Leaving the Matrix Behind

[MayaDawn]

Awakening is not about attaining a state. It is seeing that all states — bliss, contraction, boredom, aliveness, tiredness — are simply what is. No “you” owns them. They come and go like weather.

No one owns them… they come and go like weather, yet the “I” that I still often think that I am is so often tired. BUT, is that ‘I’ thought tired? Is open space tired? There’s a feeling/sensation then the label again, and again, and again. There’s almost a literal feeling of grabbing on to these thoughts and feelings. But I don’t own that either, do I?

It’s (THIS is) literally awake space. NOTHING else. EVERYTHING comes and goes in/through it - like weather. I remain open, untouched, and free (not as a state). That/This is the reality. Somehow it seems to have gotten switched around, and thought and the ‘person’ thinking seems more real – but I see the folly in that, as well.

The idea of “it can’t be like this all the time” is that mechanism that creates the illusory “someone” who imagines a future. Hope is always in the future.

In the brief moment that I sat with this, many recent, repeating thoughts about the future bubbled up. But NONE of those things are happening now… and they may not. Ever. They are like hooks for the mind/thought to have some sort of ground where none exists because I noticed the slightest feelings of hopelessness. Constantly waiting for life to change into what the mind wants. Wow… that’s a great way to keep a ‘person’ around.

Yes. And… who is learning? Who accepts? Is there a character actually here? Was there ever?
Right now—is there any “process of awakening” happening, or just THIS?

Immediate thought: “I’m so confused.” Mind was literally trying to find something to grab onto - or so it felt.
I thought that the character (that I get myself confused with) was this conglomeration of various conditionings and beliefs.


I’m going to look at these things throughout the day and report back this evening.

Thank you, Becca!

Much love
Deborah

[MayaDawn]

Hi Becca,

There were many noticings today.
- I recognized how much this mind likes to contemplate and ruminate with different ideas, and how that likely keeps the assumed self in place.
- I sat in quiet stillness after asking the mind if it would like to relax. “We” had a good, brief chat, then it relaxed for quite some time.
- When I opened the laptop, I read a couple of Vince Shubert’s articles, then sat in the question - does This need someone to notice it?
- I continue to look for the ‘I’, but can only find I-thoughts.

Right now—is there any “process of awakening” happening, or just THIS?

No, there is no process of awakening, no person who needs/wants to wake up, only This. When I catch a thought stating otherwise, it, too, is appearing now, in This.

A thought popped up as I was typing, “It (awakening) seems so far away.” But that thought is appearing in This which needs nothing and has nowhere to get to, nothing to achieve.

Warmly
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Deborah these are beautiful reports. You are looking very clearly.

I continue to look for the ‘I’, but can only find I-thoughts.

Notice the subtle background assumption: “I am looking for the I-thoughts.” But no such I is actually found doing the looking. There are simply thoughts about looking, attention moving, and sensations appearing now. Even “noticing” is not something a person does. It is just the spontaneous appearance of clarity, or seeing, with no one behind it.

Here are some more inquiries to be with:

Does This need someone to be aware of it? Does a separate “me” need to notice this for it to be here?

Is there a thinker of thoughts? Or do thoughts arise unbidden, from nowhere, and vanish into nowhere? Are they in any way personal?

Is there a feeler of feelings? Or do sensations simply arise, labelled after the fact by thought?

Is there an experiencer separate from experience? Or is there just experience—sounds, sensations, sights, thoughts—arising now?


You are doing very deep and honest looking. Just stay very simple, very direct. Each time thought says “but I…” or “how do I…”, stop and look:
Where is this I?
Is there a subject separate from this flow?

Much love,
Becca

[MayaDawn]

Mon Jun 9 reply pm:

Hi Becca,

""I continue to look for the ‘I’, but can only find I-thoughts.""
Notice the subtle background assumption: “I am looking for the I-thoughts.” But no such I is actually found doing the looking. There are simply thoughts about looking, attention moving, and sensations appearing now. Even “noticing” is not something a person does. It is just the spontaneous appearance of clarity, or seeing, with no one behind it.

