too.

What is assumption made of?

if the self had been seen through, there would somehow be a knowing of this

Knowing by what/who?
How could this be known? A thought declaring it?

Seeing through the self cannot be felt. It is not a feeling. When the illusion is seen through actually nothing is changes, since there has never been a self in the first place.

Like when you watch an illusionist cut a woman in a box in half. It doesn’t matter whether you know the trick how he does it or not. In neither case the woman has never been cut half.

The knowing of the illusion is just simply this: seeing that there has never been a me, except as a thought. That’s all.

Love, Vivien

[Esmeralda]

Dear Vivien,

What doubt made of?

Doubt is not made of anything. It is just a label.

Is there any difference between the thought “here is a cup” or “if the self had been seen through, there would somehow be a knowing of this”?

No, no difference. They are both just thoughts.

What is knowing? Is it a feeling? Is it a sensation? Is it a thought? What is it? What is it made of?

Knowing is not made of anything. It's an assumption.

An arising thought is real only as an arising thought, but never it’s content (what it’s about). Can you see this?

To be 100% honest with you, I can see this sometimes. When I look, or 'witness' thoughts, I can see that yes they are appearing, and that the content is not true/real.

What is expectation? What is an expectation made of?

Expectations are made of nothing. Expectations are assumptions too.

When there is an expectation, how does expectation appear, in which form (feeling, sensation, thought)?

It appears as the content of a thought.

Again, what is knowing? What is it made of? Is it an object that can be found?

No, it is not an object. It the content of a thought. It can't be found, no content of thought can be found.

What is assumption made of?

Assumption is content of thought. Made of nothing.

Knowing by what/who?

I cannot find anything/body who can know.

How could this be known? A thought declaring it?

:))))
This has definitely been the assumption. But of course it could never be known by a thought.

Love Esme

[Vivien]

Dear Esme,

Is there a difference - sitting here now - between knowing a thought like the capital of France, or that 2+2=4, or that a self can't be found, and knowing without words?"

With self gone, what is left, here and now, known without words, this moment?

Love, Vivien