Request for Guide

[kenbok]

Quick caveat: "appear to see", not see..

[kenbok]

Also, one of the reasons why I can be certain of this as an experience and not a mental exercise is because of my day-to-day experience now. I don't experience fear, anxiety or boredom like I used to. This, for me, is a very good litmus test for distinguishing between mental and lived.

[Xain]

Please bear with me (us) until clarity is established.

About consciousness . . .

"I" refers to the particular body-mind that consciousness has chosen to uniquely experience itself in.

Can you find consciousness as an active agent (a subtle sense of self)?
Does consciousness do 'choosing'?

Feel free to elaborate if needed.

Xain ♥

[kenbok]

Hmm.. I would say no.
Consciousness does not really make decisions. Life just has a flow of its own.
However, in this flow, there *appears* to be choosing going on. Like me choosing coffee or tea at a cafe. It adds to the fun of the game.
But I could be well wrong, this is just my best guess.

[Xain]

Please have a look at this:

You wrote:

If I say 'my body' to my doctor, I am referring to this meat suit that "I" happen to be in. After all - it is from "these eyes" that I see, not my neighbour's, not my doctor's, not my mother's, not Xain's. That is what I am referring to.

What exactly is this "I" that happens to be "in" a meat suit?
What is it and where is it?
What are its functions?

Xain ♥

[kenbok]

I don't know, I don't know, I don't know and I don't know.

[kenbok]

I'm happy for this process to end. I am grateful for the inquiry and the insights I have gained during this process, but it seems like it is going in circles.

[Xain]

Please forgive all the questions that appear repetitive, Ken. We only try to seek clarity.
Let us try to encompass it more simply.

Can you say with a big fat YES, that it is clear that separate self, I is an illusion?
If so, has seeking dropped completely?

Xain ♥

[kenbok]

Dear Xain, it is a very simple, very gentle, yes. There is no longer any seeking.

[Xain]

Have a look at this:

However, in this flow, there *appears* to be choosing going on. Like me choosing coffee or tea at a cafe. It adds to the fun of the game.
But I could be well wrong, this is just my best guess.

I only wish to seek clarity here, not to go over the same thing, but you do say 'best guess' and 'you could be wrong'
Your reply does not appear too certain about this.

Choosing 'appears' to be going on . . . but does it?
Is there a 'me' that chooses tea or coffee?

Xain ♥

[kenbok]

Let's put it this way. Everything in form is phenomenal, comes and goes. What does not come and go is who we really are. So what really is free will? Free will in nothingness / the absolute is not really free will. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. Really, free will is only applicable in the relative. But then, is it *really* free will? Yes and no - yes, in the sense that choices seem to be made, but no, in the sense that all choices are already predetermined by a prior set of circumstances.

For example, if you make a maze and put a mouse in it. It can go left or right at every junction. Does it have free will, and/or choice?

Yes: it could have gone left where it could have gone right.

No: Left and right were already determined by the maze-maker.

[kenbok]

So I would say, on the absolute level: no, there is no choice.
On the relative level: yes, there appears to be choice, but it is not really choice in the truest sense of the word.

All references to me, or the world, are equally phenomenal. So there is really no point in making 'me' more special or have more emphasis on 'me' than anything else.

[kenbok]

Ultimately, choice is also a concept. How can it not be? What are you choosing between? You have the choice of something phenomenal, or something phenomenal. LOL. Is that choice?

[Xain]

Thank you for your reply, Ken.

Some further points:

You says: "For example, if you make a maze and put a mouse in it. It can go left or right at every junction. Does it have free will, and/or choice?
Yes: it could have gone left where it could have gone right.
No: Left and right were already determined by the maze-maker."

How does choice happen between two possibilities, for example: Stand up. Or don't. How did it happen?
Rather than resorting to theories, please describe the experience of it.

Xain ♥

[kenbok]

That's the thing! It's a very funny phenomenon.
If I decide tea vs coffee, I would have had a thought before the decision, 'oh, I'll have tea' or 'I think I'm going to cut down on caffeine, so I'll have tea.' But where did that thought come from? This is the same question of 'where does all this phenomena come from, or why does it take the shape that is does? I don't really know.