That is very subtle, but I see it now. Thank you.

Does This need someone to be aware of it? Does a separate “me” need to notice this for it to be here?

No, This does not a ‘someone’ to be aware of it. A separate ‘me’ at this point doesn’t even make sense. Where would it be? How could it notice any of this if it were separate from it?

Is there a thinker of thoughts? Or do thoughts arise unbidden, from nowhere, and vanish into nowhere? Are they in any way personal?

I’ve looked and looked for a thinker and I can’t find one. Thoughts literally come out of nowhere - sometimes shockingly, other times so subtle that I don’t catch it until I catch myself agreeing with a thought that I don’t actually agree with. Then another thought comes up, “huh??” Then I see it. And all of this is just a play in This - - to no one, about no one, but thought has been so convincing.

Like you wrote before (paraphrased)... a sense of being a person is just that; a sensation + a belief.
And it’s all appearing right here, in This.

Is there a feeler of feelings? Or do sensations simply arise, labelled after the fact by thought?

No separate feeler. Sensations simply arise and are labelled after the fact.
I’ve been noticing this more and more.

Is there an experiencer separate from experience? Or is there just experience—sounds, sensations, sights, thoughts—arising now?

This one, as well… seems almost laughable that there could be an experiencer separate from experience. The feeling/belief still appears here, but there’s a clearer seeing that this is not the case; that there’s only experience.

Just stay very simple, very direct. Each time thought says “but I…” or “how do I…”, stop and look:
Where is this I?
Is there a subject separate from this flow?

I was able to do this many times today and was never able to find this I-person. A few times it was very convincing that something was happening to ‘me.’ There was a charge of emotion along with it and a sense or view of ‘another’ but when I had a moment to look closely at what had happened, I was able to see how the whole mechanism came together for selfing to occur. In the moment, there was just what was happening - no thoughts about it, but after – the mind seemed to want to create a looping fantasy, but I tried to be quick to get back to reality - - feeling feet on the floor, etc.

There is no subject separate from this flow. Seeing seems to be trickier to see the oneness of everything. I keep going back to the abstract painting example and do my best to recognize that there are no gaps between anything. The space is actually full of color. I understand that space is actually awareness/consciousness, but it seems like a good stepping stone for now. I’m open to any suggestions on that.


Thank you, Becca!

Much love
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Hello,

Seeing seems to be trickier to see the oneness of everything. I keep going back to the abstract painting example and do my best to recognize that there are no gaps between anything.

What is here that is not a thought?
Are these statements about what is happening, or about an expectation?

Look at the “space is actually full of color,” an excellent pointer. Let’s stay with just that.
Right here, before the thought “I am seeing the fullness of color,” is there anything missing?

Don’t answer conceptually. Sit still. Look.
Look at any point in the field of vision…
Is there an edge where “this” stops and something else begins?

I understand that space is actually awareness/consciousness, but it seems like a good stepping stone for now. I’m open to any suggestions on that.

The moment you say “space is actually awareness/consciousness,” the mind has already grabbed space as a concept and glued it to another concept (awareness) to create a new story. That story might feel like a more refined or spiritual one, but it is still conceptual.

Where is space right now—outside of a thought about it?
Where is awareness—outside of a thought about it?
What right now is not simply this undeniable presence of whatever is showing up—color, sensation, sound, thought?

No “space” needed. No “awareness” needed. Both are just more labels, more post-its on raw experience.

Look. What is here before the label?

Tell me… what is here, before the thought “space” arises?

-Becca

[MayaDawn]

Hello Becca,

Look at the “space is actually full of color,” an excellent pointer. Let’s stay with just that.
Right here, before the thought “I am seeing the fullness of color,” is there anything missing?

Nothing is missing.

Don’t answer conceptually. Sit still. Look.
Look at any point in the field of vision…
Is there an edge where “this” stops and something else begins?

No edge. It’s the same image or field of color. Mind labels the apparent objects and creates edges where there aren’t any.

The moment you say “space is actually awareness/consciousness,” the mind has already grabbed space as a concept and glued it to another concept (awareness) to create a new story. That story might feel like a more refined or spiritual one, but it is still conceptual.

Thank you - a very subtle concept.

Where is space right now—outside of a thought about it?
Where is awareness—outside of a thought about it?
What right now is not simply this undeniable presence of whatever is showing up—color, sensation, sound, thought?

Can’t find space.
Can’t find awareness.
Nothing else. Right now there’s only this undeniable presence of whatever is showing up.

Look. What is here before the label?

Tell me… what is here, before the thought “space” arises?

Only this undeniable presence.


Warmly
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Beautiful Deborah,

Please get out into nature today or tomorrow for a little while (a park, a forest, the shore, whatever is close by) and simply spend some time watching the movement of the whole. See how clouds move, trees swing, leaves wiggle, grass moves, insects, birds - all move all the time.

Then move focus to sensations and see how they too are in constant motion, thoughts come and go, sounds, colors, sensations come and go.

Notice that everything is part of one movement.
Then close your eyes and see if there is a line between you and out there, between you and life itself.

If yes, where is the boundary?
Is there an inside and an outside of Life?
Is there something which is not included in the movement of the whole?
Is there a witness that is watching life happening from a distance?
Is witnessing part of the one movement too?
Is there anything which is not just happening?

Much love,
Becca

[MayaDawn]

Hi Becca,

This was much easier - one of the things that are done as often as possible (being outside that is). :)

Notice that everything is part of one movement.
Then close your eyes and see if there is a line between you and out there, between you and life itself.

If yes, where is the boundary?
Is there an inside and an outside of Life?
Is there something which is not included in the movement of the whole?
Is there a witness that is watching life happening from a distance?
Is witnessing part of the one movement too?
Is there anything which is not just happening?

No line was found, no boundary, no inside, no outside.
If there is something not included in the movement of the whole that would make duality, so there’s nothing that is not included in the movement of the whole - Not that I could find, anyway.
I could find no witness watching from a distance.
It would seem that witnessing is part of the one movement. When investigated here, that definitely seems like the case.
I couldn’t find anything that isn’t just happening.


Warmly
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Hello Deborah,

I’m going to offer a series of questions at this point to uncover any gaps in clear seeing. Look into each and continue to report from what is experienced directly.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before we started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look? Was there a moment of shift with a distinct before and after?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. Consider and describe each if these separately.

6) What makes things happen? How does it work?

7) What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

8) Anything to add?

In gratitude and love,
Becca

[MayaDawn]

Hi Becca,

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

No, in direct experience there no separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form, nor was there ever. It only feels like it which is sensation and thought.

Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

To me, the illusion of the separate self is the feeling-belief that this body-mind is an individual person with choice and volition of it’s own. When it starts? As a child when thinking and self-consciousness begins, ie: when we begin to understand that there are ‘other’ things and beings that aren’t me.
“How it works from my own experience.” I’m not sure what that means other than the feeling-belief that there is someone here and others ‘out there.’

How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before we started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

It doesn’t feel like anything. There’s no difference here. The understanding might be a bit clearer when I can sit in it without distraction, but otherwise, everything is the same as when we began.

What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look? Was there a moment of shift with a distinct before and after?

Nothing has pushed me over anything. I’ve been looking and will continue to. Nothing specific made me look. There has been no shift of any kind.

Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. Consider and describe each of these separately.

They’re all the same - - they are thoughts/beliefs that ‘feel’ like ‘I’ am making. They don’t exist in reality. When I sit and ponder these things I see that there is no one who can decide, have intentions, free will, choice, or control.

What makes things happen? How does it work?

Nothing ‘makes’ things happen. On a practical level, perhaps karma and conditioning make things happen.
Something is experienced in a sense field, mind recalls something based on past experience/s, makes a story, or brings up an old story to repeat, and actions are made. IDK. That’s how I see it.

What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

If ‘I’ don’t exist, then I’m responsible for nothing. If there’s no choice, no free will, etc, then there is no responsibility, either.

On a practical level, however, that’s a different story. For example, as a guid-ee, I’m responsible to write here in the forum everyday. As an employee with a job, I’m responsible to show up to work everyday, etc., etc.

Anything to add?

Nothing I can think of.



Thank you, Becca,

Warmly
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Lovely Deborah. You’re describing the view from the cliff. But have you stepped off?

It only feels like it which is sensation and thought.

There’s narrating here. Still a faint echo of “someone” here to explain “what’s happening.”

Let’s bring it all into the now. From here, now:
Is there an experiencer behind the seeing?
Is there a thinker behind the thoughts?
Is there a feeler behind the sensations?

No analysis. Don’t explain. LOOK. See clearly. Is there anything there at all—besides the content itself?

It doesn’t feel like anything. There’s no difference here

This is fine actually. It does not need to be a big bang.

The understanding might be a bit clearer when I can sit in it without distraction

That thought is it. It is the distraction. It is the selfing.

Listen carefully:
You’re not not-seeing because you’re distracted.
You’re not-seeing because you still believe that something needs to happen in the future for it to be clear.

That’s the trap!

Right now, this moment, not later, not after more stillness, not after “clarity”…
Is anything missing?
Is there still a “you” who could get closer?
Or is that just another thought arising, like wind through branches?

I’ve been looking and will continue to.

Ah. You say you’re continuing to look—but who is continuing? What are they hoping to find off somewhere in the future?

What if there were nothing more to look for and there never was? The one who is looking and monitoring this whole exchange IS the illusion.

When I sit and ponder these things I see that there is no one who can decide, have intentions, free will, choice, or control.

You’re saying: “When I think about it, I see there’s no thinker.” See the contradiction?

Stop retreating into thought to confirm the absence of the thinker. :)

Right now, let the next action arise. Let something happen. Let a sound be heard, a sensation felt, a thought appear.
Was there intention behind it? Choice? Control?
Was it done—or did it just happen?

Move your hand.
Any hand. Don’t plan it. Just notice.
Was there a you who decided?
Or did the thought “I’ll move now” arise after the motion had already started?

Trace it slowly.
Can you find the chooser? The controller?
Can you find anything between the arising and the happening?

Much love,
Becca

[MayaDawn]

Hi Becca,

You’re describing the view from the cliff. But have you stepped off?

I want to! But, I don’t know how.
And I see that that is thought speaking, yet I don’t know how to close the seeming gap.

Let’s bring it all into the now. From here, now:
Is there an experiencer behind the seeing?
Is there a thinker behind the thoughts?
Is there a feeler behind the sensations?

“Is there a thinker behind the thoughts?” This popped out when I read it, so I started with this.
No, I could not see a thinker behind the thoughts. What I DID see, though, was that thought IS the thinker. Thought implies a thinker, yet none is actually found. This constant narration and contemplation is both the thought and the thinker. They are not separate.

I can't find a seer or experiencer - just seeing.
No feeler, just sensation.

No analysis. Don’t explain. LOOK. See clearly. Is there anything there at all—besides the content itself?

Besides the content, I can’t find anything. But there is awareness of the content, although it’s not separate from it.

Is anything missing?
Is there still a “you” who could get closer?
Or is that just another thought arising, like wind through branches?

I can’t find anything missing. I don’t even know what I’m supposed to look for. A feeling? A state?
That’s what I feel mind is looking for - - a state.

- Is there still a ‘me’ who could get closer? No, there’s no me, even though it still feels like there is most of the time.
- I’m aware that I can’t get closer to my self.
- All thoughts. All thoughts implying/assuming the separate self. Appearing in the one reality that IS.

You say you’re continuing to look—but who is continuing? What are they hoping to find off somewhere in the future?

That is a great question! Who is continuing…. hmm - I see that continuing to seek and wait only perpetuates the separate self, but I don’t know what else to do, but look, until the seeing is more stable. I know.. Stable for who? Clarity IS… now. Awareness IS now. But, but, but. What are they hoping to find in the future?????

I sat with this for a few minutes because I want to know and it felt like ‘I want peace and no suffering without having to give up the personality.’Then came up, ‘Who would I be without the personality?’
Ahh, it’s fear.

What if there were nothing more to look for and there never was? The one who is looking and monitoring this whole exchange IS the illusion.

What a relief!
I’m beginning to see that more clearly.

You’re saying: “When I think about it, I see there’s no thinker.” See the contradiction?

Stop retreating into thought to confirm the absence of the thinker. :)

I do now, thank you for pointing that out. Oy!

I don’t know how else to do this. I want to be free, but I don’t know how to overcome the fear, the thinking, the selfing. I know… Who wants to be free? Idk anymore. If I am freedom itself, it’s not me, and mind/thought doesn’t seem to want to be free, so I don’t know.

Right now, let the next action arise. Let something happen. Let a sound be heard, a sensation felt, a thought appear.
Was there intention behind it? Choice? Control?
Was it done—or did it just happen?

Move your hand.
Any hand. Don’t plan it. Just notice.
Was there a you who decided?
Or did the thought “I’ll move now” arise after the motion had already started?

Trace it slowly.
Can you find the chooser? The controller?
Can you find anything between the arising and the happening?

There was no intention, choice, or control. It just happened.

- In moving the hand, or arm, no one decided.
- I can’t find the chooser or controller. I can’t find anything between the arising and the happening. -- They appear to be the same thing.


Thank you.

Warmly
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Hello Deborah,

I sat with this for a few minutes because I want to know and it felt like ‘I want peace and no suffering without having to give up the personality.’Then came up, ‘Who would I be without the personality?’
Ahh, it’s fear.

This is a key. Where is this fear? Is it in thought or embodied? If thought, is it true? If embodied, where is it located? What is the center point? Is it stable or moving? Go all the way inside it. Explore it. Does it come and go? How long has it been there? Is it ‘yours’?

That’s what I feel mind is looking for - - a state.

Strip everything: no bliss, no clarity, no silence, no peace. None of that’s needed.

What’s left when all states are seen as passing weather?
No ideas, no feelings, no body sensations—just what’s undeniably present.

I don’t know how else to do this. I want to be free, but I don’t know how to overcome the fear, the thinking, the selfing. I know… Who wants to be free? Idk anymore. If I am freedom itself, it’s not me, and mind/thought doesn’t seem to want to be free, so I don’t know.

No thought is always not free, not here now.

Look at this thought: “I don’t know how else to do this.”
Who is that “I”?
Feel it. Track it. Is it solid? Is it more than a thought appearing here?

In the middle of this noise—what’s actually here?

Just feel the body. The breath. The tension. The wanting. Let it be.
Now—what is watching all this? What is not moving?

Is that afraid?
Does that want freedom?
Or is it just still? Already free?

-Becca

[MayaDawn]

Hi Becca,

Where is this fear? Is it in thought or embodied? If thought, is it true? If embodied, where is it located? What is the center point? Is it stable or moving? Go all the way inside it. Explore it. Does it come and go? How long has it been there? Is it ‘yours’?

Nowhere right now. It was a rush of a sensation that was quickly labeled. No center point; always moving, well, not even - it comes and goes in a fraction of a second. Don’t know how long it’s been there. It’s not mine.

What’s left when all states are seen as passing weather?
No ideas, no feelings, no body sensations—just what’s undeniably present.

Just what is right now.

Look at this thought: “I don’t know how else to do this.”
Who is that “I”?
Feel it. Track it. Is it solid? Is it more than a thought appearing here?

Just a thought.

In the middle of this noise—what’s actually here?

Aware presence.

Just feel the body. The breath. The tension. The wanting. Let it be.
Now—what is watching all this? What is not moving?

Aware presence.

Is that afraid?
Does that want freedom?
Or is it just still? Already free?

It’s not afraid.
It doesn’t want freedom or anything else.
It is aware stillness - already fully present, fully free.


Warmly
Deborah

[graceabounds]

Right now, what’s left? What remains?

Let all narrative drop. No language. No philosophy.
Only raw sensation and sound and seeing.

What are you, without even the label “aware presence”?

Don’t name it. Don’t know it. Just be it. Be what’s already here.

Report from here, not from mind.

-Becca